Was going to comment... for the dude that looks like a crazy cat lady in her 90s that had way too much to drink last night and woke up in a ditch he's got some weird opinion on this.
This stance seems so off-brand for Dee and Alice. But they are pretty up there in age. I might not want to know my dad’s inner thoughts on this, either, I suppose. Still, for glam rockers raging against oppressive authority, it seems like they would have a more progressive take on this.
Your last sentiment is one I’d agree with. You’d think that any rocker from back in the day that was all about being anti authority would tell people to go out there and do what the fuck they want. Hearing an opinion like this feels off brand lol
“saying that he was “afraid that it’s also a fad”… the star said that he felt children were not mature enough to make major decisions about their gender identity"
You and Cooper both are setting fire to some pretty large strawmen. Standard transphobic tactic.
This is an example of a strawman argument. He's setting up this very specific idea of what is happening, and taking issue with it, when the vast majority of real world interactions are substantially more nuanced and specific to the kid and their family than the fake scenario put forth.
Yeah, but it’s part of the fantasy world they inhabit, and they make voting decisions based on their fantasy world. The fantasy world where liberals cast millions of votes on behalf of dead people (which everyone knows, but no one has ever talked about), can’t spend a week in NYC without getting mugged or gang raped, walk down a sidewalk in San Francisco without stepping in human feces, and where woke parents force their 8-year-olds to have gender surgery.
I wonder how many of these “nice but transphobic” people would revise themselves if they knew that even puberty blockers aren’t OTC, but require extensive therapy and professional counseling. I mean, it’s not a situation many people have direct experience with, so it’s easy to fall for fake stories. Of course, I also wonder how many of them don’t consider psychologists “real doctors” or psychology itself legitimate science.
Dee likes to defy categorization, but claims to be both libertarian and centrist. And he has been friends with Donald Trump for a long time, so his early support for Trump’s candidacy pissed off a lot of long-time fans. I think, but I could be wrong, that Snyder walked back his political support for Trump.
A long time ago Trump was a liberal democrat. It’s why he has an unusual set of friends on both sides.
The Clinton’s were good friends with Trump.
Early on I could see many democrats supporting him because of his democrat history. Previously trump was very pro-lgbtq rights and supported a single payer system.
Trump is and always has been a textbook narcissist. He doesn’t have any specific values beyond his own benefit. He supported the Clintons and democrats in New York because doing so was good for him and his business.
He’s a narcissist in layman’s terms. I’ve never liked the man. It’s not even politics as much as you feel dirty when you meet him. I’ll never understand the cult of Trump.
Aw, that's really disappointing. I always knew Alice Cooper was a Republican but never really dug into Dee Snider, just assuming he was cool from his time telling the PMRC to go fuck themselves. I guess not.
I feel like trans people and their allies should know who their enemies are and what they’re saying and doing, if only for their own safety.
It is infuriating, and its not the reasoned and insightful conversations about our personally held systems of normative values and the experience and empirical evidence that informs them that I wish we were having instead of these conversations, but I just think it’s irresponsible to turn a blind eye to it because ignoring it won’t make it go away and could let it fester and spread.
I see your point, but Alice Cooper is a washed up old hack. He’s not swinging any votes to DeSantis or anything like that.
For the sake of your mental health it’s important to focus on what matters and ignore that which doesn’t. In my opinion Alice Cooper does not matter and getting outraged by his opinion only distracts you from what’s really important.
Incredibly sad to see Alice Cooper using rote, boring anti-trans talking points, especially the old canard of 'any man can walk into a woman's restroom by saying he feels like a woman today,' which is something I've seen online more times than I can count and even heard in person from a few folks almost word-for-word. Don't be a parrot, Vincent.
I still don’t understand why the trans thing has suddenly become a “problem.” I’ve known trans people for 30 years. And I knew they existed before that. How the hell did it suddenly go from “Man wear skirt ha ha ha funny” at worst (not that that was good, just that it wasn’t what we have now) to “Fad! Groomers! They should die!”
We seem to be lurching as a society to a direction I don’t think I can live in.
I still don’t understand why the trans thing has suddenly become a “problem.”
The Tea Party (remember them?) & MAGA have taught the leaders of the conservative movement that they need to constant feed the crazy (that they created) or they'll get dumped for anyone who is better at whipping up fear, hate, and anger.
if they don't want to join Jesus in being called weak and liberal, then they need to constantly demonize some vulnerable minority. POCs, lesbians, and gays are not that vulnerable any more, so whose next? Transgender people! hence the "trans thing has suddenly become a “problem.” "
Terfs (particularly lesbian terfs) are the worst examples, they're bigots desperately trying to get the conservative patriarchial gaze's approval, but without wanting to out themselves as desperatetly wanting conservative patriarchial gaze's approval. Bigoted chucklefucks.
It's this. Attacking gay people is no longer acceptable to enough people that conservatives can get away with it as a culture war tact. They've moved onto trans people which is more successful because there's a lot fewer trans people. We're seeing a LOT of bullshit getting flipped around and making people mad about things they didn't use to care about. The drag-hate is a good example. Tons of examples from history where drag is supported and now it's a major battleground? Bullshit. Just another way to find a convenient target for the right to hate.
As I said, I’ve noticed that they didn’t care about this until recently. So this isn’t a “What marginalized group are we still allowed to be shitty too”, this is “Hey, let’s pick a group we never cared that much about and treat them the same way reasonable people treat pedophiles”. (This I’m spelling out in different words because it was supposed to be implied by my original question but nobody has addressed it)
They’re still, STILL, shitting on gays. The groomer crap? That was originally aimed at justifying an anti-LGBT bill (all LGBT, to the point it was described as “Don’t say Gay” by many) by a DeSantis spokeswoman, trans people were, at that point, just another target, not a primary target.
I appreciate the optimism here about how oh this is just because they can’t be crappy to lots of other groups, but they’re still being crappy to the other groups. Transpeople have not replaced gay and poor black people in the Conservative lexicon of “others” that should be blamed for society’s ills, they’ve joined them.
gay and poor black people fight back, they want to target a vulnerable minority group that hasn't been able to fight back yet. as soon as gay and poor black people stop fighting back, they'll be back on the menu.
I said, they haven’t stopped shitting on gays and black people.
This is getting to be a very frustrating conversation where each time I ask “OK why have trans people been added” everyone claims to be living in some alternate universe where the Republican party is now nice to black people and gay people and are claiming they’ve had to switch to trans people because blacks and gays are just too popular.
I’m glad for you that you live in this alternate universe where there you’re not seeing racist and homophobic (and sexist) motivated mass shootings in Orlando every few months. I love that in your alternate universe the Republicans are not trying to suppress the black vote and haven’t put up blockers to prevent, for example, constitutional amendments aimed at dealing with Jim Crow laws from being effective.
I’d love to fucking live there! Really I would!
Especially as in that world, there never was a “Don’t say Gay” law targeted primarily at Gay people that was so major that even a major corporation ended up on “our side” and spoke out against it for one time before going quiet because the Republicans were so unashamed of that law that they removed that corporation’s rights to manage infrastructure on its own property, even though that’d raise taxes for the rest of us.
I’m so glad you don’t live in that world!
But I do. Which is why I’ve asked the question multiple times now. It’s why, in the comment you responded to, I wrote:
They’re still, STILL, shitting on gays. The groomer crap? That was originally aimed at justifying an anti-LGBT bill (all LGBT, to the point it was described as “Don’t say Gay” by many) by a DeSantis spokeswoman, trans people were, at that point, just another target, not a primary target.
and
I appreciate the optimism here about how oh this is just because they can’t be crappy to lots of other groups, but they’re still being crappy to the other groups. Transpeople have not replaced gay and poor black people in the Conservative lexicon of “others” that should be blamed for society’s ills, they’ve joined them.
So obviously this has FUCK ALL to do with black and gay people being able to defend themselves, because if that was the reason, THEY’D HAVE STOPPED FUCKING OVER GAY AND BLACK PEOPLE.
On Earth One, they haven’t. Glad to hear that isn’t the case in your universe though and the other people responding to me.
theyve been on this bullcrap since at least 2016 with all the bathroom crap. we shouldnt be demonizing people over this yet here we are where a massive chunk of the population does just that. when i was a kid it was "what if gae in lockerroom?" bullcrap. im sure at this point in my life ive been in a locker room with a gay person and theyve never been a problem. and if they are its that person who is the issue not the entire lgbtq+ community.
To approach this from a different angle, I would say this is actually an ironically encouraging sign that we are lurching in a good direction. There's always going to be some level of racism, misogyny, homophobia, etc., but those things are mainstream enough that you have to be really hard right to beat the drum for them. It's the kind of thing that might still play in certain areas, and with certain types or demographic, but the mainstream isn't really down with it. Open pro-trans movements and statements are pretty new compared to these other things, so it's just the latest in the succession of what-can-I-hate-up that authoritarian types latched onto. I have a feeling we're lurching -- and pretty quickly -- toward trans becoming more mainstream
I would say this is actually an ironically encouraging sign that we are lurching in a good direction. There’s always going to be some level of racism, misogyny, homophobia, etc., but those things are mainstream enough that you have to be really hard right to beat the drum for them.
And yet here we are and they do. Do you remember how the term “Groomer” appeared? It was the DeSantis administration justifying the “Don’t say Gay” bill. That was a bill that, sure, mentioned gender dysphoria in passing, but it was primarily aimed at gay people.
I don’t see any evidence at all the Republicans have become less racist or less homophobic. Racism seems no better, maybe worse, than it was in 2008, and as the mainstream Republican establishment has declined, the party seems to have given in to the homophobic grassroots.
None of which really explains though why they’ve gone from merely laughing at transpeople to turning them into villains, while continuing to demonize the groups they’ve always done. Perhaps, far from transpeople being the only ones left, they’ve realized they can get away with scapegoating more groups than they previously have done.
A lot of older people feel like this. It’s an opinion that will sooner or later die out. I’m not going to bash people about old views in a world that is changing faster then we can keep up. Progress is slow and steady.
Older people need to be told they are wrong and given reasons why. Then they can adapt their views and understand their world better. Those that refuse to adapt should be ostracized. There's no room for bigots. I've been doing this same thing when I was misunderstanding the world and I hope to be adapting until I die.
I don’t know everyone’s personal experiences on the matter but I can’t blame people for wanting to pump the brakes a little when it comes to converting young children. It’s not being a bigot to be concerned over something that is generally new to our society. But I only speak of the medical part of it. I have no issues with gender neutral bathrooms ect… I just honestly don’t know enough about the procedures and outcomes to say I can call someone a bigot for disagreeing.
pump the brakes a little when it comes to converting young children.
No one is trying to convert anyone into being trans, FFS.
It’s not being a bigot to be concerned over something that is generally new to our society.
Being trans isn't new. Just because we've stopped denigrating it openly and pretending it doesn't exist (it has always existed and been present, but usually in the closet) doesn't make it new.
But I only speak of the medical part of it.
Treatments for gender dysphoria have been around for literally decades.
I just honestly don’t know enough about the procedures and outcomes to say I can call someone a bigot for disagreeing.
I don't know the ins and outs of cancer treatments but I don't doubt doctors. FFS this is some A-grade transphobia. Really sealioning it all up in here.
You make me want to learn so much more. I’m sure 90 percent of the population don’t know all the facts about something that effects 5 percent . But fuck it were transphobic. Your a real educator!
Just because someone isn’t fully educated on something doesn’t make them a bigot. My beliefs change when I get new facts. Do you just run around calling everyone bigots because they are unsure about something? I admit my opinion is not very educated on the matter but I’m trying. Good luck in life sir.
Either you're defending your ignorance after outing it in a public space, or you're putting on an act to cover for your bigotry.
Till you sort yourself out, you're coming across as a bigot and that's your responsibility to resolve, not ours to play along.
@Neato : story of the punk bar bartender and nazis
based on @iamragesparkle;s tweets
I was at a shitty crustpunk bar once getting an after-work beer. One of those shitholes where the bartenders clearly hate you. So the bartender and I were ignoring one another when someone sits next to me and he immediately says, “no. get out.”
And the dude next to me says, “hey i’m not doing anything, i’m a paying customer.” and the bartender reaches under the counter for a bat or something and says, “out. now.” and the dude leaves, kind of yelling. And he was dressed in a punk uniform, I noticed
Anyway, I asked what that was about and the bartender was like, “you didn’t see his vest but it was all nazi shit. Iron crosses and stuff. You get to recognize them.”
And i was like, ohok and he continues.
"you have to nip it in the bud immediately. These guys come in and it’s always a nice, polite one. And you serve them because you don’t want to cause a scene. And then they become a regular and after awhile they bring a friend. And that dude is cool too.
And then THEY bring friends and the friends bring friends and they stop being cool and then you realize, oh shit, this is a Nazi bar now. And it’s too late because they’re entrenched and if you try to kick them out, they cause a PROBLEM. So you have to shut them down.
And i was like, ‘oh damn.’ and he said “yeah, you have to ignore their reasonable arguments because their end goal is to be terrible, awful people.”
And then he went back to ignoring me. But I haven’t forgotten that at all.
Why should we trip over ourselves to accommodate the old people’s feelings? They’re clearly not working to understand the youth. Respect is a two way street.
Good news everyone! Got a kid who's mediocre at soccer? No worries! We'll mutilate his cock, flip it inside out like a pair of jeans out of the dryer, and bam! A little Frankensteins monster who can wreck house in women's soccer! Lmfao
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