Your opinion on motorcycles?

I am new to FuckCars, and personally, I feel very much aligned to this ideology. Particularly, the amout of environmental damage the fuel consumption causes, concerns me.

However, sometimes, I feel like I am a hypocrite, because I drive a motorcycle, which again, causes pollution. But, in my defense, I always try to use my bicycle if I can, and use my motorbike only when necessary, because public transportation system isn’t great in my city. Also, the amount of pollutants my bike releases is way less when compared to a car, or even a small hatchback.

The bike in question is only 160cc, and does 30-40 km/litre (~18-25 miles/litre).

So, what is your opinion on all this, and how can I improve my situation?

j4k3,
@j4k3@lemmy.world avatar

I only barely survived an unavoidable and unpredictable crash on a road bicycle with 2 cars. I’ve had 6 crashes with 7 cars in 170k miles on the bike since 2009. Only 2 of those crashes were bad. However I only barely survived crashing at 30mph where the weight of the bike was insignificant. I wouldn’t have survived that same crash on anything more significant or at any higher speed. I had the critical damage of C1 and a fracture at the base of my skull. I was told if I hadn’t been knocked out completely, I would have died if I had moved before the swelling could keep everything together.

I wouldn’t recommend motorcycles until humans decide to replace driver’s side airbag covers with daggers. People drive like fools and since their incompetence is nonlethal to them, the culture of incompetence is unavoidable.

You likely think you can avoid anything by just being careful. This is not the case. I was ultra cautious and went out of my way to avoid hazardous areas. Most of my hits were from illegal U-turns. If you can predict a random vehicle parallel parked on the side of the road will try and make an illegal U-turn suddenly without warning, directly in front of a large SUV that is passing them, you can avoid the crash that almost killed me. That is the level of stupid that finally got me even on a road bicycle.

The human body is not capable of handling the forces of collision. It doesn’t matter what kind of armored jacket you wear, it will never compare to a car’s tolerance. I’ve seen a lot of people die on bicycles including 3 people I knew. My cousin died on a motorcycle last month.

TruthAintEasy,
TruthAintEasy avatar

Grandpa told me: if you ride it isn't if you have a crash, but when and how bad

SoylentBlake,

Man everything you wrote here sucks and I’m sorry you’ve had to experience all that. Riding isn’t a “if” you crash, its a “when” you crash thing.

Even still, I find it preferable to being in a box isolated from the environment. Then it’s just more detached television. Being a part of the environment helps me feel alive.

BolexForSoup,
BolexForSoup avatar

It is hard to overstate how many people run red lights and do illegal turns. I see an illegal left or U-turn probably daily.

rudyharrelson,
rudyharrelson avatar

Glad you made it out relatively unscathed. My old man got killed when a negligent driver crashed into him while he was riding his bike at night. Motorcycles are death traps and I'm always uncomfortable when I'm on the road and one gets near my car.

I like that they're more fuel efficient than cars, and they're a thrill for the rider, but the inevitable incompetence of other drivers, or just plain bad luck like blowing a tire, has such a high mortality rate for bikers.

One of my dad's old biker buddies got hit by a teenage driver who'd just gotten their license. I'm not gonna harp on the kid too badly cause when you're a new driver, you're gonna make mistakes. Just sucks that one little mistake can cost someone so dearly. Dad's friend survived, but he's never been the same due to brain damage sustained in the crash. He wasn't wearing a DoT approved helmet at the time, though, so it's partially on him. His fake helmet snapped in half like a twig.

Biker culture (at least in the US) also has the unfortunate undercurrent of macho shit like "I don't wanna wear a helmet cause that's for sissies. I'll just die like a man." Helmets are mandatory in my state, but it's seldom enforced.

Trainguyrom,

Biker culture (at least in the US) also has the unfortunate undercurrent of macho shit like “I don’t wanna wear a helmet cause that’s for sissies. I’ll just die like a man.”

This is parts extra odd to me because the heavy leather jackets and clothing that are also part of that same culture are actually meant to be a form of light armor should you find yourself in a crash

wildcardology,

Imagine this in your city.

Manila

blazera,
blazera avatar

I love the concept. Cutting down on all the unnecessary extra weight of a car when most trips are single passenger anyway.

But most customers and manufacturers see them a lot differently. Meant for thrill seekers, speed chasers, and projecting more obnoxious masculinity. They need to be loud, smoky, and dangerously fast. They should have been first in line for electrification but instead they're lagging behind cars.

Hyperreality, (edited )

They should have been first in line for electrification but instead they're lagging behind cars.

Depends on where you live. Asia and Europe there are plenty, although they're often scooters or slower speed bikes. Not that you need much more in an urban environment.

There's also the whole electric bike thing. Depending on where you live, at least some electric bikes are actually closer to motorbikes. And if they're not, the electric bike is often subject to less stringent legislation and regulation than an electric motorbike. That can mean the difference between having to get a license or not.

e: relevant FortNine video:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O2zlYpy6QCM

Copperhead,

I currently own and use my fully electric Zero SR motorcycle for daily commuting. It's obviously much quieter and somewhat cleaner than a traditional ICE motorcycle but I would think motorcycles in general are cleaner than traditional vehicles (SUVs, Pickup Trucks, etc.). Just like any motorized vehicle however, you still deal with brake dust, tire dust/shavings, emissions, and other vehicle waste (like tire disposal or motor oil disposal) but on a smaller scale I think.

I reside in the US, specifically in a southeastern state, where public transportation as well as pedestrian infrastructure is absolutely abysmal and/or non-existent, in my opinion. I try to make the best of the situation by limiting my method of travel to my electric motorcycle where possible. I would prefer to walk to places if I could, but in most cases, I just think it isn't feasible or safe where I reside due to the vehicle-centric civil design of where I reside.

n3m37h,

I bought an Ebike so I can drive my car less

BolexForSoup,
BolexForSoup avatar

Motorcycles/scooters are better than cars in most scenarios except for 1) no carpooling (mostly), 2) can be very loud, 3) worse emissions (motorcycles mainly and not all), and 4) danger to the driver.

I think most people could operate with an electric scooter and a bicycle for 90% of what they need to do on a daily basis.

Gigan,
@Gigan@lemmy.world avatar

There’s definitely a tier list, and motorcycles are overall better imo. They’re smaller and generally get better gas mileage. I can’t say for certain, but if I had to guess people driving a motorcycle are also paying more attention to the road and less likely to hit pedestrians.

My biggest complaint with them is the noise and the emissions. Ideally they will be replaced by electric alternatives in the future and that will resolve both issues.

prettybunnys,

It may have changed but my understanding is emissions regulations on motorcycles tends to be much more lax than in cars.

Engine size often time changing the emissions standards, smaller engines often having less requirements.

From that perspective motorcycles are worse.

From the perspective of mass transit being the best option, motorcycles are worse.

Motorcycles fill the same role as cars, just less efficiently (saving on size).

The fossil fuel motor is the primary issue.

witty_username,

I think that sound pollution regulations should be enrforced fiercely.
Want to drive around on a motorcycle? Go right ahead. Want to mod the exhaust and create a multi km wide disturbance? Get your license revoked, get your vehicle taken away, get a mandatory rehabilitation course and community service.
I don’t understand why we tolerate the morons that think it’s okay to just straight up blast deafening noise at everyone and everything they happen to pass by

Jomn, (edited )
@Jomn@jlai.lu avatar

They usually are much noisier than cars which can be very annoying. But a big part of it is due to the type of people who ride them in my city, they usually really don’t care about others.

But if the motorbike is chosen and used correctly, they are better than most cars.

SoylentBlake, (edited )

Riders don’t necessarily like their rides that loud either, and obviously they don’t need to be, except it’s their number 1 defense on the road.

Drivers do not pay well enough attention, and especially in America, aren’t used to having riders all around them, or even ever consciously looking for riders. If a motorbike isn’t heard, it isn’t seen, and that creates a scene.

Let me tell ya, after being almost hit 5 dozen times even tho my bike is the loudest thing within 100m I can come off not giving a single fuck about anybody on or near that road either, but it’s not out of some crassness, it’s about me not being murdered by every Lexus or Mercedes that’s too important to be bothered to use a turn signal or check their fucking mirrors.

Jomn, (edited )
@Jomn@jlai.lu avatar

But then it’s a shame that the ones that have to suffer the most from this are the pedestrians (and animals, my dog is petrified every time that a motorbike passes by). We don’t have an easy solution for this, but fighting fire with fire is definitely not the way to go.

SoylentBlake,

I hate how loud the bikes gotta be. I’m right there with you, trust me. If there were more riders and people were just intuitively aware of bikes, like in SE Asia (it doesn’t need to be a river of riders, just more commonplace than now), then I think we could move past it towards something rational.

Currently it’s the best I can do. I’m a sub of this community, I fucking hate cars, hence, riding whenever possible as I don’t have the option of public transit to cover my bases in my area. I’ve been the guy trying to keep riders conscious as they lay in the pavement, more than a few times. It’s not a fond set of memories. And I really don’t want to take a turn either.

recapitated,

after being almost hit 5 dozen times even tho my bike is the loudest thing within 100m

The term for this is “negative correlation”

Shareni,

I truly understood Indian beeping when I was sitting in a car and realised I could perfectly track every single bike around me. They start beeping when they get close to a car, and don’t stop until they overtake it.

There’s no way to not hear someone constantly going BEEEP BEEP BEEEEEEP BEP BEP BEEEEEEEEEP. On the other hand, even obnoxiousously loud exhausts can partially blend in the background noise and music.

SoylentBlake,

It’s just trading one set of obnoxious noises for another and we’d be in a thread about that instead, y’know.

Clearly ppl don’t like motorcycles here. Maybe they name should change to fuckcars+motorbikes.

AA5B,

No, surprisingly it’s not. My impression of beeping g in India was communication and coordination. Here in the US, it’s usually outrage, wounded pride.

I find that in myself too, despite advising my teens to watch out for it. When someone endangers you by doing something stupid, it’s easy to fall into that trap, and we have very little tradition of communication

hips_and_nips, (edited )

While the pollutant volume is smaller, the exhaust is typically worse that a car/truck: gearjunkie.com/…/motorcycle-vs-vehicle-emissions

Lettuceeatlettuce,
@Lettuceeatlettuce@lemmy.ml avatar

It’s all or something, not all or nothing. You do the best you can. Use as much public transport or eco-friendly modes of transport. Walk, if you cant walk, bike/scoot, if you cant bike or scoot, bus/tram, if not that, motorcycle.

You get the idea, sounds like you’re already approaching this the right way, doing what you can. Be safe, driving motorcycles is dangerous, especially in the US.

homoludens,

And fight for political change.

ClockworkOtter,

They should be more common since they’re smaller and lighter, especially for individual travel when public transport or bicycles aren’t feasible. However, as everyone who rides one knows, it’s drivers that make them dangerous.

With larger electric bicycles overlapping with scooters for city travel they really have so much potential.

UraniumBlazer,
  1. Don’t feel bad for using motorized vehicles, be it a car or a motorcycle. Do what is the most you can do personally. Of course, if you’re one of those big truck ppl then u’r a problem. Unfortunately, we don’t have infrastructure suitable for non motorized vehicles everywhere. Shifting the blame from governments to individuals in this case is comparable to the individual carbon footprint bs.
  2. While motorcycles are much better than cars, they’re still bad. They cause air and sound pollution. Because of their ability to go higher speeds, they make cities unsafe for pedestrians and bicyclists (basically humans). Essentially, they do all the bad things that cars do, but just with a lower magnitude.
marx2k,

I had scooters, powerful scooters, motorcycles and very powerful motorcycles.

In the end I gave up that noise of transport

I love the front when being on two wheels, but there’s no way I can continue doing that in America.

Its just ridiculously dangerous with the way drivers in the US are

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