Sleight of hand in combat

I am running a Tabaxi rogue that is currently 4th level.

In a recent fight, purely to piss off the leader of a band of thugs, my character ran in the 20ft and lifted his gold pouch (lucky roll 19, for a total of 26), then proceeded to bonus action disengage. The feline agility racial ability allows me to double speed for a round, so was able to disengage to a distance of 40ft.

The DM was totally ok with this, I didn’t actually do any damage and I “wasted” my turn for flavor and fun.

I get that you can’t use slight of hand to perform a disarm, but what is are your thoughts on lifting daggers/arrows/spell components etc…which are not being held by an enemy?

This could be very OP if I’m allowed to steal a wizards components pouch, rendering them significantly less of a threat.

southsamurai,
@southsamurai@sh.itjust.works avatar

Well, the basis of it is semi realistic, so I sure as hell wouldn’t object to it as DM. It’s the rules working just like they’re supposed to, imo.

There is a functional, real world difference between disarming someone and pickpocketing them during a physical encounter. You couldn’t use sleight of hand to disarm anyone, ever, because the thing is in their hand. Just like you can’t disarm something out of a pocket.

But there’s no reason you couldn’t take someone’s sword off their hip. Ever see those tethers cops use? Well, used to use. They use holsters that make it harder to snatch them now. Point being that a weapon that isn’t in your hand is vulnerable to sneaky grabs, or even non sneaky ones from a skilled attacker.

A pouch of components, that’s no different than a coin purse unless someone takes steps to make it so.

Here’s the thing though. Not all targets are equally difficult. Someone sees you coming, and you’re an enemy, they aren’t going to just stand there. The act of moving into their space changes it a good bit. If they’re also skilled in a similar way, i.e. having levels of rogue, they’ll recognize what you’re trying. A fighter isn’t going to keep a dagger just loosely hanging at hip, and let you reach for it. You might have to grapple first, then make the grab. Or maybe a touch attack equivalent. It isn’t the same as lifting a coin purse in a crowd, there’s a higher level of difficulty involved.

Admittedly, with a 19 roll, you should have succeeded anyway, once any other criteria were met.

But, yeah, in principle, that’s a totally valid idea. But it’s also relatively easy to counter, and it isn’t even unusual. If a component pouch is on a belt and firmly attached, that isn’t sleight of hand any more. Auto fail to try and grab the pouch and run. You could empty the pouch, but not take the whole thing. You could maybe call it a sunder attempt, but that’s still different.

A 20 foot dash is maybe three seconds, four from a dead stop. While you can get to someone before they can draw a weapon and hit you with it, it’s still a lot of telegraphing to overcome. An experienced thug is expecting trouble, and would have some variety of unarmed combat in their kit, so it wouldn’t be exactly as you described it, if the DM is thinking a little. But it’s within believability.

gofsckyourself,

Not a big deal, but FYI it’s “sleight”

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sleight_of_hand

Mouselemming, (edited )

Since you use it a lot, I think it’s worth telling you it’s “sleight” of hand. Slight of hand would mean you have small hands like a certain political grifter.

“Sleight” and “feint” (which is basically sleight of hands for sports, you’re using similar misdirection and speed) are both spelled “ei,” which makes them good mnemonics for each other.

absGeekNZ,
@absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz avatar

Noted

sbv,

An Arcane Trickster has invisible Mage Hand, so they can yoink pretty effectively.

absGeekNZ,
@absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz avatar

Agreed, it is super useful when you are trying to be sneaky.

zipzoopaboop,

I pretty much did that last time I played, gank the wizard scrolls

SzethFriendOfNimi,

Makes me think of the fights in Mistborn. And even the gunfights in the Wax and Wayne series.

Where the combat exists but is also a distraction for using Allomancer skills to grab, steal or sneak things.

Infynis,
@Infynis@midwest.social avatar

Gotta keep some extra bat guano in your mouth in case someone yoinks your component pouch

SzethFriendOfNimi,

Wayne? That you?

carmanut,

I was playing in a PF1e game where me and a friend got mind whammied and were told to disable/stop our allies in the best way we could. My character was a human Occultist that I had built to be great at Sleight of Hand, Steal maneuvers, and Disarm Maneuvers. So I snuck up on the party’s full caster and stole his component pouch (forcing the player to go through his prepared list and find which spells he could even still cast), and disarmed the archer and chucked his bow up the side of a building (since he was a snake-man with a tail instead of legs, and climbing was pretty much out of the question)

carmanut,

Either way, what you described isn’t OP, it’s a tactical choice, like disarming a martial character

absGeekNZ,
@absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz avatar

Exactly, you should be able to use disarm to remove an important item from a wizard. I see that as no different than taking the sword from a fighter.

Marafon,

Lmao the thought of a rogue yoinking a wizards component pouch and neutering a difficult encounter is so good it would be allowed at my table! But only once…

TheMinions,

What kind of wizard doesn’t keep a backup focus/pouch though? Stealing it before combat though? Totally viable.

Not all spells require material components.

absGeekNZ,
@absGeekNZ@lemmy.nz avatar

Not all spells require material components.

Totally true; there are some massively powerful spells that don’t have components. But it could make a big difference to the right encounter.

AlwaysNowNeverNotMe,
AlwaysNowNeverNotMe avatar

All my wizards stay double pouched up. Gotta keep that burner.

ArmoredThirteen,

Not during combat, but before combat we stole a party member’s component pouch once in the hopes they’d get killed without it. They had a powerful cloak that was kinda a running curse in the group, whoever had the cloak was destined to be murdered by another party member seeking to claim it

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