Israeli President Isaac Herzog says ‘entire nation’ of Palestine ‘responsible’ for attacks

Israeli President Isaac Herzog said Palestinian civilians in Gaza were “responsible” for the Saturday attack by Hamas.

“It is an entire nation out there that is responsible. It’s not true this rhetoric about civilians [being] not aware, not involved. It’s absolutely not true,” Herzog said Friday. “They could have risen up, they could have fought against that evil regime which took over Gaza in a coup d’état.”

“I agree there are many innocent Palestinians who don’t agree with this, but if you have a missile in your goddamn kitchen and you want to shoot it at me, am I allowed to defend myself? We have to defend ourselves, we have the full right to do so,” he added.

The Israeli president made the comments while calling for over 1 million people in northern Gaza to evacuate in 24 hours. The evacuation was first announced to Gaza residents via leaflets from the Israel Defense Forces.

“Civilians of Gaza City, evacuate south for your own safety and the safety of your families and distance yourself from Hamas terrorists who are using you as human shields,” the leaflets read. “This evacuation is for your own safety. You will be able to return to Gaza City only when another announcement permitting it is made.”

Hamas has told people in Gaza to ignore the evacuation order.

“Israel is removing Palestinians from their homes and lands for a second time, and we have responded to the Zionist crimes by targeting them and Ben Gurion,” Abu Obaida, spokesperson of Hamas’ Al-Qassam Brigades, said. “Displacement and exile are not for us, Israel is carrying out psychological warfare through the threats and their dark history, which shows they carry out crimes and killings as a form of collective punishment.”

The United Nations has called the evacuation “impossible,” due to the large number of people asked to leave the area, according to CNN. John Kirby, the National Security Council coordinator for strategic communications, called the evacuation a “tall order.”

“We understand what they’re trying to do: They’re trying to move civilians out of harm’s way and giving them fair warning. Now it’s a tall order. It’s a million people and very urban, dense environment. It’s already a combat zone. So I don’t think anybody’s underestimating the challenge here of effecting that evacuation,” Kirby told CNN.

The war between Hamas and Israel started on Saturday when Hamas soldiers attacked Israel from Gaza. Hamas killed over 1,000 people and took over 100 hostages in that attack, according to NPR. Hamas has been designated a terrorist organization by many countries including the U.S., Israel and those in the European Union. Since the beginning of the war, Israel says Hamas killed 1,300 people. The Palestinian health ministry reports 1,800 killed in Gaza.

itsgroundhogdayagain,

So he concedes that Palestine is a nation?

Masimatutu,

Epic troll

KevonLooney,

Yeah, it’s funny but a nation need not be political:

A nation is a large type of social organization where a collective identity has emerged from a combination of shared features across a given population, such as language, history, ethnicity, culture, territory or society. Some nations are constructed around ethnicity (see ethnic nationalism) while others are bound by political constitutions (see civic nationalism and multiculturalism).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nation

Letstakealook,

You heard him, 1 million children are responsible for the attack. Fuck Israel. Israelis are the ones responsible for the attack. You reap what you sow.

Ab_intra,
@Ab_intra@lemmy.world avatar

I don’t agree with killing civilians but you are right. What did they think would happen when they blockade a whole city and oppress the people? They build illegal settlements that is by condemned by the international community.

The thing that annoys me the most is that when Palestinians are killed we don’t hear that much about it. And now the Israelis are killing thousands of most likely innocent people. But I will give it to the israelis I do understand their anger towards Hamas but not all the Palestinians, most of them are just civilians trying to live their lifes…

DarkGamer,
DarkGamer avatar

What did they think would happen when they blockade a whole city and oppress the people?

That sort of reasoning works both ways. Israel's response to Hamas, (the elected government of Gaza,) murdering hundreds of their civilians is also unsurprising. What did they think would happen when they lost every conflict, refuse to negotiate for peace, and continue to launch bloody attacks against civilians of a state they can't possibly defeat militarily?

They build illegal settlements that is by condemned by the international community.

While they still exist around Jerusalem and the West Bank, Israel dismantled their settlements in Gaza when they unilaterally left in '05.

orcrist,

Right right. I would hope that most sensible people think all of the mass killing is terrible, and that those responsible should all be held accountable, such as is even possible.

atetulo,

What did they think would happen when they blockade a whole city and oppress the people?

They thought they could do whatever they want and any retaliation would be a golden ticket to massacre Palestinians.

And they are correct. Nobody is going to stand in their way. Nobody is going to offer anything more than ‘condemnation.’

Evilsandwichman,

I’m reminded of a comment I once read on a wiki page about…My Lai I believe (a page with some relation to war crimes, or a specific war crime, in Vietnam)? There was a (general?) who was explaining why they felt fine killing civilians; he said you could be passing by some lady, step on a mine and die, and that she’s guilty because she knew it was there and said nothing.

Not bad enough you invaded their country, but you expect them to bend over backwards and make invading them easier?

WuTang,

over the top, as always… jeez this entity is on my nerve!

Omega_Haxors,

Rules-based world order for me but none for thee

Ineocla,

Hitler said that all the jews were evil. How ironic

can,
whoisearth,
@whoisearth@lemmy.ca avatar

Damn he ain’t wrong.

finickydesert,
@finickydesert@lemmy.ml avatar

That last name with what is being said is like history repeating it self ironically.

HowMany,

Did anyone expect him to say anything else? After decades of Israel stealing Palestinian land, Israel finally got their opening for all out genocide of Palestinians. Coincidence? Hardly likely.

rdrunner,

This is why I find it very hard to believe that the Hamas attack truly caught them off guard. They have one of the best intelligence agencies in the world and they DIDN’T know it was coming? And there’s reports that they were warned ahead of time? Seems fishy to me

TexMexBazooka,

I have a pet theory that it was allowed to happen as justification for leveling Gaza.

masquenox,

Yeah… no. You shouldn’t overestimate these intelligence agencies. The Nazis never got wind of the Warsaw Uprising and the US never got wind of the Tet offensive… they are simply not that infallible.

The whole problem with this theory is that Israel has gone to great lengths to “stabilize” the imprisonment of Palestinians in Gaza and the West Bank in the hopes of normalizing the situation even further - a very important requirement for Israel’s attempts to normalize relations with it’s neighbours. That’s what their precious “Security Barrier” was all about. That “stability” is now shattered - probably forever - and so are their hopes of getting Arabic nations permanently on their side. That’s why the US is suddenly shifting carrier groups into the area - this could be the beginning of the end of the current status quo, and the US knows that.

Lemmylaugh,

Unpopular opinion. Wouldn’t a one state be a better solution. Like most of other developed nations that are multi cultural? After 5 or 6 generations they would all identify as one nation with different backgrounds. It definitely works in modern nations now.

Risk,

It probably would have led to the best outcome if it had been one state from the start, when Israel was established. God knows if it’d work now.

DarkGamer,
DarkGamer avatar

The UN pushed for a 2-state solution because the Peel Commission determined Arab Nationalists were unwilling to coexist after the Arab Revolt of 1936–39. Israel seems quite happy to coexist, in fact 20% of their citizens are Arab/Palestinian. They just keep getting attacked and their opponents refuse to negotiate for viable peace and make concessions despite being resoundingly defeated nearly every time, which has led to the situation today.

masquenox,

Wouldn’t a one state be a better solution.

Pretty much, yes. It’s only an unpopular opinion amongst white supremacists and pro-colonialists.

frauddogg, (edited )
@frauddogg@lemmygrad.ml avatar

let me put it this way: I’m forced to live in a ‘one-state solution’ with the descendants of my lineage’s oppressors, and I fuckin hate it. I wouldn’t condemn the Palestinians like that. Especially because if we assume Israel would follow the lead of its big brother in this hypothetical “One State” scenario, then the tensions between Israeli and Palestinian would never end up solved, constantly used as a political football for misleader Palestinians to eventually work their way into the government, and utterly shut down the revolutionary potential of the oppressed while lending legitimacy to the settler project.

That’s a condemnation of the Palestinian people just as surely as the all-out genocide Israel currently wages. The only difference is the scale of time.

DarkGamer,
DarkGamer avatar

Wouldn’t a one state be a better solution. Like most of other developed nations that are multi cultural? After 5 or 6 generations they would all identify as one nation with different backgrounds. It definitely works in modern nations now.

20% of Israel's citizens are Palestinean/Arab with full rights, a 1-state solution seems to be working out alright for them. The problem is that Hamas and other extremist leadership will only settle for driving all the Israelis out, either by expulsion or genocide, and they will not compromise or entertain peace with concessions.

regul,

If all Palestinians became citizens in the same country, Jewish Israelis would be a minority, which is not something Israeli leadership is willing to tolerate either. It’s disingenuous to imply otherwise. Israel is intended to be a Jewish state, and those in power now (or probably any Jewish Israeli political party) would not countenance it becoming a majority Muslim country.

DarkGamer,
DarkGamer avatar

You're right in that it's probably not viable today both due to animosity and demographics, but at one time I think it could have been a possibility.

bennieandthez,
@bennieandthez@lemmygrad.ml avatar

Would you like to live in a state where you are a second class citizen?

atetulo,

I think part of that solution would be laws and regulations to prevent discrimination.

It’s not impossible.

frauddogg,
@frauddogg@lemmygrad.ml avatar

Those laws never work as they’re expected to. When’s the last time you heard about a settler actually following anti-discrimination laws or regs, or the last time you heard a settler actually punished for breaking those laws and regs? You sound naive.

atetulo,

You’re right. There’s a law of the universe that says it’s physically impossible for a nation to follow it’s own anti-discrimination laws.

There’s nothing that can be done to change it. No matter how much time passes or how much we may learn, it will remain an absolute fact.

frauddogg, (edited )
@frauddogg@lemmygrad.ml avatar

https://lemmygrad.ml/pictrs/image/8d5c955f-ec3b-42f1-8ed2-a90792f1e6f1.png confirmed.

If you’re gonna really sit there and tell me you think that ethnic cleansers, settlers, and colonizers will follow the spirit of anti-discrimination laws, as opposed to continuing to marginalize, oppress, and brutalize the people they’ve made second-class or worse, you’re showing just how crackerish you really are. If you had any kind of true sight of this world, you’d see how hopelessly, pitifully naive such an ideal is-- and I have a lake to sell you in the center of fuckin Nevada.

atetulo,

🥱

frauddogg,
@frauddogg@lemmygrad.ml avatar

Aight cac fuck off then

atetulo,

Damn, you’re really angry about this.

Calm down.

SpasmodicColon,

Sure. Put the Palestinians back in charge of their land and state, and the isntrealis can just be there. Let’s see how they like that.

IchNichtenLichten,
@IchNichtenLichten@lemmy.world avatar

It’s interesting that these far-right Israelis aren’t even trying to keep the mask on any more. I guess they’re counting on Western nations to support them no matter how vile the things they say are, and how barbaric the actions of the IDF are.

There seems to be a shift in sentiment underway, not for the political class in the West, but amongst the people. I hope the politicians get the fucking message soon before thousands more are murdered.

atetulo,

I guess they’re counting on Western nations to support them no matter how vile the things they say are

And they’re correct. The US government at least does not care about its citizens one iota. We are workhorses for the ruling class’ agenda, and they have decided long ago that Israel gets to rule.

tym,

Ukraine has taught a lot of evil decision makers exactly what will be tolerated. The future is one of zero nuanced opinion. Scary shit.

GorbinOutOverHere,

Aren’t collective punishments literally a violation of human rights

CarbonScored,
@CarbonScored@hexbear.net avatar

It is a war crime as defined by the UN.

frauddogg,
@frauddogg@lemmygrad.ml avatar

If we go by the west’s meterstick, the only time violations of human rights even get recognized, it’s when enemies of the FIVE-EYES regime commit them. Allied human rights violations are pencil-whipped and rubber-stamped as ‘necessary evils’.

AngrilyEatingMuffins,
AngrilyEatingMuffins avatar

Israel is a genocidal, white supremacist apartheid state. They have shown multiple times that they have no interest in peace and only in subjugation. The country needs to be dismantled and a single state solution enacted.

Ab_intra,
@Ab_intra@lemmy.world avatar

He can go fuck himself. 2 + millions are not the ones that attacked Israel. There is a lot of Palestinians that are against Hamas… But I do understand the hatred they have towards Israel. Who would not hate someone that kills your people? That is for both sides by the way. I hate hamas for what they did.

zerfuffle,

If the Palestinian nation is responsible for the attacks on Israel, then the Israeli nation must be responsible for decades of apartheid… Right?

It can’t be true that civilians weren’t aware of the oppression or not involved, right? They could have risen up and fought against the evil regime that’s committed to apartheid, right?

420stalin69,

They literally voted for it and elected Bibi, and that’s after he boasted about how he was funding Hamas as a wedge tactic.

Israelis literally voted for this.

vlad76,
@vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

No, because we consider them good guys. Their war crimes are ok.

atetulo,

insert family guy skin color meme

Just another fine example of whiter people getting their way at the expense of darker ones.

DarkGamer,
DarkGamer avatar

Hamas has told people in Gaza to ignore the evacuation order.

Making Israel look bad by maximizing civilian collateral damage appears to be more important to Hamas than the lives of their fellow Palestinians.

Masimatutu,

To be fair, the order is completely unrealistic. You can’t just expect your enemy to move a million people in a day just so that you can invade them.

DarkGamer, (edited )
DarkGamer avatar

You can’t just expect your enemy to move a million people in a day just so that you can invade them.

I don't think invading them is the endgame here, I suspect they are going to level and annex the north half of Gaza and move the wall. If they invade they are an occupying power again like they were before Israel left in 2005, which would mean they would be subject to article 3 the Geneva Convention. If they did this, Israel would have to supply Gaza with water, food, and power once more and couldn't destroy buildings there, among other restrictions.

FaceDeer,
FaceDeer avatar

Which doesn't reduce any of the blame that will go to Israel if they go ahead and cause that maximized civilian collateral damage. They have a choice on whether to pull that trigger.

Silverseren,

Though Israel is making Hamas seem like the right decision there, since the IDF has been bombing the evacuee convoys trying to go south.

DarkGamer, (edited )
DarkGamer avatar

I suppose that depends on whether one is looking at the situation through an emotional lens or a logical one. Going with Hamas may feel righteous and cathartic for those who hate Israel, but will ultimately leave them with no home. Diplomacy with concessions is the only viable option I see for Palestine to end the conflict and hold on to anything. They have no hope of defeating Israel militarily, and unless they accept this hard truth it will not end well for them. Everything they are fighting for will ebb away over time if they do not change course.

If you mean that they should stay where the bombs will definitely fall to avoid where bombs might fall, that doesn't sound like a great plan either. It would however make more martyrs for Hamas to parade before the media to try and garner sympathy.

Silverseren,

Oh no, Hamas, Hezbollah, and the IDF are all the ideological evil here. They are all disgusting monsters and the world would be a better place if all three were gone.

The fate of the first two is already set in stone, as it should be. But I'm hoping this conflict will finally get the general public to realize the latter is also the evil that needs to be gotten rid of. Both the Israeli and the Palestinian people need to throw their governments in the trash.

DarkGamer,
DarkGamer avatar

Both the Israeli and the Palestinian people need to throw their governments in the trash.

A hard reset on diplomacy would be an interesting development, but I suspect there's too much fresh animosity against the other side for that to happen. New governments would be likely to harbor old grudges. If theoretically it were possible that would be an incredible resolution to this long conflict.

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