Hanging out with my nieces/nephews I now understand most the discipline I received as a child was most likely because I was being annoying and nothing to do with right or wrong.
80s. Mom. Same otherwise. Only now understanding my dad didn’t hate me for being ND. In the end, I think he envied that I learned to love myself in ways he couldn’t as an ND nerd in the 50s, and having to fit in, or getting jumped.
My dad was a drunken asshole who grew up in a tough world. He wasn’t suited to fatherhood, and wasn’t prepared to deal with a kid that was not him.
I suspect he had his own ND issues that would have been even more difficult for him do deal with as a kid in the 40s and 50s, not to mention his parents.
He was probably raised with the same kind of abuse I was, and more. I don’t hate him.
If there was any other option than whoever took the baby on the plane is an asshole.
Been there, done that, oldest turns 18 in 2 months.
Babies are not meant for air travel, take a train they are way better and you can walk around and rent your own room for barely more than the price of two tickets.
I say this as a person who will never get on an aircraft short of a handful of Xanax and a stiff drink.
Sometimes being annoying is doing something wrong. If a kid is deliberately being disruptive after repeatedly being told not to, then yeah, they’re doing something wrong.
You are correct (here comes the but) but often times that acting out isn’t just to be annoying. As a kid, being disruptive is sometimes the only way you can get the attention of your adult. We treat kids like anything outside of their basic needs is unimportant.
Not wanting to lecture anyone I’ll leave it at that.
actual addition to conversationThe only instinct a child has to get attention is to be disruptive. Eventually they learn patience, better verbiage, and how to time their interactions with others. Time isn’t really a concept yet and things are almost an “on/off” switch. Hunger doesn’t exist during playtime until Hunger is activated, in which case, Hunger is all that exists. Hunger can only be eliminated with help as the cookies remain furiously out of reach. HELP! “Attention-seeking behavior” is “hey I need help with something” in their first language. It’s up to the adults to figure out what’s going on. Finding out why they are being disruptive helps, a lot. If they feel they’re being ignored, work out spending time with them as reassurance… when convenient. If they’re hungry, take a moment to procure a proper snack, and then they’ll be satisfied. They might not even know what they need - do any of us really - and that’s where listening can be helpful. Again, time not being easily explained such an on/off age. I am not a child therapist. I’ve just worked with too many “difficult” kids.
Recently watched a home movie of our kids when they are little (18 years ago), so ages between 3 & 8.
It was a little horrifying to hear the absolute despair in our voices as my wife and I kept asking one kid after the other, “please stop.”
Three kids, all desperately trying to get ALL the attention. It’s amazing the five of us survived.
I don’t particularly recall the day the video was made. Hearing our voices, it sounds like we were just completely past the breaking point. Yet, consider: that was a moment that we considered adorable enough to record forever. Watching it now, they were adorable. However, it sounds like we were dying inside without realizing it.
I hear the same voices in every video. I love my kids and I love being a parent, but it’s amazing looking back how much that and all the other demands on us was just absolutely crushing the life out of us.
Technically, being annoying is against the rules of the household. If the household reflect society’s rules, the kid will learn valuable lessons, if not, the kid will learn the wrong lessons and will have to figure out on their own how those rules apply to real life l.
yep. the hardest part of being a parent is the patience to understand, and treat children as the underdeveloped humans they are. not everyone can do it
Also good to remember that almost nobody can do it everyday. It’s definitely good to be consistent with one’s approach, however all parents are human and will lose patience at times.
Oh sorry I was clicking through before I saw your comment, I must have clicked off the Winston one when I copied the link www.dailymotion.com/video/x7zw3ss
Apparently there’s a whole glitch in the matrix deal around this, because other people remember seeing them too (I saw a post on reddit) and I wasn’t born much before the 90s. I definitely remember Virginia slim commercials like back to back with RC cola ads during the daytime. I wonder if it was maybe from recorded vhs tapes or something because I can legit picture seeing these ads on tv in my childhood home.
It’s the only reasonable explanation I can come up with. The weird part is (it must just be tied to when I saw them?) they were decidedly in like a late 80s early 90s style. I’m mystified.
I’ve fucked this up a few times and snapped at my kids for things that it isn’t reasonable to expect of them. It’s really hard when they show maturity beyond their age and developmental level in some aspects because you can almost forget they aren’t fully developed and so the behavior can feel intentional. Like you get this flash of thinking, “I know the kid knows this is wrong,” and if you aren’t mindful in that moment, you can handle it wrong.
I have always made sure to calm myself down and then go talk to them about it. I apologize for losing my temper and, with an emphasis on how what I did was NOT ok, explain what I was feeling and why it made me react inappropriately. I’m pretty big on making them understand that adults are fallable and make mistakes, too.
We are taking the same approach and every word you said landed with me, matched my experience.
I’ll add that this is a VERY different strategy from the approaches taken by both my partner’s and my parents.
It’s not easy, but I think we’re raising better humans than ourselves. On days when it’s exhausting and you’re burned out and you feel like you can’t do it, cling to that.
100% agree. My childhood is a haze of physical and psychological abuse… not just between the parents and kids but between the adults as well. If I’m proud of anything, it’s the success I’ve had breaking that cycle. I slip up sometimes, but I can honestly say I’ve never called either of my kids hurtful names or laid a hand on them in anger.
When I was a kid I was always praised for being mature beyond my age.
Really what I was, was beaten down, defeated, paranoid … and therefore quiet and non-aggressive.
If a kid’s “maturity” consists of being quieter than the other kids, or perhaps of seeking out the company of adults rather than other kids, it’s possible that’s not maturity but rather a mask he’s wearing to avoid being attacked.
That mirrors my own childhood as well. It’s actually things like like standing up when I wouldn’t have expected it. As an example, I’ve overheard my preteen chastising her friends for talking about someone behind their back. Another example is our 2nd grader bringing home an assignment the other day where she was supposed to write what she wanted to be when she grew up, and her answer was “kind.”
Like holy shit kid… they’re both miles ahead of where I was at their ages around topics of justice and the skills it takes to maintain social cohesion, and they’re so much braver than I was and willing to use their social capital to stick up for people that can’t themselves. Then they’ll come home and get in a fight with each other over a spot on the couch or something insignificant like that.
Kids are supposed to be selfish assholes. They’re supposed to push boundaries and test people, and fight with other kids and learn respect the hard way (which is a lot easier kid v kid than it is adult v adult).
That’s the correct time and place to get that all out of one’s system: childhood.
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