Can Reddit Federate? Should It?

Hey all,

I was just listening to the Lex Fridman podcast where Mark Zuckerberg mentioned Meta’s plans for a federated platform. It got me wondering: Could Reddit follow that path too?

Are there technical or financial obstacles that might prevent this? More importantly, should Reddit even consider this move? Would it be a win or a loss for us, the users, and for internet culture in general? Keen to hear your thoughts on this!

(I’m a recent Reddit refugee, fed up with the situation over there. Found Lemmy searching for info on homelab during the blackout. Found all the main things I need here. And the community is great. Like Reddit used to be. Can’t see myself going back)

Hypx,
Hypx avatar

It is likely impossible because it would mean that the investors will have "lost." There won't ever be a way to make meaningful amounts of money off of Reddit if they did that. Anyone could just move to a less ad-ridden version of Reddit and just see Reddit posts from there. In fact, this is the very fight that Reddit is waging over its API access. So no, Reddit is likely to die off and be replaced by something else. And that something else can never be a big money maker.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

I’m more thinking what they can rescue from a. Sinking ship.

Some money may be better than none.

I don’t know if they owe people a heap of money, but it appears more corporate greed.

You can monetise the fediverse. It just takes investment and innovation.

Reddit is likely a cash cow right now.

ContentConsumer9999,

Maybe they could try to make instances pay to not be defederated from it.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

I couldn’t see that eventuating. But I could see myself paying to be part of a particular server. Kinda like a tax. But yeh. I can’t see it getting to a point that they could force you to stay.

AbouBenAdhem,

If they were willing to allow the back-end access to their servers that would require, they wouldn’t be in this situation to begin with.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Is that the only way to do it?

moog,

You either need API access, which is what started this whole fiasco, or you're relegated to scraping the site, which can be very cumbersome and prone to error.

dannym, (edited )

reddit can't federate, but if you're a moderator in a big subreddit, let me know, I might try to write a script to clone all the posts in that subreddit to a brand new lemmy instance (obviously you won't be able to after june 31st). I'm 100% serious. In fact, depending on the size of the subreddit, I might even be willing to federate it into my own instance.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

I know they can’t as of now. More a question of future business decisions. Like meta saying they want to develop a federated platform.

I do mod a large sub. But not interested in cloning it. I’m of the opinion that things should just happen naturally.

LostCause,

I‘m gonna say NO and NO.

If you still think spez has anything in mind even approaching this system, you haven‘t been paying attention. They just want to farm the users who are their product for as much money as possible. They grew a field of corn and now they reap. Imagine if the corn got feet and ran away, how inconvenient would that be?

And yeah, some of that hunger for money and power is about to pop up here too, but then we can defederate and move on to better instances in the blink of an eye, especially if we‘re used to this system already.

So knowing that is a possibility, why would they want to give us such a power? They‘re even taking the power of mods to have their subreddits private now to stop this. They are banning people who talk about Lemmy too much. If they could just frolick in their walled garden of Marketing and keep their products captive there, why federate or deal with competitors like that? Even their own apps are competition to be eliminated to small brained business dudes like spez.

That is all for my first NO, my second NO is because I enjoy lemmy and kbin and other instances and I don‘t want it to be ruined by corporations taking over instances I like with bots or other subversive tactics. Best if they stay where they are and hopefully in 10 years or so only exist as a bad memory in my brain from before people took back control of the internet.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Interesting points, and I get where you’re coming from. I’m 100% on your side. But playing devils advocate, consider this:

The idea of Reddit federating isn’t about spez or any individual, it’s about a larger structural shift that could happen over time.

Regarding your corn analogy, I’d argue that the corn already has feet. Users migrate to other platforms when they are unhappy, as we are seeing this right now. It’s less about stopping the corn from running away, and more about providing it with a field it doesn’t want to leave.

Your point on subreddits going private and concerns about increased censorship are valid. But remember, Reddit users already have the power to move. Federating just makes that more accessible and one could argue less likely to occur.

Your second ‘NO’ is about preserving the purity of the Fediverse from corporate influence, which I totally respect. However, isn’t it possible for Reddit to federate while respecting the core values of the Fediverse? (Is say there would need to be significant leadership change for that to occur)

If Reddit, or any other corporate platform, could federate while maintaining user privacy, autonomy, and freedom, wouldn’t that be a step in the right direction? And if they fail to respect those values, the beauty of the Fediverse is that we can defederate in a heartbeat.

I was just quite surprised when Zuckerberg was talking about integrating similar values and principles.

A_Chilean_Cyborg,
A_Chilean_Cyborg avatar

meta wants to do a federated plataform???

hamburgeraddict, (edited )

really isn't wise in a lot of ways when thinking about how people usually use facebook. imagine if you and your grandma's instances defederated from each other.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

It’s not Facebook. A new platform. I’ve never been a meta fan. Or a Zucker fan. But it was actually a really interesting conversation.

He could be absolutely full of shit, but if you take what he says on its face value, interesting points of view.

RomeCallen,

i think in some ways the zuck, while lacking of morals, is a true believer of, like, living on the web

its insane the amount of money and time has been dumped into the meta verse. i think he would do more if he could justify it

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Yeh. On the surface what he says seems great. But I am very skeptical about how it plays out in practice.

DoucheAsaurus,
DoucheAsaurus avatar

I mean, there's some things grandma doesn't need to see.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Yeh. Seems to be the case. He talked about it at length. Text based to start.

I would be suspicious that they are trying to love people away from Twitter.

Then monetise other areas of their metaverse.

I was never a fan of Zuckerberg, but I finished listening to that podcast quite hopeful.

Though he could just be lying about everything to keep people on side 🤷‍♂️

Sexypink,

Yea fuck that. I think it's about enough of people making decisions about what I get to see.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

You wouldn’t need to be on Reddit. But I see value in what Lemmy could bring to the table.

MentallyExhausted,

Hopefully they try in like 10 years and everyone defederates them

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

I’d hope there would be enough incentive both ways for that to not occur.

But if necessary. Sure.

I think there’s genuine value Lemmy could bring to Reddit. And visa versa.

tallwookie,
@tallwookie@lemmy.world avatar

reddit is better off being a closed platform.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Why?

tallwookie,
@tallwookie@lemmy.world avatar

so the cancer doesnt spread

gorkx,

@tallwookie i mean a corpse doesn't get more dead...well no wait necromancy can fix that. so I am wrong.

@LachlanUnchained

tallwookie,
@tallwookie@lemmy.world avatar

casts light

casts turn undead

casts holy smite

DoucheAsaurus,
DoucheAsaurus avatar

The bots have been eating it alive for a while now.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

That’s one way to look at it. The other is what can they salvage from the wreck. Does it have any intrinsic value.

toofarapart,

Technically? Sure. But it would likely require rewriting a bunch of systems which would be pretty expensive and I don't know why Reddit would want to do that right now.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Yeh. Maybe not right now. But I was frankly surprised to hear Zuckerberg openly talking about it. Must be in the zeitgeist.

onepinksheep,
onepinksheep avatar

His failed Meta VR project was essentially a federated system where various companies could run their own meta universes and visitors could cross over from one meta universe to the next.

TeddE,
@TeddE@lemmy.world avatar

Or Zuckerberg is watching his company rebrand go down in flames and is willing to say whatever tech buzzword makes him sound relevant again.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Quite possibly.

airportline,
@airportline@lemmy.world avatar

Even if they could, why would they?

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

So they don’t get left behind?? Dunno. Seems like people are starting to pay attention now to decentralised systems with big players now openly discussing it. If meta is serious about moving that direction, I don’t think it will be long for others to follow suit.

jcb2016_,

@LachlanUnchained I was on Reddit for 6 years and never heard of decentralized anything. I used this one twitter app and it was like login to mastodon. Like wtf is a mastodon 😭😭

AnonTwo,

I mean it's basically like the forums that reddit (mostly) killed back in the day. Just if those forums could all see each other whenever they wanted.

LachlanUnchained,
@LachlanUnchained@lemmyunchained.net avatar

Yeh. I had always heard about it. But didn’t understand how it worked.

airportline,
@airportline@lemmy.world avatar

Federating with smaller platforms would run counter to their goal of maximizing profit. That's the reason why they are killing third party apps to begin with.

In any case, most people don't really care if a platform is centralized or decentralized as long as it has the people or content they care about.

Also, I'd be worried about Meta.

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