Lyft’s new feature lets women and non-binary riders request their driver’s gender

Lyft is introducing a new feature that lets women and non-binary riders choose a preference to match with drivers of the same gender.

The ride-hailing company said it was a “highly requested feature” in a blog post Tuesday, saying the new feature allows women and non-binary people to “feel that much more confident” in using Lyft and also hopefully encourage more women to sign up to be drivers to access its “flexible earning opportunities.”

The service, called “Women+ Connect,” is rolling out in the coming months. Riders can turn on the option in the Lyft app, however the company warns that it’s not a guarantee that they’ll be matched with a women or non-binary person if one of those people aren’t nearby. Both the riders and drivers will need to opt-in to the feature for it work and riders must chose a gender for it to work.

FoundTheVegan, (edited )
FoundTheVegan avatar

ITT: Men who don't understand the dangers of living as a woman.

I'm a passing trans woman. I presented as a man for decades of my life and have lived the last handful as a woman. But the amount of times I've been groped, harassed, chased or made to feel worried about my physical safety just for existing in the world has skyrocketed. Truly, I know what it's like to experience society both ways and without question it is worse for women.

I've had men sit next to me at the theater, put their hand on my knee and try to feel me up. Ive had men smirk as they "accidently" bump in to me at the grocery to squeeze my breasts. I've been followed to my car by men asking what I was doing tonight, who then started yelling and only left because I had pepper spray.

Like, srsly. Every single one of you saying this is discrimination have no clue what it's like to worry that any interaction with a man you don't know can quickly turn scary. Getting in to some random guys lyft who will then know where I live, while he has the ability to lock the doors is honestly a super vulnerable position to put yourself in situation.

Yes, mens wages will be harmed, but women are physically being harmed right now. Tell lyft to pay their drivers an hourly wage like they should anyways and STFU about a safety feature.

darq,
darq avatar

I think a lot of straight cisgender men think that they understand the anxiety women and visibly LGBT+ people face in these sorts of situations. And maybe they understand it at some academic level. But they really don't truly grok it, and how it affects people's lives.

pastaq,

I just learned a new word. Neat.

Dontfearthereaper123, (edited )

I’m a bisexual non binary black person. I do understand the anxiety discriminated groups face, but that’s not an excuse to discriminate even more. We should look at the root causes of the violence and solve those rather than just discriminate even more and just let the issue get worse.

Editing this as a reply to the comment below because this thread got locked and I believe it harmful to ignore the fact that we do know the causes and how to solve them without discrimination

The root causes are societal pressures towards boys doing violent things I.e. military, police aswell as a societal acceptance of male violence “oh boys will be boys” and male loneliness and the inability to open up. The practical measures are not discriminate more. I’m curious abt how enbys or trans people who don’t visually transition would fit into this system. Creeps would have 0 issues just saying they’re enby or trans and I doubt they’d even mind cross dressing if it meant they could.creep more effectively.

The issue is creeps, not men and this doesnt solve that issue. We need to get rid of creeps by changing the societal causes and giving them mental support when needed as we should everyone.

darq,
darq avatar

I mean I agree we should look into the root causes. But practically that is a long-term, society-wide project. We don't even know what the root causes are, let alone how to address them. And moreover that project is not one a ride-share company can address.

So we sometimes have to take less-than-ideal, but more practical measures to address the current situation, right?

electrogamerman,

Where are you from that all of this shit happens?

30mag,

Truly, I know what it’s like to experience society both ways and without question it is worse for women.

Here are some fun facts about how much better it is to be a man in our society:

Based on available data from 1980 to 2008—

Males represented 77% of homicide victims and nearly 90% of offenders. The victimization rate for males (11.6 per 100,000) was 3 times higher than the rate for females (3.4 per 100,000). The offending rate for males (15.1 per 100,000) was almost 9 times higher than the rate for females (1.7 per 100,000).

www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf

In the United States, more men than women are shot to death by the police. As of August 28, the U.S. police shot 600 men and 21 women to death in 2023. In 2022, the police shot 1,022 men and 44 women to death.-

statista.com/…/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-…

pastaq,

Cool, now do rape, assault, and sexual harassment like the person you’re responding to was talking about. Your response is tone deaf whataboutism.

aesthelete,

Males represented 77% of homicide victims and nearly 90% of offenders.

In other words, male on male crime. What’s wrong with men’s culture to be causing this problem? 🤔🙄

Cleverdawny,

I’m not sure how blatantly enabling sex discrimination is going to help things here.

FoundTheVegan,
FoundTheVegan avatar

Well, then you are just being willfully ignorant because I already typed out why getting in to a cab is scary. Features like this are going to help women choose what type of situation they are putting themselves in. Say whatever you like about women being to use a gun/knife too, but assault and sexual assaults happen, the average man is stronger than the average woman and being in a confined space with a stranger is putting yourself at risk. Women are at a greater risk then men, so should have greater control how they handle those interactions.

Cleverdawny,

Then Lyft should focus on driver quality rather than enabling blatantly illegal sex discrimination.

cazsiel,

In what way is this illegal?

Cleverdawny,

1964 civil rights act, discrimination based on sex. Pretty obvious case of it.

thoro, (edited )

Is it illegal to choose your primary care physician based on gender? Maybe I’m not reading this entirely correctly, but why would it be illegal to similarly choose your ride driver by gender?

Wouldn’t discrimination be more if Lyft refused to hire male drivers or something to that effect according to the civil rights act?

Cleverdawny,

why would it be illegal to similarly choose your ride driver by gender?

Because it’s against the law, as it is written. It isn’t a BFOQ for a taxi driver to be male, female, young, old, of any particular race or religion, so yeah, discrimination on those qualities clearly violated the law.

Wouldn’t discrimination be more if Lyft refused to hire male drivers or something to that effect?

Preferentially encouraging discrimination against male drivers is still discrimination, even if male drivers are still allowed on the platform.

thoro,

The customer is making the choice not the business. When you search for primary care physicians in most networks, you can search and filter by gender. Again, is this illegal by your insurance/network to allow this filter?

Cleverdawny,
  1. the business is preferentially participating in the customer choice
  2. customer choice is also covered by the 1964 civil rights act, it’s just nearly always unenforceable unless someone goes on a racist/sexist tirade
  3. when insurance companies allow people to filter for male and female doctors, they’re allowing people to prefer both options, so they’re not preferentially participating in the choice like Lyft is here. And, there are medical specialties where one could argue that being either male or female was a BFOQ. Being a taxi driver doesn’t involve one’s genitals like being an obstetrics patient does. If you are using your genitals to operate your car, you’re doing it wrong.
thoro,

Fair enough.

It will be interesting to see how this holds up in the courts, whether they can argue it’s in fact a BFOQ, or whether that actually applies here.

girlfreddy,
@girlfreddy@lemmy.ca avatar

I’m waiting patiently for the first man to actually get this to court.

gets LOTS of popcorn ready.

subignition,
subignition avatar

That's not going to look good in the media cycle. Here's hoping you don't find the eventual plaintiff among the bigots in this thread.

cazsiel,

I see. It’s not like Lyft isn’t taking on drivers who are men, it just allows women and enby pax the option to set a preference for women and enby drivers.

It would be interesting to see it argued in court that this constitutes as discrimination.

Cleverdawny,

The analogy here is providing an option for a customer at a restaurant to select which race or gender they want serving them. Yes, definitionally, it is discrimination by sex. Especially because no one is given the option to pick a male driver, this will just result in women receiving more ride requests while they’re active and driving.

I can’t see how this would be anything but a slam dunk violation of federal law. Lyft is actively and obviously participating in discrimination on the basis of sex by enacting this policy.

What they SHOULD be doing is raising driver pay and enacting real protections for their passengers which do NOT violate federal law.

Cryophilia,

The fact that Lyft classifies their drivers as contractors rather than employees may allow them to get away with it.

Cleverdawny,

I doubt it. Unless you think it would be legal for a company to preferentially contract with only white men, this would violate title II

Nougat,

When you select a doctor, dentist, psychiatrist, therapist - you can choose based on gender. I think it's perfectly reasonable for a customer who is in an especially vulnerable position, purely because of the service they are receiving, to be able to choose exactly who they want to provide that service.

The problem here is that only women and enby people are offered this option, and men are not. Although I think it would be difficult for Lyft to verify that you're non-binary, so I suppose that anyone could choose a female or non-binary driver ... but nobody can specifically choose a male driver. Which is also a problem.

Lizardking27,

“Why getting into a cab is scary” There. Stop right there. You nailed it. Thats it, that’s the whole point. Getting into a strangers vehicle is scary. Period. The end.

orangebussycat,

Couldn’t broke drivers just self-identify as non-binary for more money?

adrian783,

they would get deactivated so fast though

MBM,

Or just get really bad reviews

philodendron,

Easy lawsuit

uberrice,

Thing is. Nonbinary must be allowed to mean literally anything in the way it currently is defined.

I am a man, I identity as a man. However, if I were to Identify as Nonbinary, that would need to pass - I might internally and externally be male, but if I say I don’t identify with being male - it’s sexist to deny me the right to identify that way - because identifying that way is not tied to a specific thing you do.

WhyDoesntThisThingWork,

You would think someone who has surely faced so much discrimination would be less of a bigot.

Cynoid,

I don’t doubt you had terrible experiences related to sexual harassment, and I’m sorry for you. Nobody deserve this.

But don’t try to muddle the issue here. You have been attacked by people. And you decided that the pertinent group to understand these attacks is their gender, so we need to differentiate on this basis. You could have analyzed it along education level, wealth, apparent race, apparent religion, social persona, zodiacal type, car brand, profession, haircut, or anything else.

But you chose to judge the risk level of people based on their gender. Because you think that, for some reason, you have a much clearer perspective than other people you know litterally nothing about but their gender. It is the exact same thing that makes people discriminate others about the color of their skin, or wealth, or any of the illegal type of discrimination. You are using the same logic, and by extension, you are legitimazing it. There’s a reason discrimination laws do a blanket ban of this kind of thing, and not “some genders/races/others are more protected than others” : it’s because every use of every kind of this arbitrary categorization strengthen every other.

Spendrill,

I have no idea why women would want a woman taxi driver.

TheYear2525,

And I could do the same for any given race.

Spendrill, (edited )

There’s at least three white people in there. My point wasn’t about race. The fact that there are a lot of non white people in that selection reflects the fact that taxi drivers aren’t that well paid and like a lot of poorly paid manual jobs there are quite a few immigrants doing that job. If we then extrapolate from what we know about sex offenders in society we can say that in any particular population there will be a number of sex offenders. Having said that, John Worboys, who is white, seems to be the most prolific of the bunch in there.

They are, having omitted duplicating cases, just the first results for a search for ‘taxi driver rapist.’ Odd that there aren’t any women in the selection, no?

sixCats,

The links you provided seem to be UK centred, so it’s important to remember that in UK law a woman cannot be convicted of rape, only of sexual assault because under the letter of the law rape requires penetration

Hence, if you compare male vs female rape perpetrators you’ll always get an overwhelming majority of men

Spendrill,

You’re technically correct about the distinction in law but I think the point still easily stands. Unless you can find me five women taxi drivers charged with sexually assaulting their passengers.

lud,

Since your comment will just look like one link for most people, here is an actual readable list:

Lizardking27,

You could google a dozen articles about men being attacked by women too. Or a person of one race being attacked by a person of another race. This random list of anecdotes proves nothing.

WhyDoesntThisThingWork,

Most bigots think they have what are “really good” reasons for their bigotry

Tenthrow,
@Tenthrow@lemmy.world avatar

Locking this discussion because you guys just can’t keep it civil. These comments (and the many that had to be removed) just prove the point of the article.

lobster_fowl,

Wasn’t this a plotline in Bojack Horseman?

Yoldark,

That’s really bullshit. This result will be that every male drivers will become non binary to not be discriminated by the customers.

This is not because some suffer that it is correct to punish an entire gender for that.

WhyDoesntThisThingWork,

If a system is bad for women we blame the the system, if a system is bad for men we blame the men.

SnowdenHeroOfOurTime,

… what exactly is your point here?

specfreq,

?

obinice,
@obinice@lemmy.world avatar

I understand the reasoning and positivity behind this and I do believe it comes from a really good place, it may even be beneficial to customers, but it is gender discrimination in the workplace, whether it leads to mostly positive outcomes for some people or not.

If your employees bring in different amounts of money because you’ve started to split their available workloads based on gender (especially in an industry where gender has no impact on one’s ability to do the job), you’re now likely to decide that due to this trend over time, to discriminate further, prioritising the more popular genders over others when hiring, and when firing, and when deciding wages.

After all, if one gender brings in less profits consistently than the others - because they’re stifled by company policy - why pay them as much? It makes business sense to pay them what they’re worth, and they’re measurably worth less than the other genders, now.

It’s a slippery slope. Well intentioned, but damages equality in the workplace.

Cracks_InTheWalls, (edited )
@Cracks_InTheWalls@sh.itjust.works avatar

Agreed. I 100% understand the rationale, but it has troubling implications. It only takes the one bad guy, but there are 25 other guys driving that night who would either be friendly or happily ignore you the whole ride.

I’d be interested in reading a breakdown of riders and drivers by gender in some representative areas. What I see this doing is, first yes, giving women and non-binary people an increased sense of safety (which I want to stress is still extremely important). But what I also see is an overall decline in service quality for women and non-binary people. Anecdote, not data, but I’ve used Lyft hundreds of times over the years in different cities. I’ve been picked up by maybe 3 people who weren’t [presumably, I didn’t ask] male identifying. On top of this, there is the possibility of certain genders earning more purely on the basis of gender. Remember - this is a bad thing for gender equality.

Something that might be better is an opt-in program with enhanced background checks, mandatory cab cameras designed to be difficult for your average person to fuck with some system for mandatory upload/secure storage of the footage, and other stuff along these lines. Do all these, regardless of gender, and you get a Secure Ride badge. The difficulty is the process and the knowledge you are under MUCH closer scrutiny. The prize is (potentially) access to a bigger piece of that that day’s possible revenue.

I don’t think the above is perfect, but they’re steps towards a better system not based on gender lines among contractors.

Now, if they were treated like honest to god employees, this kind of thing might be easier to implement. Food for thought, Lyft.

Edit: Another thing that I think would be useful in general is a safety rating system on top of the other metrics. Have users provide anonymized data visible on the driver’s profile about how safe they felt their ride was in general. Though admittedly I can see ways this could be abused or made un-useful. But I’ve personally been in situations where I did NOT feel safe, and would have rated them poorly in this area - but otherwise they got me home in one piece, and the reason I felt they were unsafe was they busted their ass all day and were almost nodding off.

In this situation, knowing how ratings play into Lyft and thinking about causes, my rating did not accurately reflect my actual sense of safety. An anonymous safety rating option, with comment, would have been appreciated.

SnowdenHeroOfOurTime,

I stopped reading this novel when you claimed you’ve had hundreds of rides but 3 women drivers. That’s not very believable. I’d say 20-30% of my drivers have been female, out of dozens of rides.

boonhet,

Not American so cultures will differ, but I’ve had exactly one female Bolt driver out of my ~40-50 rides. I don’t know if I’ve ever had a female food courier because I don’t always get to the door before they leave. Haven’t seen one though (I mean I’ve seen them around town - just haven’t been delivered to by one).

No idea why it’s like that. Maybe it’s because women are significantly more likely than men to acquire advanced degrees in my country so they don’t need to do gig work as their main source of income? Maybe women just don’t feel safe doing it?

Cracks_InTheWalls,
@Cracks_InTheWalls@sh.itjust.works avatar

This is why I would be interested in a user and driver breakdown across different areas. My anecdote is just that, and could be a function of driver demographics where I am v. where you are (or just a quirk of probability).

canihasaccount,

I’ve taken probably over 100 Uber/Lyft rides and have never been picked up by someone who presents as a woman. It’s definitely region specific.

over_clox,

Okay, well let me ask a question…

If a person identifies as non-binary, then what fucking business they got asking me my gender?

funkless_eck,

because someone else being non-binary doesn’t make you non-binary?

they’re not saying no one is allowed a gender, or that other people don’t have genders

they’re saying their gender is a different one beyond the usual two.

like how you don’t have to just choose between vanilla or chocolate because strawberry also exists.

over_clox,

Look, ‘non-binary’, whatever the hell that’s supposed to even mean, basically adds up to ‘I don’t want to tell you what my body structure is’

If someone doesn’t want to reveal their gender to me, hey no problem by me. But privacy is a two way street ya know. What business do ‘non-binary’ people have asking anyone else about their sex/gender?

PotatoKat,

Non-binary has nothing to do with secrecy? It’s a catch all term for genders that don’t fall under the man or woman category. It pretty much means they don’t identify as a man or a woman but as something else, there are many other identities a person may have

funkless_eck,

i don’t think it’s hard to divine the meaning of “non” - it means not

and binary means “choice between two options”

put together it means “not one of the two options.”

I believe I already covered your other points (as did the other person replying), but they did reveal their gender.

Consider this: It’s more like

“Did you watch the soccer or tennis match last nigjt?”

“I don’t really like sports, I watched a movie instead”

“why are you keeping it a secret whether you watched the soccer or tennis?”

Its not a secret, there just happens to be more than two choices.

“is your name John or Christopher?”

“neither its David”

“why are you keeping your name a secret!”

etc

Sir_Simon_Spamalot,

Can a male driver, then, identify himself as non-binary? Say that he does this to avoid all the hassle and possible loss of income caused by a form of workplace gender discrimination.

By the way, you’re not supposed to ask why one is non-binary, right?

SnowdenHeroOfOurTime,

Yeah and they don’t ask, it’s opt in.

funkless_eck,

yeah you’re not also supposed to ask why someone is a certain race, religion, height, weight etc

and lol at the idea of being non binary is “less hassle”

Eder,

All the dudes complaining in here are the epitome of “wanting to be oppressed so bad”. So much invalidation of women’s experiences and trauma from harassment and abuse. I knew many Lemmy users were weird but God damn bro, y’all make Redditors look like saints. Until my partner stops constantly being stared at by perverted men on an almost weekly basis, I’ll keep letting women decide who they’re comfortable to be around.

abbotsbury,
@abbotsbury@lemmy.world avatar

I’ll keep letting women decide who they’re comfortable to be around

That’s kind of a red herring from “a corporation providing systemic discrimination”

Lizardking27,

Not to mention the fact that no one in this thread is even disagreeing with that sentiment.

Kolanaki,
@Kolanaki@yiffit.net avatar

I’m a man, and even I find many men to be uncomfortable to be around with how they talk about women, gays and trans people. Other men are the primary reason why I often feel ashamed to be male.

Pratai,

I feel this so much. Thanks for sharing. You’re not alone.

Lizardking27,

“I’ll keep letting women decide who they’re comfortable to be around.”

Show me one comment in this thread that contradicts this statement. Go ahead, I’ll wait.

Thats right, you can’t. Because no one here is actually saying the thing you’re accusing them of saying. You’ve done nothing but build your own strawman and tear it right back down. Congratulations, I guess?

afraid_of_zombies,

Should I do that so they have a real fight instead of strawman?

mrnotoriousman,

As a man, it's honestly quite embarrassing some of these comments. My gf is tiny and one of my best friends is also a tiny woman. They endure so much shit on a daily basis without even discussing how imposing men can be in an enclosed area like a cab. I wonder how many of them in here whining are creepers themselves

TruTollTroll,
@TruTollTroll@lemmy.world avatar

I’m just here for my popcorn and comment entertainment. Which did not disappoint

1984,
@1984@lemmy.today avatar

Ok, so this is fine, but if I want to work with people from my own culture, I’m a racist. :)

Ok, i want a young single attractive female driver preferring heterosexual men. Not weird at all. :)

yobama,
@yobama@lemmy.world avatar

Big oof

PatFussy,

Lawsuit when

alienanimals,

Lyft announces new feature: Separate, but equal.

Let’s see how this plays out for them.

TenderfootGungi,

What would stop me, a man, from claiming this status and requesting female drivers? While this policy was undoubtably made with good intentions, it is ripe for abuse.

surewhynotlem,

Well you see, most people aren’t assholes.

jedi_hamster,

Most people ARE assholes

surewhynotlem,

It sounds like you need better friends.

Or there’s that old saying, if everywhere you go smells like shit, check your shoes.

yata,

Not at all, you just notice the assholes much easier than non-assholes.

darkevilmac,
@darkevilmac@lemmy.zip avatar

Yes but the assholes are the ones that tend to take advantage of things like this.

loutr,
@loutr@sh.itjust.works avatar

A looot of rules only exist because of a couple assholes ruining it for everybody.

moog,

assholes are the only reason this feature exists

knobbysideup,

How is a man asking for a woman driver abuse? Maybe I really fucking hate having to ride with dudebro cabbies and having to humor them with their inane conversations and would prefer a woman driver.

johnyrocket,

If the man proceeds to abuse the woman I would say we have a problem.

huginn,

Drivers tend not to be the ones sexually assaulted.

AnonTwo,

Wouldn't that make you extra liable for getting sued, because on top of whatever the driver claims you did, you also specifically chose the option you shouldn't have chosen?

Like it's basically adding an extra layer of "This guy was clearly a bad actor"

elax102,
@elax102@lemmy.world avatar

In that scenario, I would guess when the driver sees you they wouldn’t let you in the car.

moog,

that would work for women but enbies can look like anyone

Dontfearthereaper123,

What abt trans women too actually. U couldn’t discriminate against a trans person just because they don’t pass.

Drivebyhaiku,

Technically nothing. There is no gatekeeping in being non-binary along the lines of presentation. But you claiming this as a passenger does not effect the other passengers who are made to feel safer by the adoption of this option. A fair number of female drivers in the service are also still likely to drive for male clients regularly anyway.

However if all drivers have protections for drivers to shut down abuses by scummy clients who use the opportunity of a temporarily captive audience to be disgusting towards drivers then this overall becomes less of a concern.

Almost all forms of accommodation leave certain paths open for abuse by bad actors. Erring on the side of the person who needs additional help participating in society is usually the more ethical choice because while a bad actor can be a pain there’s usually already laws on the books or policies that can be enacted that allow you to deal with one. For the person seeking accommodation the cost of not having access can mean the world becomes a smaller and/or more dangerous place because of reasons that have nothing to do with them. In some ways that can emotionally be looked at as “letting the assholes win”.

AeroLemming,

I had the same initial reaction as Tender, but your comment made me realize that not using this policy doesn’t really help keep drivers safe anyway. Plus, a driver can pull over and make a passenger get out, but a passenger can’t force the driver to let them out as easily.

Drivebyhaiku,

In general if someone wants to do you harm getting in their car and being transported to a secondary location causes survival rates to plummet. Drivers do have more options by default than their passenger unless the passenger is holding them at gunpoint.

There’s also a stunning number of cases of male Uber and Lyft drivers stalking female clients meaning the threat comes at first point of contact when someone learns where you live.

saegiru,
@saegiru@lemmy.world avatar

Cool, now both Lyft and Uber need a “no extra conversation” option too. I don’t want to talk to the driver when I use rideshares, I hate the incessant small talk they want me to be a part of. I know some people might like it or at the very least not mind it, but I absolutely can’t stand it 9 times out of 10. Give me the option to specifically not have it please.

Gork,

Last time I used Uber I remember seeing this feature as an option.

saegiru,
@saegiru@lemmy.world avatar

Wow, was not aware although after just looking it up, evidently it is only for ‘premium’ rides and not standard. As if having someone not talk to you should cost extra. 🙄

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