two lesbian twin sisters who are both 25 years old who are in an incestuous relationship with each other is morally okay in my opinion because what they’re doing is completely harmless....
(Content warning, discussions of SA and misogyny, mods I might mention politics a bit but I hope this can be taken outside the context of politics and understood as a discussion of basic human decency)...
This is essentially the problem with forums that grow faster than mods can keep up. Everything is fine until something like this comes along. When the brigades come out, trying to maintain order and read every comment for content becomes impossible. Unfortunately all we can do is hold each other accountable. Those that can take the abuse stand their ground for others that can't. And when the dust settles, hopefully someone will have learned something. Even if that something is just reinforcing their choice. It's all part of maturing, both for the site and for the people. Just don't let it get you down. This site is not representative of the general population. Neither is Reddit. There are more people in this world that empathize with you than there are on this site.
Whoa whoa wait, so it is the responsibility of men to coddle the women and make them feel better?
I never said that. You don't have to do anything except respect a woman's decision to not be alone with you. That's all. If you want to understand why a woman would choose a bear over you, you'll have to ask them. But ask nicely, because no one owes you an answer.
Choosing the bear is stupid and irrational.
It's not about the bear. It's about choosing not to be alone with you.
then isn’t it women’s responsibility to not cause men to feel hurt?
They aren't trying to hurt you. They don't even know who you are. They are simply stating they would rather be alone with a bear than with you because they don't know you. If you feel hurt by that, that's on you. You have the right to feel that way. You don't have the right to make it anyone else's problem. Just like it would be their problem to deal with the bear, it's your problem to deal with your own feelings.
What you wrote is “men have a problem? Men need to fix it. Women have a problem? Men also need to fix it.”
I did nothing like that. You simply choose to interpret it that way. What I said was your feelings are your responsibility. Women aren't asking you to do anything. Women are dealing with their problem by choosing their bear instead of dealing with you. You can't berate and ridicule them for that decision, because it's not your decision to make. The best that you can do is try to understand the decision. If you don't want to do that, that's fine. No one is asking you to be a part of the conversation. But you are taking it upon yourself to inject your opinion into the conversation anyways. You are choosing to feel offended by a decision that has nothing to do with you personally. But it's no one else's responsibility to make you understand.
No one said that you have to fix anything. No one wants you to fix anything. No one is obligated to have anything to do with you. That's the whole point. No one owes you an explanation. No one owes you empathy. If you feel you have fingers pointed at you, that's because you put yourself in front of those fingers. If someone says that they'd rather be alone with a bear than a random man, and you get offended by that, it's because you decided to be a random man. Not a man that they know, not someone that they trust. You decided to put yourself in the role of the antagonist that they want nothing to do with. And then you decided to be offended by that. No one else did this. They weren't talking about you specifically, but you act like they did anyways.
Stop trying to fix things and just let woman express their feelings. You might actually learn something.
That's fine. No one is forcing you to be around unknown women. And those women aren't going to be offended that you don't want to be around them. Those woman aren't going to call you completely irrational for choosing not to be around them. Those women aren't going to demand that you empathize with them. You are free to feel however you want.
I’m sure those unknown women would think I’m silly for just wanting to be in a room with people who aren’t going to sexually harass me.
Why would anyone do that? No one wants to be sexually harassed. That's the point women are trying to make. They don't want to be sexually harassed either, that's why they are choosing the bear.
Seriously, you don't have to take it personally. Women aren't saying they'd rather be alone with a bear than you, specifically. Just as all women aren't the same as the women that have harrassed you, you are not the same as the men that have harrassed them. You, specifically, are not the man they'd choose a bear over. You are not the subject of their feelings. Stop taking it personally, and you won't feel bad.
You are specifically choosing to put yourself in that group and then get offended by it. That's no one else's problem but your own. Yes, I'm dismissing what you say, because you keep trying to portray yourself as a victim when it has nothing to do with you. You're not a victim just because a woman who doesn't know you would choose not to be alone with you.
You are not owed reciprocation. You are not owed appreciation. No one is asking you to listen to them. You've taken it upon yourself to respond to a woman making a general statement that's not directed at you. You made that choice.
It's not the responsibility of women to ensure that you do not become radicalized. You have to take ownership of your own life and the choices that you make. That includes the choice to become aggressive, or hostile, or to become a rapist. Women don't make you do those things. You decide to do those things, no matter how you try to justify it. The choice is yours alone.
You want someone to listen to you? You want "respect"? You have to give it first. That's how life works. You can either go around being respectful to other people, and if it's reciprocated then great but if not then you move on. Or you can go around being disrespectful to everyone until you get respect first, and people will rightfully treat you the same way.
Women are not venting to you. They are just venting. You are choosing to inject yourself into the conversation and demand that they listen to you first. You're demanding that they accept your solutions without question. And then you wonder why no one wants to listen to you. If you're unwilling to see that, that's your problem.
would you rather be alone in a forest with a bear or a black person”
Stop comparing yourself to black men. This isn't about race.
And that’s what men in the feminist conversations normally do - listen and care and respect. I am no exception.
Yeah, except....
If women expect men to listen, could they please listen for once?
You don't want to listen. You're just waiting for your turn to talk.
a comparison of men to dangerous animals, irrespective of any nuance, which is a form of attack on a social group.
Again, you are purposely putting yourself in that group and getting offended by it. You are not being oppressed just because someone who doesn't even know you exist would rather not be alone with you.
And that’s where we have to interject.
Which is why women are choosing the bear. Unfortunately you don't seem to get that. You don't have to interject, because it's not about you.
Because there is no difference between a white man and black man. On average, they are physically similar. But there is a massive physical difference between men and women. And before you interject with "ackshually, women can rape men too." No one is disputing that. But how it is done and how often it happens is vastly different. Violent rape is a legitimate concern for every single woman, whether you want to accept it or not.
Purposefully putting myself to what group?
a comparison of men to dangerous animals, irrespective of any nuance, which is a form of attack on a social group.
I literally pointed out what group I was referring to.
You claim that you're willing to listen, but you insist that women listen to you and accept your solutions without question. You claim you're being attacked, when women are asked the question on camera without directing it at any specific person. You claim women are wrong to feel that way, without ever asking why they feel that way and what experiences lead to that decision. You claim you're standing up for yourself, against women that would choose to be alone with a bear rather than a random unknown man.
No one wants your solutions. No one asked for your solutions. No one is attacking you, because no one even knows who you are. No woman is wrong for feeling anything. And no woman should be forced to choose any man are not comfortable with, even if you're a "nice guy". It's not about you...
Black people have been enslaved and then treated like shit by racists for centuries. That's why they are associated with criminal activity, not because they actually commit more crimes compared to everyone else. It's not the same as the vast difference of men committing violent sexual assaults on women as opposed to women committing violent sexual assaults on men. The fact that you're trying to equate them just shows you're a racist as well.
Besides, here you agree with black people it’s not just “people venting”, it is an attack.
a comparison of men to dangerous animals, irrespective of any nuance, which is a form of attack on a social group.
You said that, not me.
Again, no one is attacking men. A bunch of women were asked on camera by a man, without warning, and they gave an off the cuff honest answer. You can't get upset with all women just because some made a choice you don't agree with. Especially not when that choice has nothing do with you, because they don't even know you exist. Seriously, get over yourself. It's not about you...
You are not being oppressed just because you're a man.
We just had to listen to black people saying what to do all along.
You're so very very close, but you just don't want to take that last step. So let's carry you the rest of the way.
We just had to listen to women saying what to do all along.
You're in a post filled with women sharing their SA stories and explanating why they choose the bear. Instead of crying that you're being attacked, why not try listening to them. Not suggest solutions, not tell that they are wrong for choosing the bear, not explaining how dangerous bears actually are, not taking things personally because these stories are not about you or what you would do. Just listen, and at least try to empathize. That's all. If you want to make a post to vent about how you're supposedly oppressed, go right ahead. But this post is not about you.
This post is far from being the first relating to the experience of sexual abuse
Yeah, and? So what if it's not the first one. There's no limit on the number of posts about sexual assault that women are allowed to create.
This post is not that. It’s a ragebait utilizing an attack
No, it's women sharing stories about why they choose the bear. You call it ragebait simply because you put yourself in the group that isn't being picked by women.
In those circumstances, calling someone to listen and ignoring them telling you they see an attack in the way this is shaped is hypocritical at best.
Yes, it is, which is why I don't understand why you keep doing it. This is not an attack against you. You've been told that several times now.
As a wider point, I also say that we should listen not only to women (but to them too), but also to men,
Fine. Great. Let's listen to men. But a post about how women are choosing the bear and why is not the place to insist that we must listen to men.
If your priority is prevention rather than pure shows of hostility, you better be a listener for both, regardless of the direction of abuse.
Right. Which is why you should stop talking about being attacked and just listen.
Get rid of those angry, masculine mannerisms (lemmy.ca)
18+ Lesbian incest is morally okay
two lesbian twin sisters who are both 25 years old who are in an incestuous relationship with each other is morally okay in my opinion because what they’re doing is completely harmless....
Addiction is a scary thing. (lemmy.world)
brummie 🤮 (files.catbox.moe)
Tesla now spends ad money to influence shareholders approval of Elon Musk's $55B payday (electrek.co)
Unitree's new G1 humanoid robot is priced at only $16,000, and looks like the type of humanoid robot that could sell in the tens of millions. (newatlas.com)
Lemmy is a worse platform for women than Reddit was
(Content warning, discussions of SA and misogyny, mods I might mention politics a bit but I hope this can be taken outside the context of politics and understood as a discussion of basic human decency)...
18+ To what do blind people jerk off?
HOW?!??!?!???
nuanceposting (lemmy.cafe)
:::spoiler Important clarification/FAQ I am not calling to coddle or excuse the behavior of bigoted men in any way!...