CoffeeAddict, in Biden: There is a place for Haley supporters in my campaign
CoffeeAddict avatar

[…] “Nikki Haley was willing to speak the truth about Trump: about the chaos that always follows him, about his inability to see right from wrong, about his cowering before Vladimir Putin.”

“Donald Trump made it clear he doesn’t want Nikki Haley’s supporters. I want to be clear: There is a place for them in my campaign,” Biden added.

The president acknowledged significant policy disagreements between his campaign and those who supported Haley, but he pointed to “fundamental issues” like support for NATO and preserving democracy where the two sides could find common ground.

“We all know this is no ordinary election. And the stakes for America couldn’t be higher,” […]

Emphasis is mine.

Her supporters are definitely to the right of Biden on numerous issues (and definitely to the right of this magazine).

But, I think Biden is correct in that his campaign should do what it can to pull them in, because Trump winning a second term will likely result in the end of NATO, a serious reduction in women’s and reproductive rights, increased danger for immigrants and minorities, the total destruction of Palestine, dooming any hope of curtailing the effects of climate change, and the complete overhaul of the US Federal Government to match the Republicans’ Project 2025 vision for the USA.

This is just a short list of all the terrible things that could happen if Trump wins another term. In short, it would just be bad.


We should be converting people on the far right, not moving the Democrat party right to entice Republicans.


Move? The democratic party has been centre-right for a long time.

Two quotes:

"The conservative revolution that Reagan helped usher in gained traction because Reagan's central insight — that the liberal welfare state had grown complacent and overly bureaucratic, with Democratic policymakers more obsessed with slicing the economic pie than with growing the pie — contained a good deal of truth."


”The truth of the matter is that my policies are so mainstream that if I had set the same policies that I had back in the 1980s, I would be considered a moderate Republican.”


Just because someone is on the right doesn't mean they can't move further to the right.

That was the point of their statement, not that they're not right leaning (leadership, at least) to begin with.


The Democratic party is the incredibly wide tent of "pretty much everyone who isn't a batshit crazy far right nutjob and who wants to see government work for the people".

It doesn't have any particular identity. It only has a very loose collection of platform identities. The idea that it maps into any particular point on a political compass is nonsense.

If we want to see coherent issue parties with specific platforms... it won't happen in the political system of the US. At least not so long as conservatism has any kind of social acceptability.

Also, the fact that this post is on /m/neoliberal... hope the irony isn't lost on you.

CoffeeAddict avatar

This is a pretty good assessment.

The only reason AOC, Bernie Sanders, Ilhan Omar, Schumer, Biden, Obama, Harris, Manchin (and I could go on) are part of the Democratic party is because it is a coalition of anyone who recognizes that the Republicans have gone batshit and dangerously crazy.

If they don’t stand together, they will get steamrolled and things will get a lot worse for everyone.


Then Biden went full Zionist pro-genocide and arguably, this very moment, the Democrat party is further right than most modern republicans who just wanna wax their guns and stop abortions. So they are getting steamrolled anyway.

Biden is not presenting a better alternative. He is sidling as close as possible to Trump while saying "you voted for him, I am slightly better, come over here". He shouldnt be slightly better. The democrat candidate for President of the United States should be the polar opposite of Trump. Not the guy who is slightly better (if that) than Trump.


Trump wants Netenyahu to 'finish the job' in Gaza, wants to ban Palestinian refugees, and previously said that West Bank settlement was in accordance with international law. What's happening in Gaza is horrible, but what's been happening in the West Bank is still arguably ethnic cleansing even if it's happened slowly. Trump's a fan. The Biden administration says it's illegal and has sanctioned (violent) settlers. They're also putting a lot of pressure on Israel to stop the war.

No, they're not great, but it's absurd to think the Republicans will be any better or aren't the worse option.

CoffeeAddict avatar

Biden’s official stance is a ceasefire and a two-state solution, not genocide.

Trump’s official stance is genocide. He has stated that Israel needs to “finish the problem” and would happily annihilate the Palestinian people. He has never liked Muslims, and views them as a problem.

I am not the biggest fan of how Biden is handling the situation, but like it or not, he is the only thing standing people Palestine and Trump. Biden is absolutely the better alternative.

theinspectorst avatar

You don't 'convert' the far right. You don't convert the cult. You defeat them. This is about to be a defining moment for American civilisation - do supporters of democracy, decency and due process on left and right work together to defeat Trump's fundamental threat to civilisation, or do they allow it to happen? Everything else is secondary.

It'll be no consolation to know that you didn't dirty your hands by cooperating with pro-democracy conservatives at the point when there's an egotistical fascist back in the White House bent on brutal revenge on the people and system that have opposed his rise. Especially if your refusal to embrace and work with them is what drove them into Trump's arms.

CoffeeAddict, in Eyebrows raised as Viktor Orbán to visit Donald Trump in Florida
CoffeeAddict avatar

Nothing to see here, folks.

Just one fascist Putin-puppet meeting with another fascist Putin-puppet for a nice discussion about fascism and what their boss wants.

In all seriousness though, it doesn’t get anymore blatant than this. Orbán has consistently acted in Putin’s interests, and now he is meeting with Trump.



Orbán has consistently acted in Putin’s interests, and now he is meeting with Trump.

This is a blatant lie.

Orban is also acting in China's interests.


So true. Remember when Trump created his own ministry of truth? Or when Trump tried to make people give up their medical autonomy in order to keep providing food to their families? Or when Trump said the opposing party was an extremist movement and a threat to democracy?

Oh wait. That was all Biden lol.

iAmTheTot, in Live Updates: Trump Prevails in Supreme Court Challenge to His Eligibility
iAmTheTot avatar

I'm honestly flabbergasted by the people, including the justices, who make the argument that Colorado betting allowed to disqualify Trump would lead to a landslide of other states disqualifying other people for partisan reasons.

He was being disqualified for aiding an insurrection! If that would apply to any other candidate, then yes, disqualify them too! That's the fucking point!


So you’re okay with a state like Alabama, Missouri, Arizona, or Florida being allowed to determine whether or not Biden aided an insurrection, right?

iAmTheTot avatar

I'm okay with them trying to explain how he did and then having to prove it in court when it's obviously challenged, sure. I'd be down for them making a fool of themselves.


Trump might be a traitor but he hasn't yet been convicted of anything related to the insurrection.


And assuming a state court of competent jurisdiction ruled that he was engaged in an insurrection and therefore banned from the ballot, you’d be okay with that too, right? Even, say, if that court system was composed of ultra-conservative judges?


The thing is, Trump hasn't been dragged through the courts for insurrection yet either. He's been impeached but let off the hook.

MxM111 avatar

The argument is that only federal court can do that, not state court. Which means there souls be a federal case to do so. Why there is no such case? Or is there one?

BolexForSoup avatar

Yes, Jack Smith's case

IHeartBadCode avatar

The part that’s troublesome is the “giving comfort of aid to the enemy”. Florida was in the process of crafting such an argument to the Florida Supreme Court which, given their friendliness to the current governor, would have removed Biden from Florida. I’m sure Texas would have had something similar related to give aid and lax border policies (at least lax in their eyes).

Without a higher power specifically defining what rises to disqualification status, each State would get to set the bar and lots of States would have set that bar super low.

I mean hell, given Alabama’s Supreme Court recently used the Bible for justification in a ruling. Biden giving aid an comfort to the devil doesn’t seem far fetched for disqualification.

No. This is absolutely something we don’t want States to start getting creative about. If Trump violated Federal law, which we’ve got a Federal law the pretty much says Trump should be disqualified, then it’s the Federal Courts that need to rule that, which the Supreme Court indicated that yeah if Trump is guilty under 18 USC 2383, then he can’t be President.

States being allowed to interpret giving aid to the enemy is very dangerous door to open.

BolexForSoup avatar

I mean ultimately, I just think it’s kind of weird for a state to decide somebody’s guilty while the investigation is ongoing, and I am 100% convinced he started the insurrection. But be hasn’t been convicted of it so like…what? My state can bar me from things because it claims I’m guilty of a federal crime I haven’t been convicted of?

The whole Colorado thing was flimsy and they knew it. I think he totally deserves it. I think Colorado is correct in that they should not allow an insurrectionist on their ballot and I would want Trump removed yesterday. But again, he has not been found guilty of insurrection. So it’s kind of moot.

swiftcasty, in Should we believe Americans when they say the economy is bad?

Ah yes, the vibes are the problem. Those silly, goofy vibes. They’re to blame for:

  • My rent has increased 13% from lease to lease
  • My grocery bill has gone up 33% in the past year
  • I can’t afford to buy a new or used car
  • I suddenly became unable to buy a house in the past six months
  • My credit card interest rates are almost 20%, which is considered to be on the low side
  • My yearly raises at work (5.5%) have not kept up

Others have pointed out problems with the article, and I want to add that economists are inherently biased because they earn a median salary that is twice the national median, meaning they do not personally experience price increases as difficult as the typical American. And finally, the description of society as “performative” makes me think they may have their head up their ass.

CoffeeAddict, in Ohio Votes to Establish Right to Abortion
CoffeeAddict avatar

This is why we vote!

It’s a short article - see the content below:

By Kate Zernike
Nov. 7, 2023, 9:01 p.m. ET

Ohio voters approved a ballot measure enshrining a right to abortion in the State Constitution on Tuesday, according to The Associated Press, continuing a series of wins for abortion-rights groups who have appealed directly to the public as they try to recover from the United States Supreme Court’s reversal of Roe v. Wade.

Issue 1, as the ballot measure is known, had become the country’s most-watched race in the off-year elections. Both parties are looking to gauge whether voter anger over the loss of the federal right to abortion might help Democrats in next year’s presidential and congressional races. National groups on both sides of the debate poured money into Ohio in recent weeks.

The victory in a conservative state is likely to help lift the hopes of abortion-rights groups pushing similar measures next year in red and purple states, including Arizona, South Dakota, Missouri and Florida.

“It’s not up to the government to decide what we do with our bodies,” said Alissa Carver, 26, who lives outside Cincinnati and describes herself as an independent voter. “It’s for us to decide, it’s our experience.”

Wendy Pace, a 52-year-old independent, said she didn’t normally vote in off-year elections, but came out because she wanted to vote “yes” on Issue 1. “I have a teenage daughter and I don’t like having my rights taken away from me,” she said. “I fear that this is just the beginning of rights being taken away, and I do fear for my daughter and what her rights would be going forward.”

DandomRude, in Missouri Republican wants to bring back ‘duels’ avatar

Makes sense if you have no arguments to prove your point of view: “The earth is not flat” - “Sir, that’s going too far. I demand satisfaction” - smack.

downpunxx, in Ohio Votes to Establish Right to Abortion
downpunxx avatar

The choice on abortion is simply a choice between right, and wrong, freedom, or slavery. each time when the people have the choice they chose right and free.

When abortion is on the ballot, Michigan, Kansas, Kentucky, and Montana have voted to ensure abortion access is codified in state law, and now Ohio has risen to join them

Kbin_space_program, in Ohio Votes to Establish Right to Abortion

Fuck the GOP. In particular because they tried to trick the voters of Ohio into banning it in at least two ways


Absolutely. They know they cant win if they play fair. So the lying, cheating, and stealing have intensified. They know they are in the minority and dont give a fuck about the will of the people.

toasteecup, in Happy 100 subscribers, m/Neoliberal!

Yaaaassss a more active version of my favorite shit posting place!

Crawfish, in Discussion Thread
Crawfish avatar

Do y’all think I should be making a new one of these every day? We don’t get much traffic yet, so it doesn’t seem entirely necessary.

Also, do y’all have any ideas of what you’d like to see in our little magazine going forward?


No I don't think so. There is a comment here like every other day. Maybe a weekly one?

theinspectorst avatar

Agree with @FuckFashMods that a weekly discussion thread would be plenty until this place grows up.

I think we just need to get content and discussion going here. At the moment about three of us are 90% of the posts and comments - if we can get that up to (say) 8-10 as a first milestone then this place will feel a lot more active. I've noticed the number of subscribers gradually ticking up (showing 56 at the moment, but I think the count may only display subscribers from the same instance?) - we just need regular content and discussion to convert more of those subscribers to commenters!

I guess we can think also about what distinguishes this place from the content you'd get on general politics subs. I noticed the Vox article on car ownership in the US generated more upvotes than other stuff I've put here (though the margins are hardly big) - maybe we think about what topics dear to neoliberals are poorly-served by other news/politics subs.

Could you promote this magazine on the Mastodon instance? I think Mastodon users can subscribe to a kbin magazine (from what I've seen elsewhere on kbin) so might be we can draw in some friends from there too.

Crawfish avatar

I’ve mentioned this magazine on the mastodon a few times in the past but I’ll try shilling it again, especially now that there are 50+ members.

I definitely appreciate you and the other active members that continue to bring content!
I should be doing more of that myself, honestly. I’ll try to do better going forward.

Maybe some I’ll also put together a simple anonymous poll to get general demographic info we can play off of too.

CoffeeAddict, in Republicans rush to distance from "disaster" Arizona abortion ruling
CoffeeAddict avatar

Basically, abortion is now totally illegal in the US state of Arizona.

Also, the law is from 1864 and provides no exceptions for rape and incest.

Republicans have actually reinstated an archaic law from 160 years ago, which (in my opinion) is a perfect representation of their headspace as a political party.

MaryScofie, in Biden: There is a place for Haley supporters in my campaign
MaryScofie avatar

President Biden's appeal to Nikki Haley's supporters demonstrates his broad vision for America and his commitment to being a president for all. He acknowledges that Haley's supporters want progress on key issues and desire competent, unifying leadership. Biden is delivering steady leadership, creating jobs, lowering costs, strengthening alliances, and protecting rights and democracy. Haley's campaign suspension shows her vision isn't prevailing in the GOP primary, while other contenders push extreme agendas. The Democrats welcome Haley supporters and all Americans to join Biden's coalition to move the nation forward, as the stakes are high in the upcoming election.

dumples, in Biden: There is a place for Haley supporters in my campaign
dumples avatar

Democratic Party is a big tent and should be a big tent like this. Come on over and we can all listen to each other. There's no purity test to get in

theodewere, in Live Updates: Trump Prevails in Supreme Court Challenge to His Eligibility
theodewere avatar

Trump didn't prevail, Federal authority prevailed.. where are all my State's Rights guys now..


I wouldn't say federal authority prevailed either, because they essentially neutered the entire clause by denying that it's self executing (like age or being a natural born citizen). That means even if someone is convicted of an insurectionist act, the federal courts can't touch it, only Congress can. It's a dumb decision.

Neblib, in Discussion thread - March 2024 avatar

quarterly reminder that you can follow and interact with this magazine's threads on Mastodon even though it still has yet to support group actors by following @nl_kbin_booster which simply boosts the threads.

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