I don’t use these services, but after learning a bit about them I have to say I’d rather pay an honest thief than one who lies about ownership ¯_(ツ)_/¯
I don’t use these services either, but my understanding is that some of these thiefs seem to not even have a profit model. One prominent streamer who I won’t name, “FZ”, as the kids call it, they don’t require registration and are allowing those who use ad-blockers to access the site.
I don’t understand why Hollywood is even going after these guys. Just wait for their lack of monetization sweeps them under.
If you’re paying for it, then you could argue that you aren’t “stealing” it. How are you (or at least the average person) suppose to know that the steaming service you used got their content illegally? This way, all of the liability falls on the streamer rather than the consumer.
Lots of people are. Real Debrid is the shit! It’s about $2.80 per month for the ability to stream pretty much everything. But ads? Nah, man. There are ads on the torrent sites, but none on streaming. Pirates are pretty ad-adverse.
Huh, never heard of that, it sounds pretty cool since it covers not just streaming movies, but downloads of games as well. I can definitely see the appeal.
Check out Stremio+Real-Debrid+Torrentio. It’s honestly better than any paid subscription you can get from the studios. Install it on something like a Chromecast 4k, or a Shield TV device, hook it up to your home entertainment system, and you’ve got yourself a bonafide real solution.
So I live in Germany and as such I avoid torrents. The thing with torrents is, that as soon as you’re on a tracker, you’re sharing content illegally. There’s an entire industry of law firms built around fucking up torrent users.
That’s why I used to use real-debrid to download stuff from one click hosters manually. How does stremio and torrentio work? Is it a safe alternative for German pirates? I really want to cancel some subscriptions here, especially now that they’re planning on using ads.
You should be using a no-logging VPN, even if only as a question of principle (I’m afraid that in Germany, it’s highly likely common people’s Internet activity is already under dragnet state surveillance: things like the mandatory providing and recording of ID when buying a phone SIM in Germany - which is unusual elsewhere in Europe - only serve for there to be a centralized record linking communication streams to people).
Something like Mulvad will cost you €5 a month, way cheaper than any streaming service.
I got used to using a VPN back when I live in the UK (which is probably the worst Surveillance State in Europe after Russia, as show by the Snowden Revelations which in Britain only led to politicians making laws to rectroactivelly make their massive civil society surveillance practices legal) and as it so happenned it was perfect at hiding my sailing of the high seas from those law firms (which were very active there) for more than a decade there.
The way things are fast decaying in so-called Democracies when it come to the actually practice of democracy in governance, it’s probably a good idea to start doing your online life behind a VPN (not that it suffices, but it’s a start).
Thanks for the reply! Sorry I didn’t get around to answering earlier. I have been too preoccupied with work, so my Internet activity was limited to streaming and gaming for a very long time now. Gaming is still fine, having GoG and Steam around. But streaming is becoming less and less attractive and more complicated due to fragmentation (granted, it’s not as bad as in the USA yet).
I’ll check out Mulvad and some other VPNs, thanks for the hint. I just keep hearing that torrenting in Germany still is dangerous, despite using a VPN. Does Stremio with real debrid work without the torrent part?
I’m old school and just download torrents with something like BiglyBT and put them in my local NAS (which is really just a bunch of portable HDs connected to my router), from where I can access them anywhere in my home, most importantly from a cheap media player connected to my TV.
Been doing this for over a decade and it works for me. Also I know how to do it in a way that keeps me safe from such legal firms extorting money from people pirating digital works, whilst if you thrown “convenience” software into the mix, it’s harder to make sure it’s not leaking your IP address or other personal data even when using a VPN.
The rule with running under a VPN is to:
Use a VPN provider which does not keep logs, hence my recommendation of Mulvad but there are others that the community considers reliabled in that respect (look around)
Do not register for any pirate anything using your e-mail.
Configure your torrent application to only connect via the VPN (settings depend on the program) so that it doesn’t “leak” by using your ISP connection directly if, for example, you forgot to start the VPN.
Personally I also tend to chose a VPN exit point outside my own country to make things harder from a legal point of view: complex legal cases involving multiple legal jurisdictions aren’t worth the trouble for the legal system to catch a person torrenting for personal use.
If your torrenting goes via a VPN (hence it’s important to make sure it’s not leaking) all that those law firms have is an IP address to an exit point of the VPN provider. Unless the VPN provider is willfully cooperative (i.e. a letter in legal language merelly asking is enough for them to give the data, and the whole point of the likes of Mulvad is that they are not cooperative) those legal firms need to get a Court Order to force the VPN provider to give them the IP address of the machine using that VPN exit point at that time (i.e. your machine) and if the VPN provider doesn’t keep logs they can’t give that data since they don’t have it anymore, plus is both the VPN provider and the exit point are in a different country - i.e. a different legal jurisdiction - it gets even harder because, for example, German Courts can’t directly issue valid court orders for other countries (it’s pretty simple when the target is your local ISP, not so much if it’s, say, a company in Sweden)
It’s simply not worth it for those law firms or the courts to go after common torrenting in such a situation, especially as there is a vast number of easy to extort people torrenting from their home connection directly, what the Americans would call “low hanging fruit”.
Certainly this is how it worked in the UK which had the same kind of situation.
A VPN is not a protection for people committing actual real crimes (say, murder for hire) because it’s definitelly worth it for the Justice System to jump through the hops needed to get such a person (in this case they would need a court order to wiretap the VPN provider to catch that person on the act and other legal jurisdictions would definitelly cooperate in a timelly manner to catch a murderer), but for people just doing normal torrenting for personal consumption it’s absolutelly not worth it to overcome that many hurdles to give somebody a fine. For those law firms too, it’s just easier to send legal letters to the ISPs of people torrenting via their home connection directly to get their name and address (without even involving a Court) and then send those people threathening legal letters than to try and legally force an uncooperative VPN provider in a different country to give them the IP address of the home user whilst they still have it (if I remember it correctly, Mulvad’s logs are in-memory only and last only 24h).
Thanks mate! I haven’t pirated anything in ich a long time that I really need to get back into it. But most wikis/mega threads are for piracy outside of Germany, so it’s difficult to find good information. You gave me some good pointers and, more importantly, ease of mind.
I was also planning on using my NAS to stream movies from like I did in the past.
I don’t have time to fuck with managing a seedbox to make ratios and community participation bullshit (looking at you, abt). I don’t even have time to fight incompletes on a usenet block. Let me drop a Benjamin in your “donation” box every couple of years and I’ll cover part of the server as long as I can find what I need, when I want it, in the quality I’m looking for.
I have subscriptions to a few of the big boys through legal cross-marketing deals; it’s still better to know that my shows will be waiting for me on my server if and when I ever get around to watching them.
Just stopped in to say fuck you to the greedy motherfuckers who created a market for sharing massively overpriced content and now cry all over their piles of money cause they are BIGGER piles of money.
What about the small, local services that are just trying to pay the broadcast production bills and make a little cash to become viable businesses?
Fuck those people too?
Because these piracy services also affect them. These services restream the content taking away revenue from the small streaming services. In many cases we’re talking about volumes less than 100. So these restream services pop up, illegally use trademarks and copyrighted materials to advertise, and can reduce volumes enough that they are no longer viable.
Sometimes these things affect regular people trying to make life work too. Not just billionaire assholes who legitimately deserve the criticism.
Would you really put the blame on piracy for that when there are conglomerates manipulating the entire market? I’m not doubting they exist, but can you name a small business streaming service that would be affected by pirate services? I have never heard of such a company. I’ve seen small streaming services utilized by libraries but they are on government contracts and tax funded as far as I know.
They make hardware with defects looking at you RROD and YLOD , they expect you to rebuy everything again every time there is a new console ( Nintendo). They remove your content that you have paid for from your library (Amazon, Sony, music from games), they alter the deal after purchase by instering DRM and shitty launchers and turn off servers (Ubisoft and EA). They lock you out of accessing stuff on devices you own with DRM (eg Netflix 4k on linux ).
Then we have regional releases, changes to privacy policies which we didn’t agree to when we signed up.
Add to the fact we’re being fucked over at every turn. The price of everything is increasing, housing is a mess, they’re fucking up the environment while record profits have been pouring in year on year.
They can go suck a lemon 🍋
I will only support FOSS and those who help further that goal such as valve. Otherwise it the high seas everyday.
The solution is so easy. Make your content available at a reasonable price, make it easy to use, don’t restrict it by geography, and let people watch it on any device that can connect to your service.
Piracy is about ease of use (it’s getting even easier), and about value. DRM has repeatedly been shown to hurt only the people who try to pay for legitimate access. Not a single time has it prevented me from getting a copy of something if I wanted to, and it’s clearly not stopping people from providing those copies or streams.
So stop wasting bathtubs of money on stopping piracy, but maybe take a few less buckets of money from consumers in exchange for your service. As long as you price it such that the cost of being legit can’t compete with the ease of use and value from piracy, some folks aren’t going to make the choice you want them to.
Some folks won’t be able to spend on your service anyway, because they just can’t afford it - but they still might buy other merchandise, they can still spread how great your show is to their friends who possibly will subscribe to your service, but regardless you aren’t going to get their dollars no matter what you do. So stop trying.
What’s a reasonable price to you? Can you apply this same value to everyone? Seems like just about anything is easy to access through various services except for maybe some niche stuff. I don’t think being “easy” is quite enough. People like getting stuff for free even if they can afford it.
Do you need all of them at once? It’s ok to rotate. I subscribe to different things at different times. I still download stuff if, either what i have access to isn’t good enough or if i just can’t find what I’m looking for through conventional means.
Dunno. Less than what things cost now? I think knocking down the geographic restrictions and letting people watch it on any device or OS that can connect are likely bigger fights than pricing, if the industry actually cared to solve the problem.
It’s not as if we don’t have examples of this. Yes, some people still pirate music. Roughly 20 years ago, almost literally everyone with the knowhow was pirating music. (And with services like kazaa, emule, etc, it took very little knowhow)
You know what didn’t solve it? Prosecuting consumers, high prices, and DRM.
What solved it was when Apple started selling legit music for 99 cents per track, and keeping album costs reasonable. (Much as I hate to give apple any credit.) Spotify, amazon, etc all got on board, and now almost no one pirates music. (I pre-apologize for whatever detail I misremembered there - that was a long time ago.)
Am I saying that exact model will apply to video streaming services? No, but what’s not going to do it is prosecuting consumers, high prices, and DRM. We have decades of proof of this.
People like getting stuff for free even if they can afford it.
Some people will pirate no matter what. You can worry about them, or you can worry about everybody else. At some point (and I suspect we’re well past it) the return on investment has got to start looking pretty bad for all the money and technology they have tried to throw at piracy.
Thanks for the reply! Valid points. I was one of the ones that downloaded a ton of music before it was available at all, back in the Napster days. It’s harder for some reason with video. With the music they can just throw everyone’s stuff on there but video for some reason can only go to maybe a couple of services which really limits what some people have access to.
I don’t worry about the ones pirating at all, lol. I’m actually looking into setting up arr apps but my setup is not conventional so it will take some fiddling.
The solution is so easy. Make your content available at a reasonable price, make it easy to use, don’t restrict it by geography, and let people watch it on any device that can connect to your service.
They had achieved this just a short time ago, and their subscriptions and profit reflected that consumers were happy with the offerings. But the studios wanted MORE, and now everything is fragmented across a dozen different services with increased subscription fees, and geo-locks so you can’t share accounts. I was paying almost $100 per month for subscriptions at one point, and then they fragmented it further and I said “fuck it, I’m out!”. I cancelled everything. They think they can endlessly exploit their consumers, and maybe there is a sub-section of them that will endure never ending fragmentation and price increases, but I’m not one of them. Bye!
I don’t want to have five different streaming services that cost twice what cable used to cost, and is way more inconvenient trying to figure out which platform has what. Streaming can get fucked!
Adding to the discussion, if you want to watch anything that’s not mainstream (i.e. non-western, or arthouse), you’re basically supposed to either wait for it to stream on Mubi or get a Blu-ray/DVD (that are often out of circulation if it’s more than 5 years old). So the only real option is pirating.
Convenience, I'd imagine. Not everybody wants to deal with ads or self-hosting.
I also know someone that subs to a pirate streaming site that they use for learning English. It has a solid library but also has dual subtitles on everything and categories based on vocabulary difficulty and accents. It's cheaper than a single legit subscription, but has way more value (both the language stuff and the massive pirated library).
For several years (at least half a decade) I used a service that provided live TV for most major networks, and reliable, easy to access streaming of literally every televised sport I ever heard of, and many that I didn’t know existed or didn’t expect to be televised.
It was easy to use, had all the live TV we cared for (incl and especially sporting events, which was the only thing we weren’t already getting by legit streaming services or other means, and which we cared about watching live vs later ) for 30 bucks a month. I started using it right after I forked out a couple hundred bucks to the NHL only to find that doing so just made it so that it cost me a lot of money to be blacked out from the games we cared to watch.
It was what we all want streaming services to be - reliable, comprehensive, high quality, easy to use, and cheap.
That’s why.
Edited to add - the service went down last year. I know of no similar replacement, but given this article they must exist.
I have a credit card that I don’t use for daily use, so it always has a sub $100 balance. It’s easy for me to notice if there are any extra charges. I think if you were really concerned about privacy, they accept cryptocurrency.
Add comment