Kbin and Lemmy should come to a consensus on how to name stuff

Is there really a reason, for example, for there to be the distinction of "magazine" and "community"? When you're federating, the same features should be called the same, if close enough. That way everyone can talk with everyone about stuff and we all immediately understand each other.

Would also alleviate confusion for any new adopters.

^I'm pretty sure this is going to be impossible though, since each sides egos will likely get in the way :D^

Kierunkowy74,
Kierunkowy74 avatar

/kbin magazines, Lemmy communities and Friendica forums are (according to ActivityStreams vocabulary) groups. However, the same applies to Mobilizon groups, which work slightly differently, allow private discussions, having common file resources, and most important of all - organising events.
We could also call these three subfeddits, which is another word to learn ;)
or simply to go ahead. All communities and forums already will be seen by /kbin as magazines, and the same is accordingly true to other software.

Also, not all vocabulary aligning is actually desired - /kbin explicitly uses name boost to align with Mastodon feature. However, both "boost" and upvote have a "boosting" effect - the meaning of the feature (being simply reblog or re-tweet) is obscured right now.

Another confusing Mastodon nomenclature alignement is calling only microblog posts posts. Majority of /kbin users are Reddit emigrants right now, and Reddit used name post for /kbin article. In reality, everything, from articles and "tweets", through audio and video, to places, events and relationships (!), can in ActivityPub be called posts. ActivityStreams vocabulary differentiates between an article (long form, formatted), and note (short, equivalent of tweet and toot), and IMO /kbin should adopt the name note for microblog posts - to reduce confusion (Calc- and Misskey already use that name).

cutitdown,

I could easily see it being added in options that people can see these terms as whatever they prefer. Could even be done with browser extensions/user scripts relatively simply.

FlowVoid,

That's like saying Microsoft and Sony need to settle on either "Gamertag" or "PSNID", because otherwise Call of Duty players trying to find their friends online will be confused.

I think users can figure things out.

WytchStar,
WytchStar avatar

Create your own instance and name them whatever you want.

FR tho, think about what you're suggesting. Take all this decentralized content and homogenize it? Hard pass. BTDT.

LollerCorleone,
LollerCorleone avatar

Yeah no. Both are different softwares and can perfectly coexist with their own naming conventions. There is no need to make them both exact clones of each other.

Flax_vert,

"Community magazines" there perfect alternative

RagnvaldG,

And we can call them ”Comzines”

sdcSpade,

Why not Magaunities? Wait, no, I see it now...

Ragnell,
Ragnell avatar

So the problem with this idea is we're gonna get into a big argument about whether to keep magazines or communities and honestly just screw that. A magazine is a community, a cat is a kitty. We can have two words for things.

Edit: If we do get into it I vote for "magazine" because I went there for the topic primarily.

tunetardis,

When I first arrived here, I assumed magazines = communities and made some flippant comment to that effect, only to be set straight by someone more knowledgeable. They essentially argued that magazines > communities on account of the fact that a hashtag within a magazine post is meaningful to kbin but not lemmy. So the different naming underscores that they are not, in fact, identical. Though to be fair, I haven’t seen a lot of posts with hashtags to date.

aroom, (edited )
aroom avatar

if you setup tags for a magazine on kbin, posts being published in the fediverse with those tags end up in the Microblog section. just check it.

Kara,
Kara avatar

I believe this only works on Kbin though, not Lemmy

aroom,
aroom avatar

Yes I’ll correct my post

planetaryprotection,

Yeah, a magazine is more like a "topic" but that's too broad of a term I think.

My understanding of the term "magazine" is that it's supposed to denote that a magazine is composed of different kinds of content that fall under the same general topic, just like a real paper magazine is a mix of content (i.e. long form articles, short essays, q&a sections, photos, the fancy CD in the back, etc.) So a kbin magazine can encompass text posts, photos, videos, microblogs, etc.

chamim,
chamim avatar

While I see what you mean about the names causing confusion, as I was confused myself at first, it took me very little time to adapt. Don't underestimate the users, most won't care too much about what 'subreddits' are called on each platform.

Azzu,

It's not really about the confusion, it's just unnecessary complexity. Magazines and communities for example are completely equal concepts, the only difference is the name for some reason, probably marketing or some such.

Mr_Jabroni,
Mr_Jabroni avatar

But they are not completely equal. Yes, kbin Magazines display threads just as Lemmy communities do, however Magazines have the Microblog tab where they display posts across the Fediverse that include the tags associated with them. That is extra functionality which Lemmy does not have.

AbouBenAdhem,

We could adopt the naming used by the underlying ActivityPub protocol, which for magazines/communities would be (if I’m interpreting the documentation correctly) “Shares Collections”.

Kara,
Kara avatar

Tbh "Join the Technology Shares Collection on Kbin" doesn't roll off the tongue very well, community is just the most straightforward option

Gecko,
@Gecko@lemmy.world avatar

Yeah, kbin calling "subreddits" "magazines" is one of the reasons I went for lemmy (despite the main devs questionable ideologies). For someone migrating from reddit the community == subreddit analogy makes more sense than magazine.

ikantolol,
ikantolol avatar

Would also alleviate confusion for any new adopters.

there's no need really, for new adopters or if you're planning to bring someone to the fediverse, simply do not mention anything about it being federated and just direct them to your preferred instances (in this case, kbin). Let them just learn kbin for a while before introducing the interconnected instances.

Flax_vert,

Problem is you can easily click your way into another instance, seems to be a bit more of a problem on Lemmy though rather than Kbin

Gordon_Freeman,
Gordon_Freeman avatar

That's like saying Facebook and Twitter should come to a concensus on how to name stuff

Lemmy and Kbin are different platforms that are compatible with activitypub (just like other platforms in the fediverse, like peertube, friendica, pleroma or mastodon, among others)

tikitaki,
tikitaki avatar

facebook and twitter are not federated

i don't see why creating standards for less confusion would hurt anyone. i think ultimately the standards should be optional - but standards exist for a reason

Gordon_Freeman,
Gordon_Freeman avatar

But Kbin is a platform and Lemmy is a different platform, just like Twitter and Facebook are different platforms. It's just that Lemmy and Kbin use a common protocol, ActivityPub that allows interaction between different platforms. But that does not means both platforms are (or should be) the same

rodhlann,
rodhlann avatar

I feel like it's going to take awhile for people used to Facebook / Twitter / Reddit / Etc to get used to having multiple platforms that cater to the exact same audience. Lemmy / Kbin basically do the same thing, with slightly different minor features. Most people aren't used to having options.

That said I feel like having some standardized naming across the fediverse wouldn't hurt with things that are synonymous, if that's not already happening. There's a valid argument for magazines and communities not being the same thing

bionicjoey,

I think there's a case to be made that some common nomenclature should be applied to activitypub implementations. For the same reason everyone can agree that an email has a "CC" line. Even though nobody knows what "carbon copying" is anymore. It's just a standard term so everyone is speaking the same language.

Kierunkowy74,
Kierunkowy74 avatar

some common nomenclature

It already exists. The terminology is coherent, but unintuitive - any interaction is Activity, any user, erm... magazine or group is Actor, and any interaction is Activity.

Gordon_Freeman,
Gordon_Freeman avatar

I think there's a case to be made that some common nomenclature should be applied to activitypub implementations

But there's no standard when platforms on activitypub are so vastly different

peertube are is the equivalent of or youtube
lemmy is almost like reddit
Mastodon is twitter-like
Kbin is a mix between twitter and reddit
friendica is facebook
etc.

I think is ok for every platform being different, left the autors express however they want. Maybe if you are a boomer who never touched a computer or a smarthphone ever these things may be confusing, but for digital natives? really? Can't you catch this stuff on the fly? It must be true what they say, the younger the dumber, to the point kids today don't know the difference between a file and a folder

jalda,
jalda avatar

That's like saying Facebook and Twitter should come to a concensus on how to name stuff

Twitter changed Favs to Likes to copy Facebook

Azzu,

I don't think it's even close to the same. It's more like forum software everywhere calls a post a "post" and a reply a "reply" and not something else.

Both sites are link aggregators, both sites have sub groups that are meant for a specific topic that links can be posted to, this concept should have a name.

Gordon_Freeman,
Gordon_Freeman avatar

So should all news aggregators copy 2004's Digg?

FaceDeer,
FaceDeer avatar

When terminology has become a standard, who cares what specific source you're "copying" from? Use the standard words that everyone already knows the meaning of.

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