it’s really not worth it… they have the license plate and can just go to their house later…
the driver is still a piece of shit for also endangering people’s lives (and the three year old)
Kid wants attention but isn’t getting it; Kid is trying to get the adults’ moods to match their own; Kid is experimenting with physics, weight and gravity; Kid mispprehended what would happen if the lamp fell.
I take serious issue with delivering tickets at home later. The fact that it’s your car is circumstantial. No way to prove you were driving.
You most likely know who was driving your car, and if it wasn’t you, you could identify who it was, but frankly, I don’t like it… Not for a traffic ticket where you’re presumed guilty and have to prove you don’t owe the state the fine… I don’t think it’s a great idea sending cops to a registered owners house in that context… Not with the current standards police are demonstrating.
Edit- don’t chase either… Minor speeding, taillight, ranva stop sign… Let it go ffs
I think his solution is to chase. Which is what they did and the results hurt people. My best guess is the rewards are better than the risks. I dunno. I’m just guessing
The premise is that a broken tail light doesn’t indicate a turn or a stop to other drivers, who should be paying attention anyway… It’s safety, public safety…
So to mitigate the risk of a collision because one of your three brake lights isn’t working, we gotta chase someone? Or in the case of going to their home, we’re gonna pay two cops an hours wage, reduce their ability to do anything else for anyone, and basically convict someone without any process whatsoever (unless they spend the time to contest it, and likely fail anyway just because cop says they did it) on circumstantial evidence?
Apply that to speeding… Apply it to rolling a stop sign… Apply it to 90%+ of the shit that gets ticketed…
The benefit to society for most traffic tickets is negligible at best. Let it go…
The benefit to society for most traffic tickets is negligible at best. Let it go…
This is an extremely naive view. While the cops enforcing the law are almost always corrupt and do it in a corrupt way
The “benefit is negligible” is a mistake. The fact is driving around without brake lights IS a problem, driving without a seatbelt IS a problem, speeding IS a problem. That is why these laws came about in the first place. The facts and statistics are very clear about the increased accidents.
You appear to be assuming that I’m suggesting citations be done away with entirely…
I’m suggesting that a citation doesn’t warrant a pursuit.
I’ll go a little further and say that a “no pursuit” policy isn’t appropriate either (and that sounds contradictory I’m sure, but if you publish it as a policy it becomes an incentive, not good), but a pursuit over a citation is negating, in a huge manner, the safety those citations provide…
Someone fleeing the police is a ridiculously more dangerous condition than an occasional citation getting skipped… how many people flee? 1%? I doubt it’s even that… The statistical deterrence isn’t affected by that, and arguably, the citation won’t have a statistical impact on that fringe group anyway. The reduction in accidents happens in the 99% that pull over and simply pay the fines.
In the UK, you would receive a letter with the details of the infraction. You can nominate someone else who was driving at the time but it defaults to the car’s registered owner.
And we have annual inspections (the MOT) or your insurance is invalid. You have to be taxed and insured or your car gets impounded.
Does the US not have annual inspections?
Quick edit: This is for things like speeding and other offences caught on camera. I doubt this would apply to a broken light as in the OP.
In the US inspections are controlled by each state. Some have yearly, some have basically none, and everything in between like only during change of ownership.
Same in Belgium and I assume most civilized countries. Either your car is stolen or it is not. If it is, you legally have to disclose that. If it is not, then “maybe I wasn’t the one driving but I’m not going to tell you ;) ;) ;)” is a bullshit excuse, and everyone knows it. You know it, the person you replied to knows it, the judge knows it.
I think there’s a whole-ass essay to be written on the Americans’ relationship to law that leads them to using the stupidest legal arguments like some kind of arcane ward… and actually succeeding.
Hot take: we make fun of sovereign citizens but “speed cameras are unenforceable if you don’t have a 4K picture of me at the wheel of what is unambiguously my car” is basically the same thought process.
with the current standards police are demonstrating, im not okay with them doing anything…
i meant more, “in a perfect world” kinda sense…
with parking tickets they can’t prov who drove either, so really the car gets the ticket…
the owner has to pay it to keep registration, though…
Its the owners car. Either they say who was responsible for that ticket or the owner is getting fined themselves.
And to be fair, these tickets are delivered by post. Only if you then didnt pay or show up to a hearing will you get into more serious trouble.
Assuming the courts work (much better than police either way), you get a fair process there. (of course, circumstances can be fabricated, but thats then up to the court, not much you can do really apart from forcing them to have video evidence in such easy things)
So when someone is evasive to police we should just go to their house later? It’s called probable cause and you don’t know if the people in the car are dangerous. I’m not a great supporter of the police but the hot takes in this thread are disappointingly dumb.
So if you were pulling someone over for a valid reason and they fled, you would just be like oh well I guess they got away? interesting mental gymnastics going on here, why do people let their blind hatred of a group subvert common sense?
you do know that what you suggested ironically is literally what happens in sane countries, right?
you try to ignore the police because of a broken tail light? they’ll just summon you to court, they have your plates. and you’ll be fined for fleeing the police and probably lose your driver’s license, at least temporarily and if it’s a temporary revocation you’ll definitely be required to attend further driver’s training at your own expense before you’re allowed to drive again.
you’re not home or pretend not to be? they’ll track you down and either deliver the summons directly or just arrest you.
that’s normal. that’s the normal thing to happen.
you know what’s not normal? Killing people because they don’t want to talk to you!
If you know that a light is broken you have a number plate which means that you can just send a ticket to the owner. At least that’s how it works here in Germany. If the owner didn’t drive then they’re welcome to tell police who drove, unless they reported the car as stolen they’re on the hook.
Oh and German police don’t chase pretty much ever and definitely not on the Autobahn. That’s what helicopters are for.
That’s how it is here in Denmark too. As usual, us Nordics do it the common sense way while US cops are pretty much as idiotic as they’re malicious, making them doubly dangerous to themselves and especially others.
Not saying that German and Danish cops don’t have their ACAB moments, mind you, but they ARE less awful (in part due to more and better training) and our systems constrain them much more effectively than the insane pro-cop US one.
Yeah, media portrayals and other cops keep attracting adrenaline junkies and people who want to control other people to the job and that’s two of the absolute WORST traits a cop could ever have.
I went to school for law enforcement and changed my mind after realizing it wasn’t for me but I had a professor who said people get into policing for 1 of 3 reasons:
It’s the family business
To get power/control over others
To genuinely help and protect people
It seemed at the time like he could tell the 3rd group was shrinking.
It’s actually why police deaths have gone down a bunch recently. It’s also why they die more by felonious assaults now than anything else.
Most police departments don’t chase unless the person they’re chasing has done something felonious like robbery, threaten to harm, etc.
In almost any town you’ll see people bitching about them not pulling people over anymore because a good chunk of people WANT them to do this still. It surprises me every time.
Are you comparing police chases to enforcing traffic laws? One may lead to the other but you can’t just stop enforcing laws because some people run. Also, if they do run I suspect they’ll just get a ticket in the mail or the cops show up at their house. I know some people drive unregistered and uninsured but that’s an even smaller portion still.
Let the typical traffic stops run. LET THEM. Radios operate at the speed of light. Cars do not.
(I’ll admit I did get away once. 1987, 16-yo, Tulsa OK, smack in the middle of the city. I was speeding like hell, cop was stuck in traffic, other lane. He lit up, I lit down and dodged into an industrial park. Still can’t believe that worked. Probably get SWAT after me today.)
Blaming the police for this seems like a real stretch...
It is 100% the drivers fault for running away, as implied by the article, to try to his illegal firearm.
People foam out of the mouth here any time someone says “someone that’s not a cop made a bad decision”.
The cops abuse their power plenty, but if you’re running from the cops in your pickup with your kid in the car, you chose violence here. Blaming solely the cops here is idiotic and implies that the driver of the pickup has no agency.
Look, nobody is saying the person who ran isn’t wrong. It’s a given, though. Nobody is saying the driver bears no responsibility for the outcome.
People foam at the mouth when others give police a complete pass for endangering the public. Criminals don’t work for us. Criminals aren’t supposed to be protecting us. Police are. So when they behave in a way that increases danger to us, of course we take issue with someone saying they’re blameless because a criminal did a crime.
So the police have no agency? They are required to make no decisions on whether what they are doing is worth it?
What about if they just started shooting at the car and hitting bystanders? Would that be 100% the driver’s fault, too?
Much like firing a weapon in a crowded area, a car chase is inherently dangerous and I would say any sane person in the vicinity of a cop trying to pull someone over for a broken tail light would prefer that person go free than to have their lives put in danger for a ticket for a broken tail light.
People often don’t act in their best interest or the best interest of society.
I currently live in a US city where the police haven’t enforced traffic laws since the mid 2010s. It has by far some of the highest accident rates in the country. Not just accidents, the “mad max” level shit that goes on like roving bands of dirt bikes is insane (like 20-30 together). It has become such a huge issue, it is destroying businesses, tourism, home ownership, etc, in the city.
To further expand, although you didn’t mention it. People in this thread say just get them later… How exactly? Probably a 5th of the license plates in this same city are fake. People are literally just printing fake temporary tags.
And no I’m not exaggerating about my examples, if anything I’m understating the problem for this particular city.
You live in a US city where the police haven’t enforced traffic laws since the mid 2010s. And no, you’re not exaggerating. Is the city Fast and Furious?
I live around Atlanta and it’s extremely uncommon to see someone pulled over from a traffic violation. Almost literally everyone that drives on 75 or 85 in the city is doing 75+ in a 55 and I’ve seen cops drive by them. Yep, cops going by them even faster. Hell, you’d probably be at a bigger risk traveling the speed limit there.
Over here, on the civilized side of the Atlantic Ocean, you’ll get a nice photo of yourself. Taken by a traffic camera and sent conveniently by mail. Along with a friendly note stating the amount that you owe the municipality. Having to stop a driver unless they pose an immediate risk seems ridiculous. This just doesn’t happen here.
Most of us over here oppose those types of cameras. We’re not so keen on government surveillance. I know it’s ironic that we’ll willingly let companies surveil us.
However, even with those, things don’t always happen around cameras. Especially when people know where they are. Don’t know how common this is over there but we see the same effect when we know there is a cop sitting at a speed trap.
An awful lot of vague bullshit in your claims. I’m not calling you a liar, but I require receipts. You sound exactly like every right-wing nutjob who insists BLM burned Portland to the ground, having never set foot on the west coast in their life.
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