Contrary to some of the discourse on rexxit, I don't think the goal should be a "reddit killer" - just to breath life into this corner of the fediverse

This is just sort of a stream of thought from somebody who has been glued to my screen tracking the drama from the past week or so., and also watched the digg exodus happen (although I never used digg, just watched it from reddit's perspective)

Been spending a lot of time browsing /r/redditalternatives and the different drama threads from the past week and seen a lot of back and forth about "Where are we moving to?". And I think a lot of the mentality is that things are going to unfold for reddit like they did for digg. But I think this is wrong for a number of reasons.

First off, the scale is much different. At it's peak, digg had 30 million monthly active users. Reddit has over 50 million daily active users. Social media happens at a different scale than it did back then. Twitter wasn't something world leaders used as a communication tool. Facebook was still in it's nascent, hip stage. Instagram, well that was still being developed.

So, that sort of exodus is never going to happen. Reddit and these other social media platforms are here to stay. I mean, Elon absolutely destroyed twitter's reputation in the publics eye and the site still tanked the hit.

I don't think that should even be the goal either. I'm not here out here hoping for reddit to shutdown. I haven't really cared about reddit as an entity since the early days. Over a decade of eternal september events (Anybody remember how big the Obama AMA was?), mishandling by the company, and just changing my internet browsing habits has left me uninterested in reddit as whole. Reddit to me is just a host to the other smaller communities inside.

And that is where I think the fedivserse, specifically this kbin/lemmy "threadiverse" portion of it, has something useful to offer. Instead of some big platform being the host of these communities, it is the smaller communities coming together to build the larger platform in the aggregate. It is actually a new(ish) way to do social media all together.

That's not to say there aren't issues. The influx of users has really shown the different ui/ux and technological challenges of the system, but these are the early days. The people here now are early adopters (obviously not the earliest adopters, hats off to y'all). This is our chance to work out the kinks, and build a new community.

I don't want to say stop caring about reddit. Juicy drama is juicy drama. I just don't think that should be the centerpoint of conversation. I think the conversation should center the fediverse as this cool thing we are building and taking part in, rather than trying to be Reddit 2.

jayeless,
jayeless avatar

I totally agree. And I think as well, talking about Fedi software as a "Reddit killer" sets the wrong expectations. It reminds me of how you see some people describing Mastodon as "failed" because Twitter still has however many users and Mastodon has a lot less. But Mastodon isn't trying to be a "Twitter killer"; it's its own thing, and with the sheer number of active users and conversations etc. I'd say it's perfectly successful being its own thing. The same can be true of Kbin and Lemmy.

Of course, I'd be thrilled to see the big centralised sites decline into obscurity and the Fediverse (in all its heterogeneity) take its place. But unlike VC-backed overhyped apps, it just doesn't need to explode to 100 million users in no time flat to be considered a success. If people think Kbin or Lemmy are going to "kill" Reddit overnight they'll be disappointed, but if we calibrate our expectations right then we can focus on cultivating a great community in the here and now, which makes for a more appealing space for people who come along later.

landmesser,

it's its own thing

I think this phrase is very important.
kbin etc. has the opportunity to be it's own thing,
Doing stuff that Reddit cannot or will not do...

There is also a window of opportunity during the reddit subreaddit Black Out.
People will spend some time to look at alternatives.
Also, when many 3rd party apps close down there will be a second wave of lost people,
who don't like the official app,
and are shopping around.

Reddits power is the subreddits and their unpaid moderators...
Getting the moderators to say 'hey, this sub-reddit will continue at kbin during the sub-reddit blackout" might give the push that is needed.

arkcom,
arkcom avatar

As far as early adopters go, we are very early for kbin. @ernest was mostly posting updates to himself until the beginning of June,

Friend,
Friend avatar

I often found the atmosphere on reddit less than friendly compared to when I started using it over a decade ago, so I definitely won't be upset if this place doesn't attract every single reddit user!

BreadDog,
BreadDog avatar

Hopefully the federated aspect of that will also help with that, allow people to keep their tighter knit communities while still having access to the broader fediverse. Although, the flip side of that, I think in all likelihood, people are going to congregate on a few mega-instances.

1bluepixel,
1bluepixel avatar

Yeah, I was just thinking this today. When I joined Reddit, I remember thinking a lot of redditors were pretty cool and I wanted to hang out and chat. These days I'm mostly annoyed at comments and mostly commenting to argue.

I sure miss that sense of community. Still had it on smaller subreddits but it's been going away everywhere for a long while.

Dufurson,
Dufurson avatar

I've never responded to anything on Reddit and spent years there lurking, for what it's worth...

Sentrovasi,

I saw the title and interpreted this a bit differently. Still want to voice it out.

The Fediverse shouldn't just be a "reddit-killer" in that it replicates everything Reddit does here. I feel like creating wholesale subreddits in this space kind of loses the potential and possibilities that come with a new environment and space. Already all the old defaults are getting created and people are falling into old patterns of posting.

If people are hellbent on this being "Reddit, but on servers hosted by a bunch of different people", then I feel like the opportunity to iron out kinks and/or make this a unique space is lost.

themadcodger,
themadcodger avatar

I think that's where the beauty of the fediverse comes in. As we grow people will spin up more instances that will cater to a specific set of ideals or themes. It's your world, make it how you want. And then you can decide who you do and don't want to associate with.

neonfire,
neonfire avatar

I think there's a good difference between centralized control of all communities on one page owned by a single company, and a bunch of communities with the same name and idea, spread out so thinly that it's hard to find enough people with the same interest.

For instance things like subreddits for cities, sports teams, hacking, certain tv shows, etc. For instance with r/IASIP (It's Always Sunny subreddit) you would get posts from Megan Ganz, executive producer. What happens when she posts at IASIP@jabronies.egg but that's only 1/5 of the people who would want to see this post? What if a small indie game maker wants to talk about their game, but they don't know that most folk are on some other community because the name is different than how the dev would have named the community.

There's something weird and confusing about how different, but the same groups can connect and not cannibalize one another. I DO however like the idea that a few mods can't keep control of a whole community ignoring the demands of the people. While I started to disagree with the mods of my city's subreddit, they also had owned and pre-closed the subs of other names for the same city, keeping their monopoly of power. They can't pull that crap here.

It will be a challenge to find the equilibrium between centralization and 100 copies of r/pics

K3nzie,

What if a small indie game maker wants to talk about their game, but they don't know that most folk are on some other community

Thats the part im still trying to wrap my head around, I still registered and here I am cause Im all for change and fuck greedy corps, but I'm failing to see how communities can grow if scattered on multiple instances, as far as I understand, and i understand very little, anyone can create a copy of this, but it's not exactly the same per-se?

Ofcourse this is early stage, and I checked out and continue to check out all the alternatives, I truly do not know where people actually migrate, but I do know that dividing people when you could unite them in a single place won't allow communities to grow and avoid hive-mind situations, the less people the higher the chance that all think the same way. Theres a chance we stay scattered, cause everyone likes their own alternative and won't move where it seems theres a better option, and that would be the death of forums-like communities imo, at least with big, BIG numbers.

Armaell,

I do believe it should be the goal to kill reddit. Sadly.

It must be made an example for profit driven enterprises that users can still have the power to decide if they do stupid greed

BreadDog,
BreadDog avatar

That's the thing though. I don't really think we could and that's why it's not the the most useful thing to focus on. Like I said, the internet is a much different place than it was back in 2010 during the Digg v4 rollout. For every user that cares about 3rd party apps and how Steve Huffman behaves, there are 100 that just browse reddit for memes and and maybe whatever fandom they are a part of.

I just think there are two growth mentalities we can have. One is "How do we replace reddit" versus "How do we build something awesome that people will join naturally". I'm personally just... done with reddit. I care much more about what cool things we can build here.

Edit: That's not to say I haven't been glued to my screen watching all this blackout drama go down though. As the ceo famously said, "Popcorn tastes good".

iNeedScissors67,
iNeedScissors67 avatar

Yeah my wife is definitely one who just browses reddit at the end of the day for dog videos, AITA posts and stuff about marketing (her career). I told her about what was going on, she did some research and decided she won't be using Reddit (we'll see how long that lasts) so a little education went a long way. If there's a post around here that explains the situation, can someone link me to it so I can share with friends?

BreadDog,
BreadDog avatar

Took me a second to find it cause a lot of subs have already gone dark, but there is this infographic that is going around

iNeedScissors67,
iNeedScissors67 avatar

Thanks. Positively cracking up at the use of an image of a Plumbus on that infographic.

demvoter,
demvoter avatar

Ugh, no one should encourage people to go to Twitter.

FixedFun,
FixedFun avatar

Get into the social media owned by a transphobe nice

noodlejetski,

get on Twitter

oh no

themadcodger,
themadcodger avatar

Yeah I'm with you. We joined Reddit about the same time, and I've pretty much been a daily user. And you're right, I'm done with it. I don't care if they backtrack and it remains popular. I like what we're building in the fediverse and I'm here to stay. And I'm really excited to see where it goes.

inametaphor,
inametaphor avatar

I also want hunk it’s damaging to position this as a “Reddit replacement” because no, that’s not really how it works anymore. People still use Twitter; they’ll still use Reddit. It also carries an implicit assumption of growth mentality - that is, it will only be a “successful” Reddit Replacement if it gets as large. And sure, network effect is a real thing, but with federated servers, the fediverse as a whole doesn’t need the same shareholder-focused, growth-at-all-costs driver.

A Reddit Alternative, on the other hand, positions it as Reddit-like, but crucially not-Reddit.

inametaphor,
inametaphor avatar

WOW, my phone with that one. "I want hunk?"

loopgru,

The reddit killer is spez.

Kbin and other fediverse options have an opportunity to be a replacement and- hopefully- not make the same mistakes.

Mogster,
Mogster avatar

I don't think the fediverse will "kill" reddit, but recent events have obviously raised the profile of federated alternatives that will appeal to many people, just like Musk's Twitter takeover prompted a lot of people to try Mastodon. I'd much rather be here than on reddit given the choice, and I don't need reddit to die to enjoy where I am.

Bloonface,
Bloonface avatar

I mean, it's a nice idea, but I don't think anyone really owes anything to Kbin or the fediverse more generally.

It looks like Kbin may be close to reaching the critical mass where it has enough of a network effect that it functions as a centralised server, which can attract more people. But I would be exceptionally loathe to suggest that this would be some sort of renaissance for the fediverse - most people don't care about federation, decentralisation or any of that shit, they just want somewhere to read stuff and post.

sporkaholiic,

It doesn't have to kill reddit. Some people will leave and they will be looking for some place to go. I sure am.

I like what I see here so far.

Other people will stick around or just go back to scrolling Instagram or whatever. It won't die, it will just atrophy. Like fark and so many others before it. I mean myspace still exists. Just sayin.

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