‘I saw our city seized,’ Ottawa store owner tells trial of convoy protest organizers

None of the local witnesses the court heard from this week had any contact with Lich or Barber, who are both accused of mischief and counselling others to commit mischief, among other charges.

If you organize a murder and encourage the person who commits the murder but don’t have any contact with the murder victim are you free and clear?

Barber and Lich are garbage humans who organized and encouraged the violation of the people of Ottawa.

cyborganism,

If you organize a murder and encourage the person who commits the murder but don’t have any contact with the murder victim are you free and clear?

Wasn’t that what Charles Manson did?

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

He was totally innocent, right?

PerogiBoi,
@PerogiBoi@lemmy.ca avatar

These domestic terrorist dirtbags tried to burn people alive by sealing an apartment lobby door shut and started a fire in the lobby.

On the footage, he described seeing two individuals lighting a fire in the lobby shortly after 5 a.m. Sunday.

the front door was duct-taped to prevent those outside from entering the building — showed “the escalation of their tactics knows no bounds.”

source

No one who supports this should feel comfortable or safe in Canada.

sbv,

According to the police investigation, the two individuals charged with starting that fire were unrelated to the convoy. See

  1. Ottawa man charged in February apartment arson, police dismiss convoy connection and
  2. Second man charged in Ottawa arson case has no link to ‘Freedom Convoy’ protest: police

The convoy was awful, the police screwed up their response to it, and the building residents were completely justified in their suspicions. However, it seems like there was something else going on in this instance.

PerogiBoi,
@PerogiBoi@lemmy.ca avatar

The Ottawa Police lost absolutely all credibility when they sided with the convoy and refused to uphold the law.

Several officers donated directly to the convoy using their OPS email addresses. Their assessment on crimes related to the convoy means nothing.

Grimpen,

…some of those that work forces…

xc2215x,

It is very sad what happened to the stores.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

And the thousands of hourly workers who were out of work for three weeks.

Grimpen,

One of the reasons I refuse to refer to the Qonvoyers as “truckers”. Every union that is active in the trucking industry and all trucking trade associations released statements disavowing the Qonvoyers. Actual working truckers were often caught up in border blockades by weekend “trucker” cosplayers with Dodge Ram 2500 dualies.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

Same. I have a friend who is a long haul trucker. He was vaccinated, like the vast majority of professional truckers, and running loads back and forth to the US throughout the pandemic. He was always stressed about what was going to happen at the border but he worked the whole time. He though the protesters were idiots.

Showroom7561,

I never understood the irony of these terrorists hating Canada and loving Canada at the same time. They don’t share Canadian values, and their extremist views only aim to cause harm.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

Canada is the best country in the world to live in and they want to destroy everything that makes it the best country in the world to live in.

You don’t love Canada if that’s what you aim to do.

pbjamm,
@pbjamm@beehaw.org avatar

They are the same as the MAGAts in the USA. They claim to love America and then proceed to tear it down because what they really love is a fantasy version of it. It is a fundamentally selfish version. They want all the rights and privileges with none of the responsibilities. No one should be able to infringe upon their freedom of expression, but the gays, minorities, immigrants etc should shut the hell up.

They do not love America, they do not love Canada. They love having authority and power over others.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

False patriots.

Son_of_dad,

Ok can we not make up shit though? Canada is shit, and saying it’s the best country in the world means you don’t want to fix or improve it.

Since I was a kid I’ve been hearing about how Canada is the best. As I’ve grown I have seen the native schools, the local governments that don’t care, rising cost of living, rising food costs, pathetic wages, and a Canadian government that doesn’t seem to notice or care about any of our day to day issues.

Canada is most definitely not the best country in the world, far from it. Let’s fix it, not sit here pretending it’s a great place, cause it isn’t, not anymore.

nyan,

Actually, saying “Canada is the best country in the world” doesn’t mean that Canada is any good at all—it just means that the world is full of horrible countries. Just like it’s possible for the student who scores highest on a test to still get a failing grade, if everyone else failed too.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

Canada is the second best country in the world to live in this year.

Son_of_dad,

If you’re wealthy it’s a good country. Not if you’re a working class Canadian

redditron_2000_4,

I moved from Canada to the USA, and what I have seen is that Canada is less unequal than the US. If you are working class in Canada there is at least some social safety net. In the US the rich are richer and the poor are poorer. Canada is moving that way but still has more protections for those on the bottom.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

But the US has guns, hate speech, and discrimination disguised as religious freedom.

Son_of_dad,

The problem I find is that the safety net is there only if you’re rock bottom poor. If you’re lower income but barely scraping by, there’s no help for you. They are helping homeowners pay their property taxes, helping corporations with corporate welfare, and helping the poorest afford food, but if you’re just above the poverty line, you’re on your own.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

What country do you think you could live in where the government would give you money?

Son_of_dad,

Canada. If you’re rich and failing, they give you money. If you’re the citizen of another country, and need foreign aid, they give you money.

If you’re a struggling, working class Canadian, not so much.

My employer, a multi million dollar company, got $500k in aid. I who have $0 in my account after bills, got zero assistance during the pandemic. I had a second job at a hospital during the pandemic too, working directly for the government. What did I get out of it? I got COVID, no protections and a half a dozen co-workers dead.

MapleEngineer, (edited )
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

You never answered my question. What country do you think gives money to its citizens like you?

Son_of_dad,

Norway

MapleEngineer, (edited )
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

So you think that Norway just gives people money?

Son_of_dad,

The government hands rich people money all the time. I’m a full time worker who wants my government to get off it’s ass and fix the housing and wage situation that’s killing us, I’m not asking for money.I make money, but because “my government” doesn’t care about reality, my wages and costs aren’t consistent and they don’t seem to see an issue cause they do nothing about it. Nobody is asking for free money, I’m asking for this country to focus on Canadians instead of focusing 100% of their time and money on foreign affairs

MapleEngineer, (edited )
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

This is exactly what I was taking about in another comment. Ego. You can’t see that the things that we do in terms of foreign policy keep you safe in the long run. The world is confusing and scary and you want more than you have right now so it’s Canada’s fault and Trudeau’s fault and foreigners fault. It’s everyone’s fault but yours.

Canada is a beautiful, free, and open country and I love it. I’m sorry that you don’t.

Son_of_dad,

I’m native blood so my country is lovely, it’s the colonial system that favors the white and wealthy that I hate. Your system isn’t built for people who look like me, and it doesn’t care what happens to me.

MapleEngineer, (edited )
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

I’ll be sure to let my wife (who is Raven Clan) know that.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

Hey, so we were taking about how the fact that you have, “Indian blood” meant that the system was stacked against you. I said I would mention that to my wife, who has status.

What I’m wondering is this: When I consider my family, daughter number 1 who is a department head at an NHS hospital in London, daughter number 2 who is in med school, son (the youngest) who is planning to become an engineer, my wife’s younger brother who is a mining engineer and mine manager at a larger copper mine in Arizona, wife’s youngest brother who is a software engineer and a senior developer and program manager at Microsoft, and our friends who are successful small business owners, small farmers, and retired teachers if the decisions you have made don’t have a much bigger impact on how you’re making your way through life than a historical disadvantage you might have, if any.

Perhaps you have been convinced that the system is stacked against you to manipulated you into voting against your own self-interest?

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

That’s not what I asked. What country do you think you could move to that would give you money? Or, since we both know that’s nonsense, what country do you think gives it’s own citizens like you money?

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

I’m not wealthy. I’ve been to lots of countries. There is no place that I would rather live than Canada. Maybe your problem is you?

Son_of_dad,

Oh I’m the problem? I’m the one who is setting the pathetic wages, rising costs of living and rising food costs? I’m the reason people are living paycheck to paycheck in the “greatest country”? Drop this nationalism bullshit, stop jerking off to the country’s propaganda.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

I think that the issue is all ego, like the Freudian ego. The people who are complaining can’t see past their own belly buttons. “I’m having a shitty time and I’m miserable therefore it’s a shitty country.” Nah, dog. There are a fuck of a lot of us out here who thinks its a great country and love it.

I’m one of those people.

MapleEngineer,
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

What country do you think isn’t having those problems right now?

Grimpen,

I think this is the thing to remember. Canada is the (second) best country in the world, according to one specific set of criteria. By other metrics it may be best, or slightly lower.

Any individual probably has done different weightings to any metric that might be used to compare countries, so your personal list may be different.

But! But, every country has it’s problems. Perfection does not exist. Every country could also be better.

Ultimately we should all appreciate what is working and work towards making things better. In reality, people are going to also disagree with what is working and what would be better though. I’m pretty sure the Qonvoyers are a great example of this.

The Qonvoyers want to help “real Canadians”. Their perception of “better” does not align with mine.

MapleEngineer, (edited )
@MapleEngineer@lemmy.ca avatar

Yes. It doesn’t mean Canada is perfect and it doesn’t mean that things can’t be improved but it does mean that the people who are pissing and moaning and suckling at the teat of the Egyptian anti-Canadian propaganda farm would be far worse off if they didn’t live here.

ChicoSuave,

It makes sense when viewed as the actions of an immature child.

“It’s mine and if I can’t have it then no one can.”

It’s not based on logic, it’s entirely based on their own perception of greed and the requirements for fulfillment.

kent_eh,

With an added dose of zero sum game.

“The only way for me to win is to make everyone else lose”

Powerpoint,

They don’t love Canada. They love the USA or whatever other foreign interests manipulated them into occupying Ottawa.

phx,

They hate the Canada that is. They’re in love with the idea of a Canada that may have been.

MAGA is a good example of this. Many of the things that they think will make America “great” are actually pretty awful and/or came at somebody else’s expense

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