Removal of piracy communities

Earlier, after review, we blocked and removed several communities that were providing assistance to access copyrighted/pirated material, which is currently not allowed per Rule #1 of our Code of Conduct. The communities that were removed due to this decision were:

We took this action to protect lemmy.world, lemmy.world’s users, and lemmy.world staff as the material posted in those communities could be problematic for us, because of potential legal issues around copyrighted material and services that provide access to or assistance in obtaining it.

This decision is about liability and does not mean we are otherwise hostile to any of these communities or their users. As the Lemmyverse grows and instances get big, precautions may happen. We will keep monitoring the situation closely, and if in the future we deem it safe, we would gladly reallow these communities.

The discussions that have happened in various threads on Lemmy make it very clear that removing the communites before we announced our intent to remove them is not the level of transparency the community expects, and that as stewards of this community we need to be extremely transparent before we do this again in the future as well as make sure that we get feedback around what the planned changes are, because lemmy.world is yours as much as it is ours.

tcj,

I don’t understand how lemmy world has removed them, aren’t those all communities on different servers? How is this our problem?

f4te,

they blocked access for lemmy.world users.

Underwear,

Which I think is a problem in the structure of lemmy. I can understand them banning c/piracy from being hosted on lemmy.world, but blocking access to other communities on other instances from all of their users is really an issue. As a user I shouldn’t have to create a new account to be able to see something hosted on lemmy.ml, no matter what the admins of my home instance think about it.

I think it should be up to the community admin to find an instance that supports them, not both the community creator and every user that wants to see that content.

KrisND,

Interesting, but how could that be done? A list of instances with a list of allowed community types?

It’d be easier to find okay instances that are okay with said topic.

Carighan,
@Carighan@lemmy.world avatar

I think it should be up to the community admin to find an instance that supports them, not both the community creator and every user that wants to see that content.

What’s a “community admin”? The server owner? It is up to them, that’s the whole point of the fediverse, you as the admin decide what people can see on your server, but everyone can also be their own admin if they so desire.

Obsession,

Because of the way Lemmy works, all content from federated instances is mirrored (minus images). So technically, all the piracy content also lives on lemmy.world, which makes them liable for it.

tcj,

So the images, video, etc isn’t cached here, it’s just text and links? Sites generally aren’t liable for what is on the other side of links, they just have to remove the link if they are notified by the copyright holder that it’s infringing their rights.

Cabrio,

I’m sure individual instance owners have robust legal teams for handling and processing an untold number of takedown requests.

tcj,

If they want to air on the safe side, as they appear to here, they can just auto-approve any takedown request. Just as robust a legal protection, while still allowing more content to be online.

scarabic,

Yarr. But still, I support this.

deadinside91,

While I wish there was more transparency about this decision before action was taken, in this case it’s kind of understandable due to the servers being hosted in Germany and them having really draconian piracy laws. Just hoping that this won’t lead to a chain reaction of other communities being removed due to legal complaints.

In the meantime, happy to get my piracy content over at db0.

samus12345,
@samus12345@lemmy.world avatar

The server is in Finland.

ArmokGoB,

They should just not host in a country with such authoritarian laws.

Carighan,
@Carighan@lemmy.world avatar

“Just fix it” is always funny to say when you’re not the one who has to do it. 😛

AlternActive,

Is there any way to migrate accounts to other instances yet?

joshuaacasey,

sadly no

abbotsbury,
@abbotsbury@lemmy.world avatar

Just make a new one

TyGamer,

There’s a tool to export/import your settings but that’s it. Can’t remember where it is but it’s somewhere on GitHub.

rodneyck, (edited )
@rodneyck@lemmy.world avatar

Reddit 2.0…already migrating off this censorship.

You can use LASIM app (Windows/Mac/Linux) to migrate your profile and settings to another instance. Highly recommend.

Elpinchepana,

WTF. Time to go. See ya.

WidowsFavoriteSon,

Good lord, what a bunch of whiny little fucks you are. Go host your own server, maybe you’ll have time after Algebra class…

Im1Random,

WTF this instance is becoming as bad as Reddit itself. Go fuck youall my new home will be lemm.ee and/or lemmy.dbzer0.com.

alldreadme,
@alldreadme@lemmy.world avatar

I kinda do understand their stance, it sucks but its better than having to deal with legal shit.

joshuaacasey,

Except they don’t have to deal with “legal shit”. Section 230 literally protects them and makes it so that they are NOT liable for what users post (it’s the users that post it that are liable – as it should be, tbh)

This is just some bullshit censorship. I would totally run my own personal lemmy instance, but I’ve heard that it’s not easy to run in docker. Hopefully over time it’ll improve!

OfficerBribe,

So you say something like twitter is free to host child porn and they can just say “We did not post it, we just make it available”?

joe,
@joe@lemmy.world avatar

No, not exactly. It’s more like “a service isn’t held responsible for what users do with it”. If an analogy is helpful, imagine charging the phone company because two people arranged a bank robbery over the phone. That’s what section 230 prevents. (It’s more complicated than I’m making it but for our purposes the complications aren’t pertinent.)

LW was in no danger at all, assuming that if they were contacted about copyright violations, they react in a sane way, by taking down the offending content.

The whole

Carighan,
@Carighan@lemmy.world avatar

I’m sorry, where exactly in the German law is this “section 230” you people all keep mentioning?

joe,
@joe@lemmy.world avatar

Don’t even get me started. Go ahead and ask any of the admins which copyright laws they’re so terrified of. They’ll tell you US laws.

grayhaze,
@grayhaze@lemmy.world avatar

Why do you assume that only US law applies here?

tlit341569,

time to migrate change instance shit.

eleitl,

Time to get serious about running my own instance. I now have to wonder what kind of political opinion I might voice which could make the instance operators liable. This is not tolerable long-term.

Cabrio,

It’s nice to see all the new users catching up to how the fediverse works, good job! Now go make your own instance with all the blackjack, hookers, and liability you want!

eleitl,

Not exactly a new user. My lemmy.ml account is three years old.

Cabrio,

Oof. That’s a bit slow on the uptake, imagine using something for 3 years and having no clue how it works.

SatansMaggotyCumFart,

That’s the joys of being on Lemmy, if you don’t like what the admin are doing on the instance you’re using then you can switch.

I like how you added political opinions in here and it didn’t even seem too forced either.

eleitl,

In the country I live I can literally go to jail if I voice opinions other than “unprovoked Russian aggressive attack”. Presumably the more timid local Lemmy instance owners would fear liability.

SatansMaggotyCumFart,

What country is that?

eleitl,

The same country where lemmy.world is hosted, but there are multiple countries in the EU on track to implement 1984 down to the letter.

SatansMaggotyCumFart,

I still don’t know what country you are talking about.

I’ve spent a bit of time googling and I haven’t found much information on what you’re saying.

eleitl,

Lemmy.world is hosted at Hetzner in Germany.

SatansMaggotyCumFart,

It’s not illegal to push pro-Russia propaganda in Germany so I’m not sure why you say you’ll go to jail if you do.

eleitl,

It is illegal in Germany to voice a nonmainstream opinion. See linkezeitung.de/…/meinungsfreiheit-deutsche-staat… for a case citing the relevant laws. Other countries like Czechia and some Baltic countries have similar legislation. It is not yet illegal to bypass blocks of censored mass media like e.g. RT, Sputnik News or any Russian TV channel.

SatansMaggotyCumFart,

Has Alina Lipp been charged, convicted or jailed?

eleitl,

Her parents have been harassed. She herself will not return to Germany for fear of persecution.

I recall several other cases in the press where people were persecuted and fined.

To recap, there is recently introduced very broad legislation which can be enforced selectively and is being used to harass and silence dissenting opinions. As lemmy.world operators are censoring a piracy community for fear of liability and hence are likely to do the same for political communities I will be moving on from this instance to a more permissive one. EOT.

SatansMaggotyCumFart,

So you’re saying she hasn’t been charged, convicted or jailed?

InternetUser2012,

Yeah, I’m out of here now.

systemglitch,

What. The. Fuck.

rich8n,

The fuck is the whole point of the Fediverse. If an instance operator doesn’t want to host something, you are free to sign up with someone who does or host your own instance and take those risks yourself.

GameEnder, (edited )

Pathetic. Defeats the entire point if federated networks.

This is how lemmy is going to fail with the entire thing being fragmented mess. Which is sad as I was hoping it would be the proper exit plan for Reddit.

WidowsFavoriteSon,

Actually, this is precisely how federated networks should work.

IZanderI,

Any suggestions on instances to move over to?

pankuleczkapl,
@pankuleczkapl@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

lemm.ee for general use, dbzer,0 for mainly piracy (I chose this option myself)

Jasontheguitarist,

I was going to join dbzer0 but their application wants me to talk about anarchy and shit. I don’t know anything about all that, I just want to get to the piracy community.

Then I checked if dbzer0 was still accessible from Beehaw, and it is, so I just subscribed from there.

applejacks,
@applejacks@lemmy.world avatar

lmao you have to “apply”?

pankuleczkapl,
@pankuleczkapl@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Nah, you can just write whatever makes even a tiny bit of sense. It’s just protection against bots

Jasontheguitarist,

Oh. Thanks. I’ll try signing up again. I imagine a lot of folks are sailing over there right about now.

CaptainEffort,

Lemmy.ca users have been saying that anyone’s welcome, regardless of where they’re from. Sopuli.xyz is really solid too, and also welcomes everyone.

I’m on sh.it just.works and have enjoyed it a lot. At the end of the day it doesn’t matter a whole lot though, you can still join all the communities you did before. So which instance you choose isn’t a massive deal.

Underwear,

Until the instance you choose blocks access to communities you enjoyed and it all starts over again.

CaptainEffort,

So what? Do people really care that much about Lemmy’s karma points? Making an account on a different instance is pretty much a non issue.

xyzinferno,

I wish people would be more mature about their reaction to this, as well as other people’s reactions, regardless of whether they agree or disagree with the choice.

I’m not opposed to piracy, though I understand the risks that come with a platform allowing potentially pirated content. While I respect the decision and see the reasoning behind it, I don’t agree with it, and will likely change my home instance to one that allows me to continue communicating with those communities, as I was subscribed to one of them.

I’ll still be participating in communities hosted here, and I hope that with this decision, the admins’ concern about being potentially sued is substantially alleviated.

s38b35M5,
@s38b35M5@lemmy.world avatar

I sure hope the Lemmy devs are able to get moving on account migration soon…

joshuaacasey,

there are no concerns about potentially being sued. Section 230 literally exists. Section 230 says that lemmy.world is not liable for what users post. It is the users themselves that are liable. As it should be. If Section 230 didn’t exist, nobody would be able to post anyone because the hosts would be too scared about getting sued. (ironic)

raptorattacks,

Section 230 does not protect against intellectual property (copyright) claims, which I imagine is the primary concern behind blocking piracy communities. Source: Electronic Frontier Foundation: Section 230

Quote below (emphasis mine): “Section 230’s protections are not absolute. It does not protect companies that violate federal criminal law. It does not protect companies that create illegal or harmful content. Nor does Section 230 protect companies from intellectual property claims.”

Cabrio,

What do US laws have to do with a website hosted by a German company in Finland?

raptorattacks,

You should probably ask the commenter I was replying to? I was merely providing more information about section 230, to correct misinformation in that parent comment.

  • All
  • Subscribed
  • Moderated
  • Favorites
  • •
  • lemmyworld@lemmy.world
  • GTA5RPClips
  • DreamBathrooms
  • thenastyranch
  • ngwrru68w68
  • modclub
  • magazineikmin
  • Youngstown
  • osvaldo12
  • rosin
  • slotface
  • khanakhh
  • mdbf
  • kavyap
  • tacticalgear
  • JUstTest
  • InstantRegret
  • cubers
  • tester
  • ethstaker
  • everett
  • Durango
  • cisconetworking
  • normalnudes
  • anitta
  • Leos
  • megavids
  • provamag3
  • lostlight
  • All magazines
    •