Honestly I have no clue who lady liberty is meant to represent. I took a bad cartoon which I didn’t like and slightly improved on it, because the original was just broadly invalidating of and disrespectful towards the pro-Palestine movement.
Still plenty wrong with this cartoon, I just fixed the worst part.
I didn’t think the other one was necessarily tone deaf in the context it was made in but this one is definitely a lot more direct about what the specific problem is.
“I don’t have a problem with people protesting for Palestine, I have a problem with the people who are gonna immediately stop the day after voting closes.”
And before anyone tries to accuse me of anything, Palestinian American who’s family are Nakba victims, I’m allowed to be upset about people using my family’s dead as fetish porn for the cynical politics they were going to try to push before the election anyways.
Or does everyone forget how so concerned people were about forgetting that Joe Biden’s always been known as a gaffe machine and stutterer in 2020?
Should’ve started on those things she’s holding signs for 4 years ago tbh. Can you really expect people to be invested in your promise that you’ll stop the shitheads from fucking people over if you did a very poor job in stopping shitheads from fucking people over?
“Everyone I disagree with is a nazi collaborator who deserves to suffer” is a hell of a opinion
MFer I don’t even live in your country, tell me more about how fascism in the US is my fault for thinking they should murder less people and you wish all manner of evil on me. That makes you a great fucking person.
it’s extreme rhetoric for sure, but you are a massive chode. I’ll allow it.
tell me more about how fascism in the US is my fault for thinking they should murder less people and you wish all manner of evil on me.
bitch, if you’re not even part of the solution will you shut the fuck up and let us try and save our country already? you don’t have skin in this game or leverage but to trash the one side that’s trying to fix shit.
go back to the boogaloo or whatever rock you crawled out from.
Americans may have the luxury to not care about what their empire does to the rest of the world. The global south, not as much.
Considering we’re all here arguing about politics, this is a fantastically stupid take. You have no leverage but to shit on biden when trump is an existential threat to your people, that’s fucking hilarious. Trump called you ‘shithole countries’ and here you are supporting him. How ridiculously dense are you?
Ah yes, we moved to the “you disagree with Biden’s support of genocide therefore you support Trump because my mind can’t comprehend asking politicians to earn my vote” part of the discourse.
MFer you want to talk about threat to people, talk to the 13000 dead children.
i can’t tell if you are being sarcastic (/gen, im not getting a read on the tone here, no hard feelings) so i won’t respond except to say, my main problem with the guy is he has never been critical of US complicity in apartheid and genocide
this one isn’t either
e: before you knee jerk downvote, please see my full analysis of this piece. we probably agree on more than you think.
Biden apologists are similar to the people that deny Tienanmen Square etc. Somehow their glorious leader can do no war crimes or even Genocide. Also he fits practically every definition of a fascist.
First, why do you capitalize the ‘F’ in fascist?
Great question not sure myself but it’s how many other people did it so I just copied it. Likely because it’s a name. Apparently there’s no consensus on the capitalization.
If Trump isn’t a fascist, why do Democrats keep saying that we must vote to give the Biden/Netanyahu genocide a mandate in order to stop Trump on the grounds that he’s a fascist?
TLDR: comparison is the thief of actually having a good political discussion.
I’m getting kinda sick of this “both sides” discourse.
On one hand, you’ve got a slightly reductionist view that crushes discussion (“Biden and trump are the same, they support the capitalist class”). It also fails to frame the discussion in a way that is actually productive, since saying the jump is a bit big for most people to make, and if you are trying to point out similarities from candidates that are different in some ways you only make it easy to point out whatever differences exist. Rather than discussing the similarities, you are now talking about their differences. Congratulations, you’ve now ruined a potentially useful conversation. Your reductionist view has done nothing to further discussions and now some people hate you.
On the other hand, you often run into whataboutisms. I’ve compared trump and biden in ways that make them similar, and instead of saying “Huh, both of those people have the same fascistic border policy, maybe we should talk about it” it turns into “But think of the children that biden isn’t separating from their families!” Biden’s enthusiastic support of a state carrying out a blatant genocide and trump’s support of the same state is terrifying, but the “Well trump would let them do it faster” is exhausting. No shit the fascist in all categories is gonna support increasing the speed of the genocide. That isn’t the point of that discussion, and it’s obvious to everyone that it is the case. And this constant comparison with trump never lets Biden stand on his own.
Look, i’m gonna be frank and say I hate Biden, if you haven’t already noticed from my writing. i’ve hated him before October 7th, so don’t worry, I’m not only angry about his genocidal enthusiasm. I’m an anarchist and I’m not electoralist, so finding a candidate I like is a minor impossibility. I’m also queer and have queer folk that I love deeply so I’m not making any decisions about hating the one not anti-queer candidate we’ve got lightly.
No shit the fascist in all categories is gonna support increasing the speed of the genocide. That isn’t the point of that discussion, and it’s obvious to everyone that it is the case
But it’s not obvious to everyone. I just made a thread that was filled with people saying otherwise. Another post was made 24 hours ago that was filled with people saying otherwise. There are people in THIS comment section saying otherwise.
You were seeing people say that trump wouldn’t speed up the genocide? I don’t think I’ve ever seen anyone make that claim in good faith, except possibly in relation to what trump was saying about the war needing to end because of optics, but that’s a whole different can of worms regarding why he is saying it and stuff.
Or were you seeing people say “Why does that matter when the problem should be about the presence of genocide, rather than the rate of it”
First, Democrats would actually oppose genocide if Trump was president. The largest protest movement in American history happened under Trump! Under Biden, Democrats just stay home and scold anyone who protests for hurting Biden’s election chances.
Second, Trump is a fucking moron. He’ll fuck it up. Trump would alienate Israel even more, turning it into a pariah state. Trump would weaken and isolate the US hegemon even further, driving more and more countries into China’s arms. Trump might even trigger the collapse of the US itself, the collapse of NATO, the collapse of ECOWAS, the collapse of ASEAN, thus freeing the world of the Great Satan’s empire. Inshallah~
The 6 Palestinians I know (from protests in the US), 2 in Gaza and 1 in the West Bank they all tell me they could care less Biden vs Trump, But if has to be one… with Trump there is more chances of change in the region, even at the cost of more lives. Besides, it will be far easier to regional countries and the European ones to distance from a link between Trump’s US and Israel.
The same thing will continue happening regardless who is elected. You didn’t progress to genocide from one day to the next, this was a slow cook over the last 50 years which wasn’t affected at all by the ruling puppet.
And Trump being elected wouldn’t change anything because Biden is already fully onboard
No matter who wins this November, Palestinians are still going to suffer from this genocide, because neither side is going to stop Israel. It’s not going to be better or worse with Trump
Whether it’s the guy who wants them to kill every Palestinian, or the guy who is gonna sit there and let them kill every Palestinian while wringing his hands and reaffirming the unconditional support for Israel, the Palestinians are still dead and murdered. The fact that you’re arguing that one side is better is absolutely fucking absurd.
You were seeing people say that trump wouldn’t speed up the genocide?
None of these are saying trump won’t speed up the genocide.
The first one is probably the worst take, not gonna lie. While I love the first and third sentence, since it points out a campist tendency people tend to have, the rest of the take is genuinely bad. Accelerationism is a terrible ideology. The second one is dubious, and the rest are hard to judge without context.
I think you should read the last one again.
Whether it’s the guy who wants them to kill every Palestinian, or the guy who is gonna sit there and let them kill every Palestinian while wringing his hands and reaffirming the unconditional support for Israel, the Palestinians are still dead and murdered. The fact that you’re arguing that one side is better is absolutely fucking absurd.
This isn’t a both sides take. Sure, it is comparing both sides, but the thing that makes it difference is they are arguing about the absurdity of the lesser evil argument whether or not it should even be considered valid.
I think that there’s an important takeaway in that. At what point is arguing about who has the better pro-genocide policies a waste of time? Instead of working towards change, it is just enforcing apathy and powerlessness.
Also, that last one is a better phrasing of what I said earlier: "Why does that matter when the problem should be about the presence of genocide, rather than the rate of it”
If you are seeing that as problematic, I’m genuinely concerned.
If you are talking to someone about american politics and they don’t understand that Trump is fascist, and supports more fascist positions than biden, they are either a trump supporter, a troll, or someone that isn’t worth discussing that stuff with.
Or you are thinking they are saying both sides are the same and you aren’t understanding what they are saying. I’m not accusing you specifically of this, but I’ve had many infuriating conversations with people when they are drawing what I said to “hur dur you are saying they are literally the same” when I’m not as a way to thought terminatingly end the discussion or derail it.
Instead of saying what about the “dumb people” just don’t feed the trolls. Leveling the conversation to be troll proof is a losing game
The original was ment to criticize those who criticize Biden over Palestine. They got rattled at the prospect of a Trump presidency and defend Biden in any situation.
Don’t put words in my mouth, thanks, the original was meant to point out that third party voters are voting to make all the depicted issues infinitely worse, including and especially Gaza.
Third party candidates might aim to fix those issues, sure. Unfortunately, so long as our elections remain First Past the Post, third party candidates are not viable. In this system, third party voters aren’t fixing anything.
Yeah almost like we fucking know better about where any of this moral criticism is headed for after 2016.
It’s really fucking hard to be taken seriously about how inexcusable genocide is when you’re touting that line in defense of letting the genocide come here too, which is what many of these fake Palestine supporters are trying to get away with.
I don’t have a problem with people who are protesting to support my people, I have a problem with the people who are gonna drop my people like a molten lead weight the second the polls close this year.
You “fixed” it by completely erasing the Palestinian genocide from the discourse. Do you see how absolutely heinous that is? “Oh genocide is controversial? Well I’ll just remove any mention of the genocide!”
First, I addressed the issue by removing the utterly false smear of the pro-Palestine movement as self-obsessed and obstructionist in the face of human rights violations.
Next, I reject your assertion that I “erased genocide from the discourse.” My intention was to redirect the focus of the post towards a more accurate target, not to dismiss the seriousness of genocide. I encourage you to reexamine the disclaimer included in the post, clarifying that it does not fully reflect my views, and understand that my aim was to be more sensitive to the efforts of the anti-genocide movement.
Lastly, I kindly ask you to consider your tone. I prefer not to resort to reporting or blocking, but sudden abrasive behavior like this makes the platform unwelcoming for many users.
The first meme was bad for sure but you made it worse. You literally took the Palestinian flag out of the picture. Its the reason all those people are not voting for Biden. And you then you slapped some generic meme shit over their sign, their opinions. As though all the students in the encampments aren’t in it for a specific just cause. Its even more disrespectful to the anti-genocide movement to not even mention the genocide.
For all this the tone of my criticism is absolutely appropriate. It is harsh because you deserve harsh criticism.
encourage you to reexamine the disclaimer included in the post, clarifying that it does not fully reflect my views
If you dont stand with your posts then delete them.
For those observing, this is a person who expects no consequences for their actions. I’ve criticized their actions and immediately its “watch your tone” while not engaging with the actual criticism. Now am I criticizing the individual themself.
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