But does that count as actual campaign funds or campaign funds + PAC money? Because the latter is the issue. PAC money can be spent however the PAC wants on whatever the PAC wants and PACs can also be funded with donations of any size (and by anyone from any country). Thanks, SCOTUS.
He’s going to try to stiff the court. I’d bet money on it. He’s going to hide behind his lawyers and try to claim the law doesn’t apply the same way to an ex president. Just to delay long enough for the election.
The real test of our democracy will be whether or not they just arrest him when he tries that.
DeSantis has previously stated he won’t extradite the Cheeto to NY. So in event of arrest warrant he’d just stay away from NY like he already does or til he is president and he isn’t able to be arrested over that.
Not possible in this case, unless appeals court stays judgement then he’s only got 30 days from now to pay up, or else the government can start seizing assets.
There’s already a ban on transferring assets, and his businesses will have a court appointed monitor who will have the authority to review ALL payments the company makes. Also he can’t cover the payment with loans from any bank or other financial institution registered in New York, which is most of them, lmao
So is this another OJ Simpson-type situation? Don’t go to jail for what you did, just pay a fine for what you did? So no criminal consequences, but some civil ones for the same offense? I mean fraud must be a criminal offense in the US too, right?
This case involved charges of fraud made against Trump’s company by the State of New York. This was a civil case, not a criminal case. The consequences were not supposed to be criminal.
The defamation lawsuits brought by E. Jean Carroll were also civil cases. She was not charging Trump with the crime of raping her many years ago; She was suing him (twice) for lying about whether he raped her many years ago. (She won both times.)
I think I get where you are coming from, though. When a person is rich enough to pay the fine, and also shameless enough to revel in the infamy of being found liable in a civil dispute, it can seem like that person doesn’t end up suffering any significant consequence for their actions at all.
$355M is a lot of money. Add in the $83M owed to Carroll and these recent fines top $400M, which is an estimated amount of Trump’s liquid assets. Trump is now likely running out of cash-on-hand, which could explain his recent takeover of the Republican National Committee – the GOP’s fundraising (and fund-spending) organization.
Criminal consequences come from criminal cases. Trump has invested most of his legal defense against the criminal cases he is facing. Pending criminal cases involving Trump include:
1.) A RICO (“Racketeer Influenced and Corrupt Organizations”) case charged by the State of Georgia, against Trump and several others who allegedly conspired to steal the state’s 16 electoral votes, including by having the President call (Republican) Secretary of State Brad Raffensperger and ask him to “find 11,780 votes” for him. Four people in that case have already accepted a plea deal. This case is currently delayed by a motion to disqualify the DA because she had a romantic relationship with a lawyer her office hired to help prosecute the case.
2.) A federal case against Trump for retaining classified documents. A year or so ago, it was found that former President Trump and former VP Mike Pence had kept classified documents after they left office, and that when Joe Biden left the office of VP in 2017, he also kept some classified documents. Both Pence and Biden complied with federal investigation and surrendered the documents immediately when asked. Unlike Pence and Biden, Trump did not comply with federal investigation, and instead took action to conceal the classified documents in his possession. This case is being heard in a Florida courtroom, because Trump was storing these stolen national secrets in a spare bathroom at Mar-A-Lago. The judge is a Trump appointee, and has demonstrated a tendency to rule in Trumps favor whenever she can, but if she shows too much bias she may get taken off the case.
3.) A federal case against Trump for his involvement in the insurrectionist attempt to disrupt the electoral vote count in congress on January 6, 2021. Trump has been indicted on four charges in this case: “conspiracy to defraud the United States; conspiracy to obstruct an official proceeding; obstruction of and attempt to obstruct an official proceeding; and conspiracy against rights.” Trump’s defense has been that he has “absolute immunity” for any actions he took while serving as President. This claim of immunity has been denied and appealed multiple times. Trump has now asked the SCOTUS to hear his appeal, but they haven’t said if they will yet. Until they do, that case is on hold, but there’s no one else to appeal to higher than them. If SCOTUS chooses not to hear Trump’s immunity appeal, the lower court’s denial of it will stand and the case will go forward.
Yes, but why no criminal lawsuit as well? Defrauding people for hunderts of millions of dollars sure sounds like a offence to me that could/should lead to criminal charges. I don’t get how this would not be obvious now that a judge already has found Trump guilty in a civil lawsuit.
That’s clear. If I understand it correctly, all it would take is a public prosecutor to bring criminal charges. Even if the criminal case against Trump in this fraud case ended in an acquittal, the civil judgment would still stand. I’m just trying to understand what the prosecution’s thinking might be. Perhaps that they wanted to wait for the civil trial first in order to have a better chance with the jury in a criminal trial (even if the jury should in theory decide completely impartially, someone who has already been convicted of fraud will probably seem less credible). Another consideration could be related to the strange fact that an acquittal in the US prevents a retrial of the same case (as far as I know). Either way, it’s all rather strange, I think.
Because growing weed is a criminal offense. It probably shouldn’t be, but that’s how the law works.
What happened here was not a criminal case. So given the limited available punishment this is pretty severe. I mean does the idiot even have 300 million dollars?
If all of this fuckery doesn’t involve some element of back taxes to be collected, I’d be extemely surprised. And the back tax clamping is a fuck you pay me type clamping for sure.
He wasn’t charged with tax evasion, they charged him with over valuing his property values to get favorable loan rates. The lower tax evaluations were used against him.
Understood. But if the Trump apparatus has been undervaluing illegally, and this is the first time evidence of it is front and center, it might catch the attention of the taxman. And that’s generally not attention most would want.
Sadly I think the IRS would wait till after the election to avoid the appearance of trying to sway things in favor of the current administration. And even after, only pursue legal action if Trump doesn’t win. Fucking equal justice my ass.
trump’s 2020 campaign more then doubled that amount to spend $774 million(which, with his loss conveniently amounted to nothing).
This judgment, coupled with prejudgment interest, amounts to over $450 million.
And being barred from conducting business in New York is one heck of a cherry on top, although like many of you, I would have liked to see a lifetime ban.
His sons are also not allowed to have any role in Trump organizations in New York for 2 years and owe four million each.
There’s trumps $83 million ruling for his rape and defamation of carroll as well.
Congrats, Letitia James and judge engoron.
Can’t wait for the rest of these trials to get going.
Luckily, he’s already old and obese, so these three years are much more of a loss than say, being banned for 3 years at 25 years old. With any luck he won’t be around much longer anyways.
Why is it that people who commit fraud for less than $10,000 get jail for decades but commit fraud for millions and you only lose your ability to do business in a single state for 3 years?
I guarantee you Trump would pay way more than $300m if it meant dodging 10 years in prison.
If he could get the money. Considering the amount of grifting going on in the Trumpyverse just to pay some of the legal bills, I have a hard time believing that Trump would be able to come up with 300m without selling properties.
Which he’ll overvalue! Honestly, considering the trials I’m not sure who would even buy anything from him for a serious amount of money. Might have to be at fire sale prices to get people to bite.
There is a property he owns around me, and I didn’t know he owned it, but the first time i saw it I literally said “oh that looks like something that Trump would own”. And it was.
It’s the most ugly gory looking building in the world. It looks like the sort of thing that an african dictator would build, I cannot see anyone else wanting it.
Agreed, but I’m so used to see rich people never get shafted in any way that this is a pleasant surprise. Luckily for us, Trump had the bright idea to fuck over bankers instead of poor people
That’s the thing, he fucked over rich people, you can fuck over all the poor people you want and it’s fine, but fuck over one rich dude with the slightest pull and you’re done, that’s what happend to that FTX guy, he fucked over rich dudes and now he’s going to jail.
The judge also ordered that they pay substantial interest, pushing the penalty for the former president to $450 million, according to the attorney general, Letitia James.
What’s even funnier is initially the investigators were only looking to get $250M. During the case after a monitor was appointed, the Trump Org. started shuffling money around and they went after more money due to those actions.
While true, this is just a New York Supreme Court decision. He can still appeal to the Appellate Division then to the New York Court of Appeals. I can’t imagine he’ll get it turned over, but there’s a chance the amount might be lowered or something.
My understanding is that it must be paid in 30 days or, if he wants to appeal it, put into a trust or something. Effectively, removing his access to the money until the appeal is resolved.
My understanding is that the independent monitor that is tasked by the court to monitor Trump’s finances and assets would be able to make the payment with Trump’s assets. So basically, either Trump can make the payments himself or someone else will instead.
Trump has a few options in paying the court. He could pay up everything that he owes now in cash. Or he could try to get an appeal bond, meaning he wouldn’t have to pay all the cash up front in exchange for a premium and putting up collateral.
Trump could be required to deposit his portion of the full judgment plus interest during an appeal. Trump could also post a smaller amount with collateral and interest by securing a type of loan called an appeal bond. But he may have trouble finding a willing lender after Engoron found he lied to banks about his wealth.
Add comment