A few weeks with Ubuntu as desktop and I am reminded of why I always end up switching to Kubuntu (KDE).
For some reason GNOME strives to completely dumb down and simplify the desktop and all its apps. Who is this hypothetical user in 2023 they are designing for who is so new to desktop computing that a few settings/buttons in an app will scare them? 🙄
@codeyarns I don’t understand why making things easier to understand and use is so looked down upon by some people. This of course comes at the cost of not having every single possible feature and preference possible, but that’s a sacrifice that’s more than worth it to a lot of us. Different desktops accomodate different people. Have you considered that non-power users aren’t necessarily «dumb»? Their needs are just as valid as yours.
@codeyarns I understand and respect that opinion, but I am curious what specifically frustrated you. I quite enjoy the GNOME workflow and do not use many extensions, instead preferring a vanilla experience. I know that I am probably in the minority though, but it is so simple to launch apps (SUPER + type first few letters) and switch workspaces without reaching for the mouse.
@jmichaelsturm Minimalization of settings/customization in the GNOME desktop & its default apps over the years.
Example: Path in Files/Nautilus used to be editable, now that feature is hidden behind a Ctrl+L shortcut. Abs path of common dirs are hidden, like "Home" instead of /home/joe.
Why hide the filesystem? Who is this hypothetical GNOME user whose understanding of filesystems is more minimal than Windows/MacOS users of the past 30 years?
@codeyarns
> Path in Files/Nautilus used to be editable, now that feature is hidden behind a Ctrl+L shortcut.
FWIW this might change again at some point in the future, we’ve discussed making it clickable again.
> Abs path of common dirs are hidden, like "Home" instead of /home/joe.
This is an aesthetic detail. I agree that it can be an inconvenience to some people in some cases, but for people who usually don’t navigate to root with their GUI file manager, I’d argue it’s a net positive.
@codeyarns My point is that there are reasons behind these decisions, and while they may not be valid reasons to you, that doesn’t mean that they are based on «arrogance» or «looking down on users».
@codeyarns@jmichaelsturm oh man thanks for that Ctrl+L shortcut! I legit have been navigating to the folder I want via bash and then opening Nautilus through the shell
@davidskeck@jmichaelsturm I clicked around that Files/Nautilus UI for quite a bit in every which way, gave up and searched online to finally find that.
@codeyarns@davidskeck@jmichaelsturm yeah this is definitely a papercut I'd like to fix; it was brought up in a GNOME design call recently and it seemed like the consensus was that clicking in an empty spot in the path bar should just change it into the location entry, but there was some technical reason it doesn't do that at the moment. I'll try to find the issue and see if we can shepherd it along, because it's annoying as-is!
@codeyarns@davidskeck@jmichaelsturm here's the latest: the design team agrees clicking/tapping in any empty space in the path bar or on the current folder should enter the Edit Location mode. 👍 It also makes sense to add it to the menu.
My understanding is that it wouldn't have made as much sense with how the pathbar used to work, but it makes more sense with how it works now. So hopefully we can get that closed soon!
@swordplay The sad part is that the GNOME UI has always looked so unique, modern and beautiful. That is why I always give it a shot. But they've been constantly dumbing the capabilities down, removing every trace of settings/customization.
@codeyarns@swordplay I think the past five releases each added settings and capabilities, including major cross-desktop collaboration to improve customization. 🤷♂️
@swordplay@codeyarns it’s tiring to put in the work—based DIRECTLY on substantial user feedback, research, and testing—then have people repeat “they hate users and just remove settings and customization” when that’s demonstrably false.
At the same time: if you prefer something else or GNOME doesn’t jive w/you, that’s cool! There’s a reason different DEs exist. We all work together on stuff, anyway, so it all improves over time. But can we not repeatedly shit on the people making Free software?
@swordplay@codeyarns I’m genuinely sorry if my attitude came off as anything other than respectful—I follow the #GNOME hashtag and this thread appeared there, and I thought some measured discussion would be welcome.
In general I think it’s important to remember that the people behind open source projects are just people doing their best. It is absolutely fine to disagree about and prefer different things, and you are of course welcome to feel however you feel, I’m not arguing that. 😅
Add comment