I grew up evangelical and the way heaven was described to me, was essentially an eternity of servitude and worship to a deity. A happy little slave for all eternity. Now that sounds like absolute hell to me.
This is Hell propaganda. There's no way you'd get a comfy bed.
And before you say that bed might not be comfortable, he's maintaining a smile while laying on it, so it's still too comfortable even if it isn't comfortable per se.
Actually, the anti-hell propaganda from heaven isn’t true at all. It’s more like a communist group of artists with an unlimited budget and plenty of space. Heaven is an authoritarian hell, with a whole book of rules and you’ve got to get on your knees and beg every time the boss or his son walks by.
In heaven, you’re going to have all the fundamentalists, the ultra conservatives, the blood soaked warlords of the middle ages, the genocidal slavers from the renaissance, >90% of nazi Germany and just about every evil person who said “oops sorry god” before death.
In hell were going to have the layabouts, the nerdowells, the ravers, the LGBT+ community, the gamblers, the stoners, the revellers, the drinkers, the party animals, the sex workers and the promiscuous people.
Don’t you worry about us. We’re gonna have an AMAZING time.
Have fun at the never ending church where you’ll worship yahweh non-stop for all eternity which definitely doesn’t sound like hell. I wish you all the best with that.
The idea that the infinitely perfect Abrahamic God exists but you’d somehow be happier separated from God (and languishing in hell for all eternity) is so foreign to me as a theist that I have to assume you aren’t taking the starting assumption seriously.
Atheists who deny the existence of God make far more sense than those who say they’d rather be in hell as a matter of principle.
No, you just really don’t understand the concept of eternity and you haven’t taken a critical eye to the abusive relationship that is “worship me or i torture you forever.” Worshipping a clearly very vein and narcissistic God for all eternity is hell.
Theists have been saying all the fun people are going to hell for… Well, longer than anyone possibly on Lemmy has been alive.
Then add in the idea that the Abrahamic God is perfect is so incredibly foreign and laughable that we have to assume you aren’t taking the response seriously.
Now I can’t say this for everyone, but probably a good number agree with me - we don’t believe in God. And if God did exist, we think God is a total dick. And if we were to have the choice of being around that dick and all the people that like that kind of a total dick, who behave like total dicks themselves because they worship that complete dick of a deity, we want to be in the place that contains the opposite.
TL;Dr, I bet they are being very serious about the question.
I think you’ve proven my point as you’re contradicting yourself.
And if God did exist, we think God is a total dick
The Abrahamic conception of God is of an infinitely perfect being who’s attributes–viz., omnipotence, omniscience, omnibenevolence, omnipresence-- are maximally unified in that one being. So to suppose that this God exists but then deny his omnibenevolence is a logical contradiction of the definition of the Abrahamic God. (This is akin to, for example, supposing that a square-circle exists.) If God does exist, but he isn’t omnibenevolent, then this is no longer the Abrahamic God. Which is why I argued that you are not “taking the starting assumption seriously” in my earlier comment.
I think you’re making assumptions about what others would consider perfect or right.
You’re going with a very theist-centric view, and not considering others.
You are forcing the idea that an Abrahamic God is perfect. The very history of this world, even the Bible, shows to me that is complete bunk. I am saying, quite sincerely, what you are calling perfection I consider a serial killer. What you are calling perfection I view as a paragon of hatred. A psychotic, self indulgent, narcissistic baby-killer who revels in the suffering of others.
Your premise is faulty - you think God is perfect, others who think like I do view your perfect as a complete piece of shit.
The inability to see beyond your own feelings is the issue here. What you consider perfect is the problem, and why we would prefer Satan and hell.
Edit because I forgot before I sent:
So to suppose that this God exists but then deny his omnibenevolence is a logical contradiction of the definition of the Abrahamic God
Right. We consider the existence of God to be nonsense, because any god that was omnibenevolent wouldn’t be such a piece of shit, yet here we are in reality. Your premise is faulty.
Right. We consider the existence of God to be nonsense, because any god that was omnibenevolent wouldn’t be such a piece of shit, yet here we are in reality. Your premise is faulty.
Yes, you are once again proving my point that you aren’t taking the “starting assumption” (i.e. the existence of a perfect God) seriously. It’s perfectly fine if your conception of God is of a terrible serial killer, I am not trying to convince you otherwise, but now we aren’t talking about the same God.
Yours cannot possibly exist, and you aren’t allowing for any opinion other than your own.
So yes, if you want to assume there was some benevolent god, and the collective opinion of folks on heaven/hell would change.
But as that God cannot possibly exist, and has no basis in reality in so many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many, many… Many ways. Many.
So we are going off of the various religions and religious figures that do exist - and boy oh boy what hot garbage that God is! Including the one depicted by every Abrahamic religion. Which is why I keep saying your premise is broken, because the god depicted by Abrahamic religion is the garbage creature we do not want to be associated with.
That's assuming heaven and hell divide along the lines that people here on Earth want to believe.
If those places were real, a good portion of those expecting to go up would be going down. For me, they'd get their intelligence, conscience and empathy turned up to 11 and they'd get to watch their whole lives over a few thousand times with all the ramifications being picked apart. Maybe I'd even let them have a comfy seat for the show. Wouldn't want them to be distracted from it.
They'd be screaming for physical torture after a few rounds.
Would I end up in such a hell? Heck, I wouldn't be surprised.
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