frezik,

“You don’t actually read the bible, you just cherry picked some bits out of the atheist meme book” - actual response I’ve gotten when I’ve brought this up.

Zink,

Sneaky little atheistses, always being tricksy to outsmart the omnipotent & omniscient creator and maintainer of existence itself, precious!

Squirrel, (edited )
@Squirrel@thelemmy.club avatar

Funny, the whole thing is supposed to be applicable. They can’t just ignore the parts that fit your terrible atheist agenda. And these points certainly aren’t a matter of ignored context.

I’ve actually had other Christians argue against the message of love preached by Jesus, saying it’s inapplicable here or there. Of course, I can’t be a true Christian if I want equal rights for “the gays,” healthcare for all, or any of the other various far left (for the US) views I hold.

Note: I’m a Christian who firmly supports the separation of church and state, sooooo…

HopFlop,

(To be fair, the Bible doesn’t say you should force other people to do those things, it just says you should do them)

stabby_cicada,

The meme says “force you via taxes”. And Jesus Christ Himself told people to pay their taxes.

RememberTheApollo_,

And prevent anyone from being really rich.

And prevent banks from getting too big.

And be hospitable to refugees.

And a whole lot of other things that Y’all Qaeda don’t want.

Iamthepurpleguysport,

That’s accurate.

StaySquared,

Ha… this is an obligation in Islam. I rather my tax dollars help the needy than help my nation and or other nations bomb nations.

Nom,

this is an obligation in Islam.

Obligation doesn’t mean they’ll ever apply it. They only ever mention such when it’s convenient, to make themselves look like better people. All Abrahamic religions are this way(doesn’t mean any other religion’s any better either). I live in a muslim country, it’s just another tool of the state & the ultra rich to control people.

StaySquared,

Uhm… what. Zakat is one of the pillars of Islam.

There are five key practices that all Muslims are obligated to fulfil throughout their lifetime. These practices are referred to as pillars because they form the foundation of Muslim life. The five pillars of Islam are Shahada, Salah, Zakat, Sawm (fasting), and Hajj. Four categories of people do not pay Zakat: the poor, the indigent, the debt-ridden, and the unfree.

RedAggroBest,

And charity is one of the virtues. Their point is that almost allreligions, and definitely the abrahamic ones, say that charity and altruism are core doctrine. Nobody actually follows through tho unless it’s convenient.

StaySquared,

That’s sad if true. There’s no way to track that data unfortunately.

BakedGoods,

Religious people should be locked up in asylums

Seasoned_Greetings,

Evangelicals should be locked up in asylums. Nothing wrong with being religious if you interpret that by living your best life and helping people.

ILikeBoobies,

“Nothing wrong with being religious as long as it doesn’t impact your life”

Isn’t a good excuse

zalgotext,

That… isn’t what they said

ILikeBoobies,

if you interpret that by living your best life and helping people.

Is “if you’re a good person regardless and ignore the parts I don’t like”

The person who would do that, would do that without religion

zalgotext,

Yeah you’re still missing the point

Seasoned_Greetings,

And if that person finds motivation in the possiblilty of something after death, and that brings a light to their life that they would otherwise succumb to existential dread over? Then they deserve to burn?

ILikeBoobies,

Lol, if they require some promise of reward to behave then they aren’t a good person

Seasoned_Greetings,

That’s not at all what I said. For some people, the thought of oblivion leads to existential dread. It’s a belief in something more that keeps them going.

Are you saying that not being able to handle that makes you a bad person?

ILikeBoobies,

Sounds pretty childish

The sooner they learn to confront reality the sooner they can work on making their reality better

Seems you are depicting religion as a cause for a lack of motivation “nothing matters anyway because things will be better when I’m dead”

Seasoned_Greetings, (edited )

Ok, so the bad person here is you. Got it.

ILikeBoobies,

Think what you want

Seasoned_Greetings, (edited )

Your position in this argument sounds more like religion hurt you and you’re lashing out than anything else.

If you can’t morally allow religion to represent something positive for people, the problem is you, not religion.

Although I’m not religious myself, I’m capable of seeing how it affects positive change in some people. Deciding for them that they are childish/evil/stupid/whatever because you don’t agree with their mode of motivation is frankly a lot more childish and petty than you’re trying to paint them.

Anyway, thanks for showing us that you aren’t a good person. It literally doesn’t matter what you think about the subject.

Later

ICastFist,
@ICastFist@programming.dev avatar

Obviously, he meant Maronite Christianity, which is the only^tm^ true^tm^ christianity^tm^

Lovstuhagen,

… As a Christian, I approve.

The idea that the government should run off of some merciless view that the principles of free market capitalism dictate who eats and who doesn’t is completely bizarre.

I have nothing against capitalist Christians who think that the principles of capitalism are generally fine and that, otherwise, we have an obligation as Christians to feed the poor and it just so happens to not be the role of government, but any explicitly Christian state has to feed the poor.

threeduck,

Huh, I wouldn’t expect to see a Christian on Lemmy.

CRT,
@CRT@lemmy.world avatar

There are dozens of us!

Veraxus,

I don’t consider myself Christian purely because of the word’s connotation, but I am absolutely on board with everything Yeshua taught… including full-blown pre-Marx communism.

TexMexBazooka,

Narrator:

They didn’t

Emmie, (edited )

No, no this is the part of Christianity where we convert heretics. With heavy automatic weaponry

ThatWeirdGuy1001,
@ThatWeirdGuy1001@lemmy.world avatar

“I say the whole world must learn of our peaceful ways.

By force!”

ILikeBoobies,
scutiger,

Oh lord, he’s made of wood.

Kolanaki,
@Kolanaki@yiffit.net avatar

Jesus didn’t use taxes to heal anyone. Why can’t we use divine magic? It still has the benefit of being free for all; but it also works better and faster.

ICastFist,
@ICastFist@programming.dev avatar

Why can’t we use divine magic?

Apparently, there was a balance patch that made all clerics’ gods quit their interference with mortal matters.

MacNCheezus,
@MacNCheezus@lemmy.today avatar

He also didn’t FORCE anyone to give to the poor, he only recommended it.

Pencilnoob,

Well there is the New Testament story of en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ananias_and_Sapphira who God killed in front of everyone for not giving 100% of their money to feed the poor.

MacNCheezus,
@MacNCheezus@lemmy.today avatar

And that’s relevant how? Am I Ananias in your imagination and you’re God who’s putting me to death for omitting the pickle? Or could it be that I am the poor because I carelessly forgot to mention it and you’re witholding grace and mercy from me in the course of your attempts at corrective measures for the sake of Old Testamentarian fire and brimstone punishment?

Come on man, I know it’s difficult for you Germans but at least TRY to smile for once in your life. Just imagine the pickles were always there to begin with, and it’s at least a half decent joke. But whether or you like it or not, it does remain a fact that Germans call a concoction that MAINLY consists of sausage, pickles and mayo a “salad”, and I think that’s kinda funny (at least it is to Americans).

And just to be clear, I’m by no means knocking the dish itself, I myself was a huge enjoyer of it during the time I lived in Germany. I honestly admire the kinda of audacity it takes to make a mixture that largely consists of slices of meat and barely any veggies and have everyone agree to call it a salad. Even in a country as obsessed with meat as America is this is simply totally unheard of.

So please accept my apology if I ruffled your feathers, but you were giving such a great example of German pettiness that I couldn’t resist to roast you for it. And perhaps that’s also an Americanism I picked up during my time here, but that’s what people do with their friends, they pull them through to cocoa as you would call it.

Seasoned_Greetings,

Even in a country as obsessed with meat as America is this is simply totally unheard of.

Never heard of crab salad? Tuna salad? Chicken salad? All of these are mainly meat, lots of mayo, and sparce non-salad vegetables, and all things Americans buy at the supermarket.

MacNCheezus,
@MacNCheezus@lemmy.today avatar

Yes, you are right of course. Although tuna and crab aren’t technically meat, and those salads exist in Germany as well. At least tuna salad definitely does, except it’s generally made with vinaigrette instead of mayo and might have things like bell peppers, tomatoes, or (gasp) actual lettuce in it.

But yes, the chicken salad. That certainly IS a thing (and probably the closest analogue to Fleischsalat that’s available here). My bad. Seems like I can’t help but offend someone, somewhere, even when I’m tried to make amends with others. Please excuse my careless oversight. I just don’t eat that very often because honestly, it’s not even half as good as Fleischsalat.

Pencilnoob,

What in tarnation

I feel like the recipient of some copy-pasta joke.

ILikeBoobies,

The government is going to force all women to have abortions to prove they’ve been faithful

Schadrach,

You mean with a magic potion of dirty water that should not by any mechanism cause an abortion that doubled as a paternity test because God would only cause the abortion if she cheated.

Realistically this probably mostly served to cow men into accepting that their wife’s child is theirs regardless of any suspicions because God said so. There’s a reason being Jewish is matrilineal.

Veraxus, (edited )

Not just dirty… the temple was meticulously maintained, so that “dust” was myrrh, which was used as incense day and night. Not surprisingly, myrrh can cause miscarriage when taken orally.

So what the scripture actually says is “If the husband is jealous, try to induce a miscarriage. If it doesn’t work, well, then it’s God’s will.”

AeonFelis,

Jesus’ version or Roman version?

Annoyed_Crabby,

Obviously spanish version.

Kaboom,

It should be given freely, not because you were forced to. It doesnt mean anything if you were forced.

stabby_cicada,

Is the point of charity to feed the hungry or to let rich people feel good about themselves?

It doesn’t matter to the hungry person if the food they eat was paid for by taxes or voluntary charity. Food is food.

Kaboom,

Ultimately to help people, but if you’re forced to, that doesnt mean anything. It just means you figured paying taxes was easier than going to jail

Stardust,

Uhh it means the hungry person is no longer hungry. That's pretty meaningful to the hungry person.
If you mean it doesn't mean anything to you, then that's your deal.

stabby_cicada,

It doesn’t mean anything to whom?

Cause I bet it means a lot to the people who need food and shelter.

forensic_potato,
@forensic_potato@lemmy.world avatar

I’m not so sure. That smells a bit of entitlement if I’m being honest. If an unhoused person or a single parent in a food insecure household get food assistance/school meals for example, I’m sure the help meant a lot to them. It doesn’t seem like it means anything to you because you have the luxury/security to worry about ethics and other more abstract things. But if you’re hungry, food is food. Help is help. And if you were forced to give the food…those people still get to eat at the end of it all

Cowbee,
@Cowbee@lemmy.ml avatar

TIL feeding the poor doesn’t matter if the vibes of the wealthy are off.

Sotuanduso,

It’s still meaningful because it is helping people, but it’s probably not going to count in your favor spiritually. Unless you’re supporting getting the system set up or keeping it in place I guess.

Kaboom,

Exactly! Paying taxes doesnt make you a good christian, helping people voluntarily does.

captainlezbian,

It absolutely means something, it means the poor suffer less. That’s the point, not your moral absolution

karashta,

Acts 4:34-36

“For there was not a needy person among them, for all who were owners of land or houses would sell them and bring the proceeds of the sales and lay them at the apostles’ feet, and they would be distributed to each as any had need.”

They mean this Christianity, right???

Daft_ish, (edited )

Somehow that translates to you have to give 10% of your income to Pastor Brian. Any other form of charity is great but you should still give Pastor Brian his 10% because he’s doing a lot by telling you to give him 10% of your income.

doingthestuff,

The vast majority of pastors are volunteers or bi-vocational. And yes there are abuses. But also lots of them giving their time and resources to care for the under-resourced. My church’'s sr. pastor is going from full time to bi-vocational this year because inflation hit the church and his family. But our church distributed 12 million pounds of food since covid

pop,

The vast majority of religious workers are akin to workers at a scam call centre. Selling you “thoughts and prayers” and guilt tripping you to give them money. Basically fooling you into something non-existent.

Scammers also give a lot of their time and resource and work full-time. I guess they deserve a living wage too, huh?

The only thing they need is run a pretend-charity, community service and food drives?

You sure seem to like your make-belief system where you think they are net-positive to the community. I’m sure a you would feel the same about scam call centres, if only they could upgrade their PR with some charity. All that without all the violent history.

But oh no, they’re brown people in a third-world shithole… so that’s a pass. I love my own pretend-charity cult with supreme people.

maniii,

There is definitely predation on 3rd-world countries by the centralized religions.

“Join us and we can get you + converted family jobs.We can get you loans. You will get money from us.”

Then 1 year later … " You need to pay back what we did for you … pay up every week"

“Did you just try to runaway ? We will now track your every move… pay us or ELSE!”

Daft_ish, (edited )

Ok? So now he’s earned 10% of my income?

doingthestuff,

The tithe doesn’t go to a pastor, it goes to fund the whole ministry. People working full time deserve a living wage, he’s no different. Most Christians don’t tithe anyway, it’s usually 15% of the people giving 85% of the funds.

Our church distributed those millions of pounds of food on a $350k total budget each year which includes still paying mortgage on an under-maintained property. The total payroll and benefits for two full time and four part time staff was $165k last year. I don’t think they’re robbing people who chose to support that.

Daft_ish, (edited )

I really not sure your point. Does acts tell you that God requires you to give 10% of your income?

Your church sounds like an outlier. Many of the church I’ve seen have been seeded by larger churches and ministries which they are then indebted to. Most of which would not be so forthcoming with their financials.

Thats not the question though. Why is it a church would say that tithing 10% of your income is a requirement?

Zorque,

Because it's a tradition from the old testament that some (by no means all) churches use. It's nowhere near as universal as your own anecdotal references seem to imply.

Daft_ish,

Yours is the only ethical church.

Sotuanduso, (edited )

Maybe try researching church finances instead of going by the assumption that they’re greedy because they’re asking for money and look like your enemy.

EDIT: Sorry, I forgot it’s a not-good to ask someone to do research without demonstrating my own. Unfortunately, I have other things I should be doing than research right now.

Daft_ish,

Lol.

blanketswithsmallpox,

X-ist dog whistles are fun huh?

cerement,
@cerement@slrpnk.net avatar

“From each according to his ability, to each according to his need.” – sounds familiar 🤔

captainlezbian,

Oh yeah there’s a reason a chunk of early communists were Christian pacifists

Dagwood222, (edited )

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorothy_Day

edit =sorry about the mix up

Skullgrid,
@Skullgrid@lemmy.world avatar

here’s the actual link :

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dorothy_Day

Dagwood222,

Silly me.

cerement,
@cerement@slrpnk.net avatar
Dagwood222,

Thanks for adding those links.

It’s annoying how many people are ignorant of the history of the Left.

GoodEye8,

Christian communism is a theological view (with some historic precedent) that believes Jesus and his apostles were the first communists, so the overlap is clearly there.

deaf_fish,

This is funny and it makes me feel good. But you know as well as I do, that it doesn’t matter what any religious text says is right or wrong. Fascism and capitalism will take control and health care will be a personal problem.

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