#BlackMastodon#BlackTwitter@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon
In Mystal's piece he talks about how Clarence Thomas became self-hating, Mystal shares a story that he told his mother he wasn't black because he heard something negative about black people at school and it didn't apply to him so he figured he wasn't black. I'm just curious how many of black kids tried to separate themselves from blackness when they were young because of some ignorant thing a white person said?
We used to talk peer pressure from 2 or 3 of our peers when talking drugs. And the impact that can have. Without ever talking about a country FULL of white people spewing influence through generations.
@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Indeed. And yet some black folks don't become self-haters and some don't wish for whiteness. So what creates the conditions for them that allow them to retain strong self-assured ego? That's what I am interested in. How can we replicate that to protect our children.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon My honest guess? Logic doing the two step on our faces. It can only go but so far if you're black without smacking head first into the logical..ohh...this is manipulation.
Most of us find trouble squaring the lies we've been told about black people with reality. Shooting us right into the real world.
@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Many of my damaged black students in FL really had a hard time in law school because the contradictions are right there in your face. I was glad to be there for them when they got to the point of trying to figure it out. But it was emotionally exhausting for me and foreign to me how they could get that damaged. But 20+ years there I understood completely how they got damaged. And there were only two us who were aware, so we couldn't catch everyone.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Entirely understandable too. What most of us forget or don't really pay attention to. Is just how absolutely surrounded we black people are.
Not just talking america being majority white. But having been for hundreds of years by force/manipulation/propaganda. Most of which still exists and still negatively effects us all today.
From the day we can think the bs starts on us. Until we get older and basically learn most of our lives are a lie.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Like there was a time when i used to try to argue with white racists online about crime. And had a hard time dealing with the whole..BLACK PEOPLE COMMIT MORE CRIME thing that was always shouted and accepted.
Then...somebody online was once like..yeah of course white people are in all the movies...there's more of us in america. And it clicked. More white people really does equal more white crime.
@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon And the FBI has been saying that for decades but they just put it in the data. Every black person in America would have to be committing a crime for it to be mostly us and then it would STILL only be about 16% of crime. One has to know how to read behind the BS to know whats really going on.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon EXACTLY!! Every last one of us would have to be committing an insane amount of crime for it to come close to what america/fbi/etc have been saying for decades.
Massively illogical. But it's a core illogical building block upon which we build even more illogical ways of thinking. Reverse racism, virtue signaling, what people call politically correct, woke, etc.
All of it illogical. And all of it building off itself to make everyone less logical.
@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon How we use words is critically important. They can shed light or they can obfuscate. The right obfuscates to cause confusion. We should all try to shed light and not to mix two threads, but yep mixing now...also called intersectional analysis..that's why it is important to say abolition instead of police reform. It sheds light on what is actually wanted. Let us continue to use our words to say what we mean and use language in the ways of the oppressor.
Take race baiter or race baiting for example. We all know the terms are racist. All know racists used them and use them.
But we don't quantify them as..illogical. If a conservative says christians shouldn't be attacked. Is that religion baiting? Rich baiting? Fascist baiting? Some people alive today have never questioned what race baiting actually is.
How does that relate to affirmative action? Well, it's a program meant to help people of color. Both were obfuscated in the exact same ways with both the exact same outcome.
Point being. Learning and re-learning from the past can help us with the future and the present. Since republicans/conservatives/racist white dudes don't know anything else.
@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Oh I totally agree. Doing research now on free black communities in NC from 1700 to 1865 and I am telling you everything and I mean everything happening now was used to kill black communities then. It is the same bag of tricks. but everyone pretends each cycle is new. Believe me people...it's not. We are the ones who refuse to learn. They know their tools and they know how they work.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Oh but it's so much worse. We're currently talking us black people. And there's a good amount of us who don't get what you said.
But we're also talking..muslims, asians, gay people, trans people, women, hispanics, etc. Every last category of human being ever targeted by straight white christian conservative men.......regularly fall for that category's shit. Over an over an over again.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon This is how big of a problem we're talking. Where that one category of human being. Either in america or like the uk, etc. Straight white christian conservative men.
Can play the EXACT same games on all other categories of human being with only an insanely small fraction of that population even coming close to understanding just how expansive they've been with it.
Literally redefining the word logic to mean whatever they say when they feel like it.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Kind of feels like i'm talking too much. But i said all this to point out that it's understandable when people don't get it.
Considering just how large it is and how long it's been around. At the same time. Logic beats it. On some gg easy shit.
If the asian americans with the affirmative action thing were logical in any way. They would have known whats about to happen to asian americans across the country. But yeah logic is the way out.
@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon LOL this place is for talking but I hear you. There's only so many ways you can say a thing. Let us all keep our eyes open and fight the good fight where appropriate.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon To be honest...i get that from my family. You'd think being black that talking about issues that directly effect us all would be up on the regular.
Nope.
I'm looked at as the one who talks too much. lol Basically got shushed a minute ago when talking affirmative action. lol You right though. This is the place.
@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Listen if people can go on and freaking on about Elon Musk and Meta...you can talk as much as you want about affirm action... rant on.. if they don't like they can unfollow....or mute.But it's the internet! You say what you want.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Alright bet. lol Asian americans (involved in this) have no idea what they just did to themselves. Any and every minority group/group of people of color..who helps racist white people in america. Suffers for it dearly. Texas, florida, etc.
White trans people (small group) even got in on it. And now things are much worse for them than they would have been.
That's one of those strategies. Like that whole making a deal with the devil shit.
@DryBird2993@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Kapos and Quislings will always abound; debasing themselves and betraying themselves for crumbs licked from the boots of their masters, always shocked when it's eventually their turn to be put into the showers.
@ricardoharvin@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon So here's a thing that might at first seem unrelated. People say trans people are mentally ill all the time. Meanwhile, narcissism (as far as i know) actually is considered a mental health problem.
When people think in their own best interests. Their own best interested often gets chopped and screwed by narcissism.
House n stuff right. Just a smidge of logic could have been like..nah if i fuck over black people...i'm next. Didn't happen.
@ricardoharvin@DryBird2993@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Read Derrick Bell's short story Space Traders. The copyright has been violated so many times you can find it on the internet. But the Clarence Thomases of the story discover their truth worth at the end. I won't spoil it for you. 😆
He strikes me as the type where there's no surprise. He knows they'll end him as soon as they can and he loves it. I mean how else do you explain his wife?
Like..he wants one of them to david carradine him. lol
@fulanigirl@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Went to look for info on space traders (which is hilariously a play on the term race traitor...which is insanely fitting given what happens in it but is low key i'm sure lost on most white people who saw it) and of course wiki gives the whole story. lol
Like damn. Was really looking forward to not just reading it. But here we are.
@ricardoharvin@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon It's so strange to me. I mean i 100% get it. Can't talk about hundreds of years of constant manipulation/propaganda/brain washing/etc without understanding and giving a little.
But.
They sometimes treat me like my mouth is directly connected to a covid-19 universe. And everytime i open it 1,000 regularly people an 200 republican radio talk show hosts die. lol
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Nope. I always knew I was Black, even when other students tried to say otherwise. I had a very strong foundation at home and from a young age. Right down to a red, black, and green button on St Patrick’s Day in preschool after the teacher made a big deal about that but wouldn’t read a book on MLK.
@rosanita@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Was talking to some friends last night. Our parents indoctrinated us in blackness so we never questioned it or tried to be something else, much as was your experience. It's so important that children be nurtured by people who support blackness, even if it's not their parents. It has to be someone important to the child during their formative years.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon I think that what Clarence Thomas eventually...became goes beyond internalized racism but regardless. This is a common thing. I was mostly raised by white people in white spaces so ofc it happened to me too. And it took years to kick bc for the longest time I didn't even know what was going on. I had virtually no protection and it set me quite a bit back. I'm just grateful for the folks who were kind enough to help me set myself straight.
@tillshadeisgone@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon I wish I had the answer. Was talking recently with the white mom of my bi-racial neighbor. Whoa..like the mom was jacked up. She NEVER discussed race and what it meant to her child who is black presenting. The daughter is in therapy now. SMDH that is child abuse.
@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon I just think this is something we don't talk about as a community. It would be helpful to know how insecurities developed so we can inoculate our kids in predominately white environments so they don't become self-hating.
@Terra@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon@ricardoharvin Sorry I couldn't get to this yesterday but had to get out the door. So, it's always interesting to me how and why families do that. But in doing this research I gained a better understanding of why some folks for example "passed" into white back then (1800). My main goal is to understand why people still distance now, and how can we help kids understand you can be your authentic black self and thrive.
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon In my family we were raised to be "Good Negroes™️" by two extremely insecure and self-loathing people who used respectability politics as the measure of their worth.
It's tough indoctrination to break, at least for the rest of my still-chained family.
@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Thank goodness for growth! If we don't love and respect ourselves for who we are...nothing will ever be right. I grew up in segregated NYC so we didn't deal with what white people thought. They were not relevant to my my childhood development. And even in jr and sr high school which was predominately white I can only think of the names of two white kids. We need a vaccine against racist trauma!
@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon At 5, we moved from the very integrated Mount Pleasant neighborhood in Washington, D.C. to all white Chula Vista, California where I learned so many new words about who I was.
A year later we moved to the all Black Brownsville/Gladeview neighborhood in Miami, right next to Liberty City, where I had a very Moonlight experience for being an "Uncle Tom" for my name and how I spoke.
@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Oh! Hey former Mt Pleasant person! I lived there for years and loved that neighborhood. But yeah, that sense of being out of place everywhere can't be good. Funny story: my gfather lived in DC (where I live now) and we went there once. The black kids made fun of how we talked - said we sounded like we were on TV. My sister and I got inside and said "those kids are crazy, cause we know we are hot stuff!" That was how my parents impacted us! 😆
@venitamathias@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Probably the same as the stories people there have now 🤨 Honestly, I don't like to bad mouth a place but I cannot think of one good thing about FL. When I first got there in 1993 the clan was still demonstrating in their costumes!! I called everyone I knew in NYC and told them. They didn't believe me!
@venitamathias@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon My baby brother lives there and as much as I adore him and his family, now that I am free I have refused to go there for holiday gatherings. They understand, But we do miss each other.
@venitamathias@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Indeed. Boston is the poster child for northern racism.
Miami is an interesting/confusing place to me. I thought I could find some good coalitions there. But no.... all the communities of color had their separate camps. I thought that was weird. In the meantime, whites were running the roost even in districts with sizable populations of people of color. I just...didn't understand...
@fulanigirl@venitamathias@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon The Florida "crackers" in Miami ended up aligning with the wannabe white Cubans, and now other white-passing Latins from the region, and have kept Black communities poorly educated with little opportunity.
And the infighting of the Black community (U.S. born hate the Haitians, and the Black Caribbeans hate the U.S. born) keeps us down.
It's the self-hating propaganda doing the master's work.
@ricardoharvin@venitamathias@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon I found that to be exactly the case. And let me just say I criticized a white colleague once for using "Cracker" and he was astounded. He told me it was what they called themselves and there was a difference between FL crackers and GA crackers. One of the few times in my life where my mouth fell open and I was too stunned to say anything.
@ricardoharvin@fulanigirl@venitamathias@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon the story was that cracker refers to be sound the bull whip makes and basically was used as shorthand for "Florida cowboy", I don't know if it was true but at the time they said there where as many black crackers as white ones (that being as many black cowboys as white). Up until the 90s Florida had more cows than most mid western states including Texas. Again just relaying what I had heard growing up as a white kid in Florida
The "colored" beach was at Virginia Key, just south. I always considered the general current to be north-flowing due to the Gulfstream and peed in the water every time we went 😇
No act of rebellion is too small.
My last job, the office overlooked Biscayne Bay, and Virginia Key and the southern tip of Miami Beach were visible.
@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon There's some interesting stuff out there on the politics of respectability. I have more than a couple of supposedly left learning friends who use that "go along to get along:" phrase. I might have to start questioning them on how they got that. It's like the folks who want you to be satisfied with minutely incremental change...nah take that mess and go somewhere else.
*edit: Punctuation
@ricardoharvin@fulanigirl@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon I did as well. And I do have great-grandparents and a grandmother who weren’t Black and I leaned into that as heavily as I could. But ultimately, it wasn’t until I was away from anti-Black messaging enough to stop hating myself and my people that I stopped. I think the question is how do we protect our kids from a society that hates them?
@amaditalks@ricardoharvin@blackmastodon@BlackMastodon Right. That's what I'm getting at. We know our children exist in an anti-black environment. What tools can we give them to help put up defenses that will deflect that hate so it isn't absorbed. I am certain it can be done. The how of it escapes me though...
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