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maegul, in All Star Trek fans now have a home on Lemmy World avatar

So, not that parallel communities are at all bad, I feel like it’s warranted to ask why this community when we’ve already got the dedicated startrek instance and its communities:, such as !startrek and !risa?

At this point in the growth of lemmy, I feel like unneeded duplication without any reason doesn’t really help things. Should a community die we can always start new ones where ever we want. But splitting things and making it harder for users to navigate the space probably isn’t a good idea unless there’s something you want to achieve with this community?


It might have something to do with no longer being able to participate:

YoBuckStopsHere, avatar


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  • klieg2323, avatar
    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    As soon as I realized it was the reddit mods I knew there would be a need for an alternative community. This isn’t reddit where they can ban rivals communities.

    sabreW4K3, avatar

    That’s a lot of homophobia there

    samus12345, avatar

    Oh, so it’s just another “I got banned for being an asshole so I’m making my own community with blackjack and hookers!” situation.

    Mr_Buscemi, avatar

    The open mod logs are fucking amazing.

    This is the funniest shit I’ve seen today lmao.

    You see that OP had started the whole argument too? They brought up Discovery in a Strange New worlds episode discussion. Said the episode was the anti of what the discovery creator wanted and then stated all the bigotry shit when asked to explain.

    samus12345, avatar

    Yup, I actually remembered those comments from when I was on that thread the other day. Didn’t pay attention to the username, of course, so I didn’t know he was OP until it was pointed out here. These toxic Star Trek “fans” are so annoying. I don’t like Discovery, either, but it has nothing to do with the cast and everything to do with the writing.

    Mr_Buscemi, avatar

    The moment somebody complains that a current star trek is too progressive I just have to laugh.

    From the very beginning the show has been progressive in social issues!

    To make a whole new sub because you got banned for complaining a ST show was too progressive is just fucking priceless. OP is straight up living the bender meme and doesn’t even realize it.

    I gotta say again I love the public mod logs. I feel so much catharsis from this after once being a target of /r/watchRedditDie. A user lied and said I banned him for posting a picture of Snoo pissing on the flag. I had actually banned him for posting a picture of hornets coming out of a penis.

    samus12345, avatar

    From the very beginning the show has been progressive in social issues!

    Absolutely. I have to conclude that these “fans” never actually got the message of the show from the beginning. Is there plenty to criticize Nutrek for in comparison to the older shows? Certainly. But being “woke” isn’t one of them.

    Mr_Buscemi, avatar

    Damn I love Lemmy lol.

    The open modlog is great.

    OP getting banned seems sorta justified if that log is what caused it. Stating that the show(ST Discovery) they have issues with was progressive and then commenting how it made every non-gay white character evil or negative is really just the type of shit I used to see on Twitter when the show was first coming out.

    That’s not even mentioning that the whole reason the comment chain started was because OP brought up his hate for the creator of Discovery in a discussion for a Strange New World episode. There was no need for the whole conversation to begin besides OP wanting to cause an argument. Mods didn’t want to deal with that shit.

    Datas_Cat_Spot, avatar

    I say the more the merrier. I’m still going to use, but it’s good to have a presence on other instances to avoid becoming reddit.

    maegul, (edited ) avatar

    Yea like I said, not against parallel communities at all. Just curious what the motivation is here, and also feel that right now, just as the migration wave has stopped, it might be a good time to sort of “take care of the space” where we can.

    Though I do hope user defined multi-communities come at some point to help out smaller communities. It’s so easy to lose track of them as a user.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    When the final season of STD premieres it will become clear.

    maegul, avatar

    In many ways I hope not.

    On the whole, I really don’t like Discovery. But we all know what the show is and isn’t and now it’s cancelled with Trek moving on in other forms. There isn’t really anything to talk about any more apart from some insightful retrospectives. A community full of people critiquing a show for being what we all know it is in its fifth season doesn’t sound like a necessarily healthy thing TBH.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    The Academy show and Section 31 series are ripe for controversy.

    Luci, avatar

    !risa is worth a sub!


    I am am uppity vegetable and I approve this message!

    Datas_Cat_Spot, avatar

    Get out of the holodeck, Lt Broccoli


    Literally one of my favorite lemmy communities.


    Yeah, at this point feel like it’d be more helpful for some communities to exist bu restrict posts and redirect people to instances that have an established community so serving as a guide on where to go.

    Much like how back on reddit there’d be subs that only served that purpose of redirecting users to the main community despite having millions of active users.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    We don’t want a clone of reddit which was very restricted. We know LW is well funded, the other one is not.


    Those two sentences seem completely unrelated

    sabreW4K3, avatar

    Lemmy World also has a lot of downtime. It seems an odd decision to host your community there, but good luck.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    DDOS attacks happen.


    Not wanting to copy every aspect of Reddit is fine, and kind of the point of Lemmy even. But pretending like everything that happens in Reddit sucks just because it’s on Reddit reeks of sour grapes.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    Paramount controlling what is said on forums doesn’t sit well with everyone. What they did on reddit will not occur here.

    PeleSpirit, (edited )

    Because people can have their own community, just like on reddit? The only reason on reddit that you saw those redirects was because people got that community name and did it themselves. In a small amount of cases, it might have been for the standard communities that reddit set up in the beginning too, but there should be very few like that.


    Because people can have their own community, just like on reddit?

    Never was questioning that. Was more a comment on the small size of the userbase, and how it’s led to some created communities that ended up dead fast as some communities haven’t had the numbers to sustain activity. By all means there’s nothing preventing people from doing what they want.

    Just a observation pondering about what can be done to help activity of created communities taking into consideration the decentralized nature of the fediverse.


    I see someone said lower down that the one you’re talking about is run by controlling people from reddit, I see options as better to combat that sort of thing.


    Like I said there is nothing keeping people from making communities.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    It’s really poorly managed and run by the same people who run the reddit subreddit. They don’t have a good track record on moderating and frequently ban anyone posting criticism.

    Unlike that site, we accept all Star Trek fans, both old and Nu.


    It seems well managed to me. I get that one may not like their decisions, but I don't think that's the same thing as being poorly managed.

    And, like, it's their website. They can choose what content they host there however they like. And I welcome a space where people who don't want to abide by their choices can keep doing their thing.

    klieg2323, avatar

    I would say it is poorly managed for the fact that their rules and community standards are not clearly outlined. They ban for reasons not listed in their rules. For a community this large, there needs to be some sort of outlined expectations. It’s fairly apparent they are more interested in moderating the subreddit and this Lemmy community is downstream of that in their minds. Expecting us to just magically know the subreddit standards without being listed out is textbook bad management.

    maegul, avatar

    Any more detail on that? I hang out there and haven’t had or seen any trouble.

    I’ve been critical and gotten pushback from the admin (I was criticising Discovery, as you might imagine), but so long as I could explain my opinion and do so politely there didn’t seem to be an issue at all, and I don’t think that’s an unreasonable standard.

    If a different moderation policy is what you’re offering here … could you elaborate on that?

    klieg2323, avatar

    This has been going on for some time and trying to be kept quiet by the mods/admins of that instance

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    It’s the same mods that run the reddit subreddit. That says all you need to know.


    The real problem is that there aren’t any good tools for users to deal with this. As a user, I wish I could just join some kind of meta community that aggregates content from multiple communities, instead of having to manually track down and join all the random star trek instances on the fediverse.

    Having a lot of communities for the same topic is ultimately good, but the user experience needs to be good too.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    Which is our goal. We want a rich and vibrant Star Trek community. One that isn’t restricted to Paramount approval.

    maegul, avatar

    One that isn’t restricted to Paramount approval.

    Wait … what? You think (I’m guessing) is subject to Paramount’s whims or astroturfing? Where does that come from?

    I’m also guessing part of the idea of this community is to be more openly critical like the “free people, we don’t bend the knee” sort of sub-reddit? Which is fine … just trying to get a feel here and I think being open and clear is good.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    When STD releases it will be very obvious. Just watch their modlog as they ban anyone critical of the series. Unlike reddit they can’t hide their actions on lemmy.


    I’m getting the impression that you were banned from their community for something you posted, and decided to start your own community with blackjack and hookers in response.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    The banned me after I started this community apparently.

    maegul, avatar

    Having a lot of communities for the same topic is ultimately good, but the user experience needs to be good too.

    Yea, and we’re in a moment right now where making a new parallel community can actually disrupt the user experience, IMO.

    Though, to be clear, it would be good if some features came to make it easier to participate and keep up with multiple parallel communities.

    klieg2323, avatar

    The mods on are the same ones from reddit and care little about transparency or actually hosting a star trek community that fosters open discussion. They are frequently banning usersthat voice opinions that don’t break any rules except mod opinion.

    This has been going on for some time and is the perfect use case for why decentralizing common discussion topics is a feature, not a bug, of the fediverse/lemmy

    maegul, avatar

    I mean, I read the article you linked to (and wrote?), and it wasn’t really substantive, so I’m not sure moderating it was particularly egregious. I liked talking about the history of nu-trek production and what people have been involved at what times … that’s interesting stuff! But most of the opinions in the article were, IMO, crude, shallow and unsubstantiated TBH.

    Still, I think it’s been made clear … this community will be about fostering a more openly critical and opinionated space … that’s cool … go for it. It might be nice to explain that in the sidebar or something if it hasn’t already.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    That is part but not all. We are fostering a true Star Trek community that welcomes all Star Trek fans. It’s something the larger Star Trek community has been longing for but it has not been available until now. If you want to explore all of what Star Trek has to offer, our community strives to spotlight it. We are inclusive and not restrictive. As long as you are respectful toward community members your subscription is welcomed.

    klieg2323, avatar

    The com at the time was dominated by discussion of the Prodigy cancellation, so it was a relevant topic and not being overly critical for the sake of being overly critical. It presented an opinion of the cancelation that wasnt predicting doom and gloom for the franchise like the mod line being pushed at the time.

    Even if it isn’t substantial, why isn’t there a list of blocked domains? Or a rule about it? It could have spurred a discussion in the comments, what makes a community forum like this so special. The point is it didn’t violate any community standards. Then when I tried to open a discussion about it to try and refine the rules/community standards moving forward (early days of reddit emigration) I was permabanned for starting drama.

    I’m not looking for a com where everyone is super critical. I am looking for one where mods are acting as petty little tyrants banning well meaning contributors because they don’t have the exact same opinion on certain things as they do.

    The mods are more interested in the reddit community and it shows. It’s clear Lemmy is downstream of reddit to them.

    YoBuckStopsHere, avatar

    Which our community is lemmy centric and will be nurtured into a thriving community of Star Trek fans.

    beefcat, avatar

    My experience with the /r/startrek mods is that while they aren’t super transparent, their actions are usually justified.

    A lot of people who get banned for “the wrong opinions” aren’t banned for their opinion, they are banned fro their aggressive behavior. Some people want a space where they can be loud and angry, and those mods don’t want to provide that space. I’m fine with that. I don’t like communities where I log in and the top posts are always people loudly making the same complaints day in and day out. Plenty of negative opinions and discussion were allowed on /r/startrek, as long as it was kept civil and constructive.

    Just a few weeks ago we ran into this on tildes, a site not even dedicated to star trek. We had someone complaining about the /r/startrek mods, then going on to post really angry yet lazy comments about Star Trek that do not fit the Tildes community guidelines. They were asked to straighten up. It’s not about the opinions, it’s about the behavior.

    shnizmuffin, in Hey everyone, check out Police Supporters Of Lemmy, pro-cop lemmy space where we post funny cop memes, wholesome cop moments, and cops being heroes. avatar

    Was /c/bootlickers taken already?


    Are you implying that supporting your local police is bootlicking?


    If the boot fits…



    DharmaCurious, avatar

    No, licking boots can have a fun kink angle. Supporting the cops is just being a shit person.


    What if I get sexually aroused watching cops arrest criminals?


    Without hesitation, yes.


    OP is almost certainly the same troll that’s done this on like 4-5 different accounts already.



    swan, in I created !fucknfts - since no one's making a community to piss/diss/shit on NFTs yet

    Why would I want to join a sub for something I don’t like? I want positivity in my life, not hate

    Draegur, in Low Sodium Starfield

    I heard that Starfield was low sodium by default.

    'cause it’s BLAND


    Virkkunen avatar

    Look buddy you can shove this boost up that place

    (it was a really good joke please don't hate me)


    (thank you for engaging my attempt at humor with patience, grace, and charitability 💜 I actually don’t have anything against starfield either, i just saw an opportunity to wisecrack and took it)


    This has been 90% of my playthrough with starfield so far

    stebo02, in Trying to revive r/aaaaaaacccccccce here on fediverse. Come visit us if you are Asexual and/or Aromantic, or just love our memes and humor. avatar
    Seigest, avatar

    Thank you

    demesisx, in I created !fucknfts - since no one's making a community to piss/diss/shit on NFTs yet avatar

    Saying “fuck nft’s!” is like saying “fuck UUID’s!”.

    They’re literally an everyday part of software engineering on decentralized protocols. They got a bad rap with tech-illiterate people because of moonboi hype but they’ll ALWAYS be a part of decentralized software just like any other type of data created for specific uses.

    Cat avatar

    What this guy said. All the JPGs started as a proof of concept/example. That wasn't the end goal!


    Think of an NFT not being the item itself, but a receipt

    Some people are gonna be so mad they paid a million bucks for a receipt.


    ^ The only person in this thread who actually knows what NFTs are


    I made NFTs by accident back before they were a thing lol


    There are dozens of us!


    So this is what I’ve never heard, is when have nfts actually been used? Like it’s too inefficient/expensive to store large amounts of data, so what is it good for?

    dismalnow avatar

    Proof of ownership and/or identity. It doesn't need to hold more data than that.


    All an NFT is, is a way to prove ownership of a digital good. Think of an NFT not being the item itself, but a receipt that you can use to prove you own said item. You’re probably only familiar with this concept being applied to images, but that’s just one application.

    NFTs function very similarly to cryptocurrency with one notable exception, they are not fungible. If we both have a bitcoin and decide to trade them, we both end up with what we started because bitcoins (much like any currency) are fungible. NFTs represent unique items, so they can’t all be treated as equals. That’s all an NFT is at its core, a digital proof of ownership of an item that is unique.

    This is my go to example for an alternative use case for NFTs:

    You know how Ticketmaster sucks right? Imagine if instead of buying tickets through TicketMaster you bought them directly from artists/venues as an NFT. At the gate you can show that you have the NFT in your wallet which proves that you own the ticket. Instead of Ticketmaster taking a massive cut, you pay a (comparatively) much smaller fee to the decentralized network that processed your transaction, and the entirety of the price of the ticket goes to the venue/artist.

    I find that people frequently hate on NFTs because they don’t understand how truly generalized of a concept it is. There are so many ways this technology could be applied, but it’s so new! It takes time for people to conceptualize, develop, and implement this stuff. And with decentralization at the heart, it usually has to happen without a major corporation backing development. So be patient, have an open mind, and know that even I think bored ape NFTs are dumb as fuck

    Source: ex /r/CryptoCurrency mod 😛 Happy to chat more about it if you’re curious!


    Why can’t I buy that ticket directly from the artist/venue? Why do I need the receipt?



    All the people defending NFTs are ignoring the problem that they are still a very inefficient way to handle the proposed usecases.


    Ok, you are now ready to destroy ticketmaster. Following you for cheap tickets.

    disasterpiece, (edited )

    Tickets and receipts are interchangeable. It is an item that shows proof of ownership.

    Artists and venues are not capable of building their own ticketing and distribution platforms, which is why companies like Ticketmaster exist in the first place and come with exorbitant fees.

    I, as an individual with no funding whatsoever, can create NFTs that could act as tickets to an event while guaranteeing that the tickets can’t be forged.

    I honestly do not see how it’s inefficient. The cost is incredibly low. The network almost all NFTs use (Ethereum) has reduced its energy consumption by 99.99% since switching to PoW. From an end-user perspective it would be no different than purchasing a ticket from any other digital storefront. Paying $25 in fees on a $50 ticket is inefficient. Every venue building their own ticketing system is inefficient.

    I feel like so many people think I’m some crypto maximalist when I talk about how NFTs are not entirely stupid. NFTs are such a general idea it makes no sense to say that they have no valid use cases unless you believe that all decentralized networks (including the fediverse) are dumb.


    It is the ticket. Tickets don’t really exist. Even before the Internet and digital technology, what we called a “ticket” (a slip of paper that you showed to get in) was in reality just a receipt/proof of purchase. “Ticket” and “receipt” are 100% synonymous.

    disasterpiece, (edited )

    As another user said, the NFT is the ticket. A ticket is basically a receipt when you think about it, which is why it makes sense as a use case. It shows that you have purchased a unique item (the seat) and grants you access to it.

    The artist/venue could make a ticket independently and without NFTs. They would then have to make them in a way that couldn’t be forged, and would have to create a distribution system. None of that is simple for an independent artist/venue to implement. By using an NFT all of that is handled by the decentralized network.

    Again, that was simply an example to help demonstrate how NFTs have more use cases than just a picture of a monkey


    How about a digital ticket? A QR code to be presented on my phone that I got via email? That seems very feasible. I still don’t see what advantage an NFT would have here. Seriously asking because I’ve been confused for the last few years and nobody is explaining in a way that makes sense to me.

    I’m generally not aware of many cases of ownership of anything being in question, so many in fact that we need an entirely new way of dealing with them. Also look at how many monkey pictures have been straight up stolen with, apparently, no way to prove that they were stolen, because stuff can’t be deleted on the blockchain.

    disasterpiece, (edited )

    A QR code is a link. Who hosts the site? Who is going to pay for the infrastructure, let alone the engineer to set it up? An email has the same problem, what mail server is going to send the email? How do you ensure someone can’t duplicate a ticket? You can’t just make that out of thin air. These systems cost money to create and implement, which is not approachable for individual artists and venues. An NFT takes care of all of that and does it very well at very low cost. Not to mention, the lack of a middle man means all money (besides a small fee to operate on the decentralized network) goes directly to the artists/venue)

    I disagree that being able to prove ownership is not a common use case. NFTs aren’t useful in every situation, but when proof of ownership is involved, NFTs are relevant.

    Another example of this could be a digital license. Say that you purchased a lifetime license to a piece of software (maybe even a game). You could sell/trade the license to another person on your own terms. I really like this idea because we don’t really “own” any digital goods we purchase now days. If you have a physical game you can sell it to a friend, why not the same for digital ones?

    And yes, while they can be stolen, that is not the security they provide. Anything can be stolen. NFTs can’t be forged.

    Also want to say thank you for actually asking a question and not just trying to dunk on the whole concept!


    All crypto starts as a horribly inefficient, slow, expensive technology that gets worse the more people touch it.

    insomniac_lemon avatar

    Does "fuck auctioning off digital media (particularly procedurally-generated .jpg files)" make it more clear? Screw artificial scarcity? Ignore/de-value digital real-estate?

    demesisx, avatar

    I mean, of course procedurally-generated jpg files are worthless bullshit. I’m a serious crypto aficionado and I never once bought a single NFT because I knew they were just images that anyone could view.

    NFT’s, as you’re describing them here, were just a money-laundering scheme. But that’s not what NFT’s actually are. They’re a representation in a system that something is 100% unique (or part of a limited quantity). Since software engineering’s entire purpose is to model real-life in software, this concept was an absolute inevitability.

    The story: someone generated a bored ape then sold it to themself for a 1,000,000% profit in an attempt to launder the ETH that person gained through illicit means in the shitcoin trades. It’s a tale as old as currency itsself: Beanie babies, trading cards, collectible art, collectibles in general. People are degenerate gamblers but NFT’s are actually an innocent technology co-opted by moonbois. Same deal with crypto in general. Greedy people ruin the reputation of anything they touch (or trade rabidly in this case).

    cloudless, (edited ) in BestOf Community created to represent the Fediverse. As the fediverse expands, the best content may become dispersed. This community will collect the most insightful posts and comments found on the Fediverse. avatar

    Direct link to the kbin community (sorry I refuse to use the term "magazine"):



    iAmTheTot avatar

    I like magazine, what's wrong with it?

    cloudless, avatar

    A magazine is predominantly a one-way communication between the publisher and its readers, it is a periodical publication.

    What we are using now (kbin/lemmy) are fully interactive, not passive consumption like reading a magazine. We are constantly adding and updating content instead of being periodic.

    The term "magazine" seems to emphasize more on reading the articles.

    I prefer "community" which puts more focus on people with common interests.

    patchw3rk avatar

    @cloudless Thanks cloudless!

    gwak, in a community for anti-authoritarian leftist firearms enthusiasts

    you might find a podcast home at Behind The Bastards

    phthalocyanin, avatar

    love btb.

    I would also recommend

    "it could happen here"

    "cool people who did cool stuff"

    "live like the world is dying"

    jeremy_sylvis, avatar

    Poor prole's almanac is also pretty great.

    Nomecks, in Lemmy community for pro-Israel lemmings

    I’m pro-1967 borders Israel.

    cosmic_slate, in HailCorporate: Call Out Corporate Astroturfing on Lemmy avatar


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  • DarkNightoftheSoul,

    No, there’s definitely some infrequent advertising on lemmy. I block it (and frequently any community that contains it) or I’d point you at two or three examples I’ve seen in my time here.


    It already is a toxic witch-hunt here. Try posting that you like an Apple product or that you don’t like Linux or Android and you’ll immediately get called a shill. Try it! It’s fun!

    BolexForSoup avatar

    Seriously hail corporate was just a sub people tagged whenever they didn’t like what someone said on Reddit.

    Fizz, avatar

    If you get downvoted on lemmy you don’t get a 10min timeout and karma reduction like on reddit. So you may as well say what you want and wear the downvotes proud.


    The app I use doesn’t even LET me downvote, so hah!


    then use a different app!?

    BolexForSoup avatar

    Downvotes aren’t good for communities anywhere, because they always become a dislike button.


    Oh I do. Downvotes don’t matter at all on Lemmy. It’s just annoying because some people think they do and they think if they get upvotes that it means they’re right.


    If they don’t matter currently for moderation I have to imagine they’ll be part of a moderation toolkit eventually. Leveraging community voting to detect spam would be decently effective, especially for fresh accounts.


    Yeah, but reddit automatically bans you for a few minutes in a specific community once you get enough downvotes. The more you get, the longer it takes to reply to people. So any opinion that’s truly unpopular (i.e. not “I like cats better than dogs”) will get you to post less, with toxic people throwing their 3 cents in, calling you names, and you can’t respond at all since you are limited to a comment every 20 mins.

    I dobt lemmy would implement autobanning like that.

    demesisx, avatar


    RobotToaster, avatar

    Sounds like something a shill would say



    Shit… busted.

    Chozo avatar

    Don't you dare tell anybody here that you use Chrome and that you like it.

    shalafi, (edited )

    The very next post I was reading:

    (-15 at time of posting)


    I use Chrome exclusively because Firefox is a broken resource hog.


    Seriously? Have you missed the memes that Chrome will eat your memory? They were everywhere for a while.


    No, I didn’t miss any of those lies.


    I’ve never understood why people gush over Linux as a windows replacement. Why yes having to manually search for drivers for every product known to man and not being able to run even a fraction of what is on steam sounds like a fantastic time!


    You can run most games on Linux, you just have to enable proton, the steam deck uses a custom version of Linux by default, so at minimum anything marked as playable will work on Linux.
    Also I never had to deal with drivers at all when setting up linux, but I'm not sure if that's normal, I've only used Linux mint, which was pretty easy to set up.


    I work for a telecommunications company and we obviously sell mobile phones as well as our own brand of routers and repeaters. Here in Germany, there is no obligation to use anything your provider gives you, so ppl are legitimately free to use whatever modem/router they want. Our's is plenty enough for everyone who just wants a thing that sits in the corner and is never interacted with. Hell, It even has VPN via Wireguard and dynamic DNS and a little display. Are there more sophisticated routers out there? Hell yes. Yet, whenever my noob friends or family ask me for advice and I go "just by the one we're offering and be done with it", they call me a shill.

    So... Why do you ask if you don't want to hear the response and why the hell would I sell you something I know doesn't fit your needs when you'd come to me with your complaints?!


    Jesse… what the fuck are you talking about?


    That people call me a shill for recommending the stuff from the company I work for which I only recommend because
    A) I know it so I can help them with their problems and
    b) I got it cheaper, so I tried it and I know that it's alright

    But people will first ask me "because I work at a Telco" and then not believe me because "of course you'd say that, you work at a Telco".

    I was adding a personal anecdote to the argument you made that people calling out "shills" often depends on if they share your opinion or not.


    Got it. I think we’re specifically talking about Lemmy, though, and online communities where people don’t even know your identity. Your anecdote just makes me think your family is crazy. They know you and still call you a shill? That’s nuts.

    JustEnoughDucks, avatar

    Apple legitimately makes super solid hardware. Their Apple watch heart rate accuracy is second only to chest straps and has a ton of very useful features. It is pretty much the best as far as integration, a “health watch” and haptics.

    Their phones and laptops have some beautiful hardware design too.

    Their business side just sucks donkey cock is all. But google is just as bad as Apple so potato potahto. Nobody should fanboy when every choice is shit lol


    Well that’s the point. Linux, Firefox, custom Android ROMs - they’re not corporate owned proprietary software, they’re FOSS. And they’re what you should use.


    Now you’re getting it!

    Begins whistling the start of a musical number

    c0mbatbag3l, avatar

    Depends, if you mean for the average user then it’s good, but still overpriced as hell, and you have to deal with the Apple philosophy of “we did the thinking for you, if you dislike our choices it’s not matter of preference, you’re just wrong” no matter what.

    Enterprise use cases you might as well pitch your Apple products in the trash, they won’t work and you’ll spend more time figuring out which USB-C Thunderbolt to 10G SR optical fiber converter actually works than you will getting productivity done.

    JustEnoughDucks, avatar

    No, pricing is the side of Apple’s business that is absolute shit. If you look at the PCBs, they are usually very well designed with proper shielding, high-quality components, and good layout. Apple Silicon is one of the world’s best silicon design orgs.

    Most of what you describes is quite literally their business and aesthetic design choices that have little or nothing to do with the hardware. I agree that all of those are shit and that’s why I would never buy it. The only bad hardware they have are marketing/business choices (i.e. no sd card to sell higher NVM models, lightning to vendor-lock customers, dongle hell to sell more dongles, etc…)

    Though indeed the dongle situation is really fucking stupid also.

    cosmic_slate, avatar


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  • dpkonofa,

    Nope. I already ticked those boxes. My prize was a punch in the face from a random Lemmy zealot. Better luck next time.


    this is a very naive guess…

    BolexForSoup avatar

    Except it’s exactly what we saw on Reddit all the damn time. It felt like every comment someone didn’t like that even remotely involved a brand/product was responded to with “/r/hailcorporate.” God forbid you mention a brand that is particularly disliked on forums like Apple.

    It was a cudgel for arguments first and a sub for actually finding corporate astroturfing second. Plus it encourages pitchforks/brigading.

    It’s a net negative.

    demesisx, avatar

    It sounds like you want to help moderate it. I welcome some help, seeing the issues you raised. I’m a pretty hands-off mod but your description does make me want to get some mod help. I’d hate to have to decide what is astroturfing and what isn’t using modding actions

    Ps. it doesn’t really matter anyway. Anyone can say whatever they want and post whatever they think is astroturfing. I am not going to be too heavy handed. People who are accused wrongly of being astroturfers can do what they do now move on with their lives and continue as they were.

    BolexForSoup avatar

    People who are accused wrongly of being astroturfers can do what they do now move on with their lives and continue as they were.

    That's a terrible policy.


    id like to help mod… but the original hailcorporate wasn’t just about astroturfing…

    /r/HailCorporate is to document times when people act as unwitting advertisers for a product or a brand with an aim towards raising awareness of the pervasive nature of commercialism in our society and culture. We have strict “Don’t be a jerk” rules that are enforced with immediate banning for violating the rules.

    basically anytime people drop brand names, they’re licking the corporate boots…

    demesisx, avatar

    I literally copy pasted the description in the sidebar into my community’s sidebar. I left out the banning part because this is Lemmy and I personally don’t believe in banning people (unless it is just absolute open and shut case of bigotry).

    BolexForSoup avatar

    If you aren’t willing to ban people then you shouldn’t be a moderator. I’m serious man. You will lose control of the community before you know it. There are so many ways for people to cause problems in your community without ever uttering a racial slur directly.

    That’s the kind of policy that trolls and bad actors love to abuse. They hide behind the “letter of the law” with no intention of following the community rules in any meaningful sense. You’re basically throwing up a big sign that says “you can be as disruptive as you want so long as you do it in the following ways that give you even the slightest bit of plausible deniability.”

    IHeartBadCode avatar

    basically anytime people drop brand names, they’re licking the corporate boots

    I think that's a bit extreme. I think there might be several levels between licking boots and seeing a decent product. But that's just my two cents.



    even when someone sincerely enjoys a thing and talks about it, it’s impossible to tell the difference between that and a shill…
    on top of that vote manipulation is a thing, and a genuine review can be buried or promoted to the top by robot jocks…
    sometimes it feels worth it… like my Weldwood contact cement…
    ive tried so many adhesives and it’s one of the oldest ones and one of the best… (and rubber cement isn’t contact cement)
    but there are PR firms that represent, well probably not weldwood, but just about any corporation, and they have a lot more than google scouring every forum and comment and review… (see also: astroturfing)

    while i think it’s possible to comment above the boot licking level, their boots will still find you and grind themselves into your tongue anyways, if a brand name slips from your mouth…


    you’re missing the entire point of r/hailcorporate…
    it’s not about astroturfing at all…

    /r/HailCorporate is to document times when people act as unwitting advertisers for a product or a brand with an aim towards raising awareness of the pervasive nature of commercialism in our society and culture.

    i guess, somewhat about astroturfing, but about commercialism in general.

    — posted from my phancy ifone 69

    p.s. astroturfing is very real, and shills do like to get in on the “ground floor” of any new movement…

    BolexForSoup avatar

    I didn’t miss the point of it. The point is that isn’t how it played out. It’s like anti-work. That was literally a sub by people who are against the concept of labor entirely. The idea of a paid job. But as it grew in popularity it morphed into another, albeit more well known, work reform subreddit. Every other thread you had people in the comments complaining about this change and telling people to go over to the work reform sub.

    Hail corporate quickly became a place for people to claim astroturfing by accounts, often because they simply didn’t like what the person saying or the brand mentioned. “Nobody could possibly like Apple for legitimate reasons” kind of stuff.

    The reason this matters is we have no reason to believe it will play out any differently here. People use it to ping astroturfing on Reddit, they will do the same here, and it will be abused.

    RobotToaster, avatar

    There’s definitely spam, although it tends to be more of the boner pill variety.


    Someone bonehead posted an ad on the technology community yesterday for a dental practice in Melbourne

    I mean, what were they thinking?!?

    BolexForSoup avatar

    They weren’t thinking. Too many want a quick way to get eyeballs but aren’t willing to do the legwork to learn about the community they want to post in. People also don’t like to feel like you’re being opaque about your advertisement. I remember archer did an ad campaign on Reddit that was very successful done in the gone wild post style. Great example of knowing your audience, being 100% transparent, and making it actually fun to see.

    Sabata11792 avatar

    How many people are actually buying suspicious dick pills on the internet? The I always assumed its scam/info stealing and you get nothing. There can't be enough people dumb to buy those to keep it profitable, right?


    I tried to convince my small company to put an account on Mastodon instead of X. Our social media person opened a Mastodon account, but decided it wouldn’t be run until Mastodon was a little more, well, relevant.

    douglasg14b, avatar

    Yeah I see this turned into a witch hunt for places where fruitful discussion may have otherwise happened.

    It’s interesting to get an inside view and how some corporations do their BS, which usually requires discussing it which is often kicked off by some complaint or misunderstanding of how the world works.


    You’ll know when lemmy gets big enough, because you’ll start seeing subtle Coca Cola placements in posts

    demesisx, avatar

    You’re free to block it if you want. I’d argue that there is a non-zero chance that there are zero astroturfers here right now. The censorship on in general is enough to cause me to start this community. Look at the billionaire thread. The mods were so intensely pro-billionaire that they deleted MANY comments calling for the guillotine as a solution to the world’s billionaire problem. After a while, they had to give up because it was making them look like what they are: Lemmy’s staunch defenders of crony capitalism.


    although there’s definitely astroturfing, mods tend to censor calls to violence regardless


    but they shouldn't


    it’s all fun and games till the court cases…

    Zagorath, avatar

    Seriously it’s not fucking rocket surgery. Direct calls to violence like that are illegal in most of the world. In contexts where it seems like it’s meant sincerely and not as a joke, mods would be crazy not to remove it.


    in an unjust society, following the rules allows evil to go unchecked.


    gotta choose your battles…

    BolexForSoup, (edited )
    BolexForSoup avatar


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  • Masterblaster,

    i honestly don't understand your point

    BolexForSoup, (edited )
    BolexForSoup avatar


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  • Masterblaster,

    i should stand up on my own instance? you're not a native english speaker, are you? i'm seriously trying to understand your point.

    BolexForSoup, (edited )
    BolexForSoup avatar



    oh. ok. i see. lol. no thanks. i'll do and say what i want, thank you very much.

    BolexForSoup, (edited )
    BolexForSoup avatar


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  • Masterblaster,

    not really. i'm just anti social.

    Zagorath, avatar

    True, and unjust laws should be broken.

    Murder is not unjust.

    BolexForSoup avatar

    This is a pretty flagrant example of assuming the worst interpretation of mods’ actions while lacking context and while also just dogpiling onto “mods are bad mkay?”

    That follow up comment is also super cringe, offensive, and unsympathetic.

    demesisx, avatar

    Hilarious! Heavy lies the crown of modding the most mainstream Lemmy instance. They may not be the heros we want or even need, but perhaps they are the heros we deserve.


    … maybe just don’t call for other people’s deaths. And incidentally, the guillotine is centuries old, and in the modern day would be completely ineffective in the face of offshore bank accounts and private jets.

    demesisx, (edited ) avatar

    753 people who, if they didn’t exist, the earth would INSTANTLY become a better place. We are being sent barreling enthusiastically toward climate collapse by those exact 753 greedy dragons who are sitting on piles of money that they literally couldn’t spend in 10,000,000 lifetimes, literally buying up governments rather than do ANYTHING to dial back their excess and you? You’re sitting here tone-policing people. If that isn’t hail corporate, I really don’t know what is!

    Thanks for so clearly demonstrating exactly why I started this community. I’m guessing you’re a lib who thinks Chuck Schumer, Joe Biden, and Nancy Pelosi are working hard in your best interest but those darned Republicans keep getting in the way.

    PS. You’d have a point if mods had removed posts calling for the deaths of innocent Palestinian people.

    YeetPics, avatar

    you’re sitting here tone-policing people.

    Isn’t that what you’re doing here, too?


    This is why most people won’t take you seriously.

    demesisx, avatar

    Says the 8-day-old account with only one comment on an instance filled with tech serfs who are either too comfortable with their bread and circus and healthcare tied to their employment that they afraid of upsetting their billionaire bosses. That instance, while great for technical talk, is about as fertile ground for political discussion as an automated helpdesk inside of a student loan app.


    Good luck in life, you’ll need a lot

    demesisx, avatar

    I hope you are someday rich enough where you can recover the integrity that left you so early in your life. You don’t even realize that you won the birth lottery. You don’t even realize that if you were simply born in another country, none of the comforts that have found you in life would even be possible. You are clearly comfortable enough to point fingers but captive enough to still kiss the ass of your master. You’re a feudal serf and you don’t even realize it.

    I empathize with your plight. I used to be a lot like you (a victim of hustle culture, monetizing all of my hobbies) before I realized how rigged this game is. One doesn’t often realize how rigged the game is until they get ground up like hamburger in it…and that is the difference between us.


    It sounds like you’ve ping-ponged between two radical ideologies. Maybe you became so disillusioned with the lack of success from overworking yourself and now you’re angry at the state of the world, but lashing out at people trying to engage you in a discussion isn’t going to do any good.

    demesisx, avatar

    Your assessment is incorrect.

    I am what you would call empathetic. I’m actually comfortable in my life but I watched this happen to other people and I realized (after playing the stupid tribalist game over and over again) that this society tries to herd us into electoralism and socialist democracy while our demagogues flat out ignore their constituents with absolutely no regard for our needs. This society is too far gone for us to just keep voting for the lesser evil from between two people selected by a billionaire class that literally wants us to die so they can have more. We need to rise up and take back our societies before it is too late. There is no time left for incremental changes (which are actually just a disguise for austerity which has a ratcheting effect). The ruling class take a bigger chunk of our wages each year and you want me to play nice. No thanks. The time for half measures has long passed. If you don’t recognize that you either don’t have much empathy or you’re still very much asleep.


    Dude stop smoking what you’re smoking. You know nothing about me and here you lay judgement.

    demesisx, avatar

    Two comments! TWO! AH AH AH


    You are extremely obnoxious dude. You talk about morality, yet you are fine with putting people to death. You are a hypocrite. Having a person like you in charge of a witchhunting community is even worse. Rethink what you are doing and remember that behind every nickname is a human.

    demesisx, avatar

    I’m so sorry that the truth is obnoxious. I find you to be obnoxious and incredibly misguided. Did you get an “atta boy!” from a billionaire or are you just that much of a kiss-ass?

    I see a human behind your nickname; One that is such a smug, self righteous prick that they don’t seem to understand that we are at a turning point in society and if we don’t stand up now, we will have an Orwellian, fascist society where innocent people are bombed using our tax money and we literally CANNOT say anything about it or we will be imprisoned.

    To me, your stance equates to this: It’s fine to liquify babies with my tax money but I draw the line at suggesting we liquify the people who are liquifying those babies.


    Yup, completely misguided, with extremist views and a “no u” attitude. It’s par for the course you making that community.

    BolexForSoup avatar

    Says the 8-day-old account with only one comment on an instance filled with tech serfs who are either too comfortable with their bread and circus and healthcare tied to their employment that they afraid of upsetting their billionaire bosses.

    Dude just…I don’t know, slow down? Go for a walk or something you are getting into fights online over announcing a new community. You need to have a little thicker skin than this. You’re not going to make everybody happy, people are going to critique you and your efforts. You would do well to listen to a handful of them instead of just throwing accusations at people and grandstanding.

    Also attacking account age? The vast majority of people who are on here regularly joined in the summer (including you). Most of the accounts probably aren’t even six months old, definitely not a year. It’s also just such a cringe way of discrediting people.


    Sorry, but if rules are not consistent then they aren’t any good.


    fuck rules. do what's right.


    While it can feel good to cut loose, down this path lies madness. Try to remember, people trying to hurt you want you to feel backed into a corner, that perception causes you to disregard some of your real options.

    You are not actually backed into a real corner, though. That perception is an illusion to try to make you lash out and hurt yourself in the long-run. It’s a propaganda technique.

    If the truth is really on your side, you can use words to spread it, and convince others to help. The actual truth has to be on your side for this to work though, not just feelings and emotions.


    i believed that naive shit for a long time, but then i realized that truth does not prevail because of its merits alone and that sort of thinking is what has allowed sociopaths to rule the world.


    Try on a longer, larger view. For instance, we say “witch hunt, witch hunt” these days, mostly disingenuously, but when was the last time we actually burned one like we used to?

    It’s tempting to wish for the world to be made perfect, it’s certainly nowhere near close. But focusing in on only the problems, like a propagandist might want, makes it harder to see the things that are actually good and getting better, and on our ability to actually genuinely change things, or sometimes die trying.

    There is no quick, magical solution though. People will always be people, for the foreseeable future.


    lol. you'll be fighting for water in the climate wars in 30 years.

    2 steps forward 1 step back was fine until the beginning of this century. you no longer have time to accept the slow progress of change.

    NOT_RICK, avatar

    I haven’t seen any posts where people are calling for Palestinian deaths with no moderation action. Also, your holier than thou attitude is pretty off-putting. You usually get further trying to understand where someone is coming from rather than slinging unfounded accusations just to score points. Straw manning is wack.