Hamas published yesterday an 18-minute long pre-recorded press conference in English about their side of the story. This has received zero media attention anywhere in the western press. (Twitter)

persolb, 7 months ago

I don’t watch the news and only periodically see stuff like this. I’m using Wikipedia as my main reference to look at this; searching to just find a story confirming what’s on Wikipedia.

It looks like Hamas and cohorts crossed the border and killed hundreds of people. Back in Palestine, they are using otherwise occupied buildings as places to attack from.

I’m not sure what people expect Israel to do in this situation. If the ‘rule’ is to never attack back at someone using innocent human shields, the only people left alive will be those willing to use human shields.

TankieTanuki, 7 months ago

Here’s a primer.

persolb, 7 months ago

Thanks for the snarkless reply/link. It really is appreciated.

SleepyCat, 7 months ago

Take a look at Decolonize Palestine. This website really helped me see things from the Palestinian perspective, hopefully it can help you learn too.

simply_surprise, 7 months ago

Hello, in the interest of “never stop explaining”, I’ll lay out the basis of my understanding. I’ll bold words you can use to search to extend your own research.

The zionist entity is a European settler colonial project, started with the genocidal Nakba in the 1940’s.

The Palestinian people have been gradually pushed into smaller and smaller cages, with the Gaza strip serving as a concentration camp.

Palestinians do not have freedom of movement, and have their water, electricity, and food strictly restricted by the zionists.

The zionists refer to restricting the Gazan population by bombing as “mowing the lawn” - they fundamentally do not consider Gazans human.

In 1982, the UN affirmed Palestinian right to armed struggle in Resolution 37/43.

The zionists have ignored the too-generous UN 2-state solution, and have gradually taken more and more land from the Palestinians through the illegal settlement program.

Palestinians took part in the 2018 Great March to nonviolently protest their apartheid situation. Zionist soldiers bragged about shooting out their knees. 36,100 were injured.

Over 6,400 Palestinians have been killed by Israel (since 2009), and 150,000 have been injured.

Each Hamas fighter included here has very likely lost an innocent loved one (likely a child) to zionist bombing. They likely know someone who had their knee shot out for marching, or simply being close to the Gaza fence. They have known someone who has been illegally detained by the zionists for no reason. They’ve been starved, deprived of water, deprived of electricity, held in a concentration camp and bombed.

Nothing Hamas can do is worse than has been done to them.

As a note, Hamas has shared the the current engagement was primarily about destroying the IDF Gaza Division (the battle for Re’im was part of that). Mainstream media does not seem to be sharing that the majority of their targets are military/police installations.

I will not be answering any responses from you until you can demonstrate an understanding of the terms I’ve bolded here.

Best of luck!

persolb, 7 months ago

Thanks. The fundamental point seems to be that the people who did the attacks on Israel a few days ago basically see themselves as fighting occupation against a genocidal army.

I asked this same question somewhere else and got nearly the opposite response. Searching their keywords also provide what appear to be valid links and videos.

I sincerely appreciate you providing the links… but I think this is just a topic I’m going to stay mostly uneducated on beyond “this sucks for all the innocent people there.” Near as I can tell I could find horrible things on both sides of the story… will only be scratching the surface… and my final belief will just be based on what piece of the surface I scratch.

taiphlosion, 7 months ago

basically see themselves as fighting occupation against a genocidal army.

That’s because they literally are.

I’m going to stay mostly uneducated on beyond “this sucks for all the innocent people there.”

Imagine not knowing anything about something, talking out of your ass about it and then when given the opportunity to learn, choosing to be willfully ignorant. This kind of behavior disgusts me.

persolb, 7 months ago

Well, we’re all that way about most everything. There are literally an unlimited number of things to know about. I’d much rather recognize I’ ignorant in it and consciously decide which ones I’m going to continue to be ignorant on; when I can.

If there was a clear answer here, I’d have gotten similar stories/perspectives from my queries. Maybe one with better trustworthy references. Instead I got two versions of history which each neglect certain parts, both of which appear to be factually correct, and both of which try to make the other side look like monsters. Since I am going to die one day, without ever being able to impact this situation, it is reasonable to bow out.

(As an example of where this has worked before, similar prior questions on things UBI, Georgian tax, and Taiwan have changed my mind.)