This is why I don’t fuck guys who “don’t pay attention to politics”.
That means one thing, and it isn’t that they are blissfully unaware of the day to day happenings in their town, county, state, region, country, or planet of residence.
I think there’s a difference between someone who doesn’t pay attention to politics and someone who just doesn’t want to argue politics. Someone who doesn’t pay attention to politics at all is too sheltered and doesn’t understand the issues that have been going on and affect a lot of people, so a lot of those people don’t want to date someone who won’t be able to understand something vital to them and that has an effect on their lives. Especially since someone who hasn’t been paying attention likely doesn’t have a lot of the same principles and beliefs.
In my experience, that’s the case 100% of the time. I’ve never once in my 30+ years heard a liberal say the same thing. It’s always Nazis Republicans trying to deflect and sweep their shitty views under the rug because they think it’s some kind of trump card to get around their awful views and have civilized society allow them back in so they can spread their hate.
This 100%. To not care about politics means to not care about how the entity with a monopoly on violence wants to take your money against your will and allocate it. If you don’t care about that, then you and I are not going to get along.
wants to take your money against your will and allocate it
Speak for yourself
I pay my taxes with a smile because they mean my neighbours won’t ever be likely show up at my door to steal from me when they don’t have enough to eat. And that my brother can have his cancer treatments without paying the insane costs associated with those treatments. And that my mother can enjoy her garden for the last 20 years of her life instead of working until she croaks.
I bartend. I was working on Easter, and one of our semi regulars came in with a guy that she was obviously on a drink date with. They’d been at at least one other bar before they came in; they’d had a couple drinks, but weren’t past maybe tipsy.
At one point, she mentioned that the reason the last place they’d been to was slow was likely that it happened to be Easter. At the mention of the word the guy interrupted with,
“I REFUSE TO TALK ABOUT ANY POLITICS OR RELIGION!!”
To me this was a sign that this dude cared very much about religion and politics, but just like how scientologists don’t drop the Xenu shit on you right away, he wanted to wait until any prospective partner was in too deep before revealing how abhorrent his views are.
That regular isn’t my favorite person, but I was proud of her for pretty much ending that date after that.
That’s literally a bar rule. Lol. Alcohol makes people talk like they are on the internet in real life. Doesn’t make sense to discuss nuance when you’ve been drinking especially with the touchy subjects.
I’ve never had anyone who said politics and religion aren’t good conversation actually be worth having those conversations with. Everyone else from every other walk of life has no problem having a nuanced conversation about that stuff, it’s only ever WASPs that get all indignant and force everyone else to stop talking.
One of my coworkers had asked something about trans people and bathrooms, and I started to say my piece, but mid sentence the owner comes back like “under no circumstances are you allowed to have this conversation here”.
Oh yeah, so threatening to say that I don’t care who is in what bathroom if they don’t do anything that violates another guests bodily autonomy.
So controversial and brave.
We’ve spent plenty of time talking about the different racist inspired restaurants in the area and the deplorable dog whistle specials they offer, never cared about that offending anyone.
The restaurant in question was the MoonCricket Grille, and they were offering $0.49 Bud lights after the outrage about them in honor of the 49 who died at the Pulse nightclub.
This is my go-to response whenever anyone wants to start talking politics with me. Mainly because whenever someone wants to talk politics it’s usually not because they’re liberal and I really hate talking with people who just want to prove that their opinion is the right one.
I’ll admit I’ve used it for similar reasons. What I really should be saying is “I’m sorry, but I don’t want to talk about this right now.” Maybe I’ll even be brave and say “I don’t want to talk about this with you.” but it’s rare for me to find a person I don’t want to hear at all from. That usually comes up because they’ve already made their arguments, and I’ve already accepted or rebuttal the points to my own satisfaction. At that point they’ll talk themselves into circles looking for justification for parts of their stance, but unable to articulate it themselves. I’ll listen to anyone’s views at least once, given I’m in the right mindset, but I still wouldn’t date someone I don’t morally agree with. Life partners should have higher standards than conversation partners, and aligning values is a bare minimum for relationships.
It depends on why they don’t pay attention to politics. Personally, I kind of have to go ostrich-mode and bury my head in the sand when school gets stressful because I just don’t have the mental bandwidth to deal with both. I’m not going to judge someone too harshly for protecting their mental health from the absolute shitshow that is the American political landscape.
PS: This is not to say that any degree of modern conservatism is okay. Bigots can go fuck themselves and I’d be out punching Nazis and being a medic at protests if it didn’t jeopardize my future so significantly. (Felony convictions make it really hard to get a medical license and I have to pay off my student loans somehow. Besides, I’ll be in a much better position to make a meaningful difference as a physician than as a heavily indebted student or EMT.)
this. you can pay little attention to politics without being a “centrist” who isn’t actually a centrist. news can be depressing as fuck, i’m hella glad i strongly limited my consumption of them, but that doesn’t mean i’m gonna start both-sidesing shit. (with the exception of tankies vs nazis, because those two are in fact the same authoritarian, anti-west, bigoted crap under different flags that love to larp against each other)
I was responding to the previous comment, not OP. OP was saying conservatives get upset when people won’t sleep with them because they’re conservative. From the text of the comment I responded to, it looks like the person is saying “moderates” just don’t care about anyone but themselves. I’m adding that often the people the actual OP is talking about pretend to be the moderates the previous commenter is discussing.
I see conservative men getting with conservative women all the time, if they’re complaining about nothing being available they need to look at themselves in the mirror or look in different places (maybe hip, urban environments aren’t the best places to date for conservatives?) Switching up politics isn’t some magic solution to getting laid.
I think we run in different crowds. One of my friends once confessed to making out with a trumpster, didn’t even go further. It was considered a point of shame and we made fun of him the rest of the night. I firmly stand by my role in reaffirming sanctions.
Of course not. What’s unreasonable is the tribalistic, us vs them attitude based on poorly applied labels that leave no room for constructive discussion.
People calling themselves “Conservatives” these days are actually reformers who are about the least conservative bunch you’ll ever find. No true Scotsman conservative would join a death cult.
Except they still call themselves conservatives and they still keep voting for people who openly state they want to oppress women and minorities
You can’t explain your way out of it the mask is off. If you identify as conservative in modern America you are undeniably supporting fascist ideologies.
Why is it the only time I ever hear the word “fiscal” is when a conservative is defending their entire half of the political sphere 😂 let’s all look past the human rights abuses and absurd gerrymandering/rigging of the entire democratic system and just think about the “fiscal responsibility” aspect (That, paradoxically, only ever actually seems to drive the national debt up faster when conservatives are in charge)
You should date someone with at least some reasonable overlap of ideals. If you wish to have a family unit, like conservatives certainly do, you need to have common ground and mutual respect or you will end up with yet another single mother raising a potentially negative statistic and father losing his child or bailing.
Oh no, you gotta figure out what sort of situation works for you. It is beneficial to find someone that has some overlapping ideals as yourself, heck most of your friends and you probably already have some overlap you may not have thought about.
Do you not have an overlapping fundamental agreement with your partner about how the world works and what’s moral values are most important?
Like you’re not gonna agree on everything I know, but “are some people inherently better than others, should a justice system focus on punishment or rehabilitation, is education valuable for society, was the earth created by evolution or God, do you want kids(+ a couple questions if “yes”)” are, in my mind, things you need to agree on with the person you intend to share your life with.
So what you’re saying is: relationships require respect? Yeah, that’s one reason a lot of leftism is built upon respect for one another. Conservatism, the best I can understand stand it relies on feeding an outdated lie that there are multiple classes of people, some being better and more deserving than others.
But yeah, you don’t respect your partner you lose your partner, but that does not a conservative or conservative argument make.
“Why won’t women, objects meant to feed and pleasure me, give me the time of day like this super old-ass book I had read and interpreted to me by someone who is likely a child molester said they should? Do they worship Saytahn?”
Y’all are the only ones that use the term. The onus is on you to produce a workable definition that can be written down without changing the definition when it’s convenient.
I’m willing to accept the definition Ron desantis’ lawyer used:
During the testimony, Warren’s attorney, Jean-Jacques Cabou asked those within DeSantis’ administration what “woke” meant to them.
The governor’s general counsel, Ryan Newman, said, in general, it means “the belief there are systemic injustices in American society and the need to address them.” He added that DeSantis doesn’t believe there are systemic injustices in the country, reports Florida Politics.
Interesting, as a leaning conservative myself I never had any issues getting women. Something tells me it’s not really about your beliefs but confidence. If you project confidence in your beliefs women and people in general will be drawn to you. Also I noticed from my previous serious relationships that my girlfriends would tend to agree with my point of view after some time.
Wow that an alpha! Did you know that wolves only display alpha behavior and hierarchy while they’re in captivity? The author who originally wrote about alpha male behavior in the 80s realized this later and has spent the rest of his life trying to walk back his findings because human males in captivity have been trying to emulate his flawed findings. It’s very ironic that self proclaimed alpha males are actually just saying that they’re imprisoned in some way and are coping with that by trying to desperately find some kind of control in a fake air of “confidence”. It’s pathetic and sad really. Actual men are empathetic and looking for an equal partner instead of someone they can bludgeon into their way of thinking because they’re so insecure.
I swooned. The masculine strength of his opinions assaulted me in waves. I tried to resist but my feeble feminine brain was unable to come up with a single rebuttle, my resolve cracked under the strain.
“Oh take me, take me now under the steely gaze of your Anne Rand poster” I gasped, racistly.
Absolutely. I’ve been working really hard to improve my health both mentally and physically. I’m down 75 lbs. I’m trying to be the best version of myself.
You’re right, but I’m not sure you understand the mechanics behind it. You probably think since you don’t look like a gigachad, that you don’t get dates. Women do care about looks sometimes, but not nearly as much as guys tend to fixate on. The quality I hear women trying to find most in a man is decency, followed by personality, shared interests, connection and then yeah, I guess looks.
The trope you’re playing is funny, which is why we keep seeing it in media. A similar trope is seeing a “10/10” girl with a “3/10” guy and saying… “him!?!” Or something about him needing to be rich or something… because women only care about looks. In reality it seems that men think women only care about looks.
So, just keep in mind, if women won’t date you, it has to do with a lot more than your looks. You can take that as a burn, or you can look within yourself, see if you think you have what women want (what I have mentioned) and if so, you’re at the longest and final stage: putting yourself out there.
Edit: just to clarify, I define “decency” with a simple test which is “do I participate in any activities that go against what women are asking have been asking for for decades?” Things like right-wing politics (abortion bans, subservience to men), a livable wage, repect for consent, etc… if the answer is no, you aren’t “decent”. They aren’t asking for power over men, they’re asking not to get raped and to have the bodily autonomy just as men have. They are asking guys not to hypersexualize them from children and try to understand that they aren’t flirting with you at work, they just need to be nice to keep their job, and that they receive a lot of unwanted attention. They’re also asking for guys to take them seriously and a lot of them would want men to know that they don’t bring these topics up because it can create an unsafe situation for them, that it even might have in their past, possibly more than once. We think that we know who men are when we see how they behave around other men. Unfortunately an astoundingly large number of men are abusive to women when other men aren’t around. So yeah, you fail the decency test for politics if those politics harm women.
I get you. Sorry for the serious reply, it wasn’t meant for you so much as it was meant for other people who unironically feel the same way as you joked.
What if you can’t get dates because you because you’re not attractive… and have severe ADHD or Autism or Dyspraxia, and anxiety disorders so it’s hard to make friends in the first place because of RSD, much less long-term partners
The advice to “just be yourself” is the best advice I can give, but I can elaborate. I should mention that I have severe ADHD, that 70% of ADHDers also have Autism (and that I feel I could be in that 70%), and also have some anxiety disorders too. I am also married and have been in poly relationships in the past. Here’s what I didn’t do:
I didn’t try to “fake it til you make it” with regards to confidence.
I didn’t follow any playbook. A friend of mine got super into the “[pseudo]science of seduction” which just seemed stupid and cringey so I ignored his advice.
I didn’t approach women in person often, and the few times it did it failed. I was akward, I had a stupid opener, she clearly didn’t want to be bothered, so I left (or she left and I didn’t follow).
I didn’t try to chat people up at their job.
What I did do:
thought long and deeply about the places where women would go to meet men. Aside from speed dating and maybe a sex club, I could come up with nothing. Every other place I could think of had issues: market? She’s shopping. At work? She’s working. At ladies night? Maybe but its possible she’s there to party, not to meet guys. School? She’s studying… none of these places were great places to try to meet women.
decided that I needed to try online dating. Tried a few sites and ended up on ok cupid for a bit. You know, the thing about online dating is that women sometimes go to online dating sites to meet men. I met some women, not all of them ones I connected well with. I had some flings. I was honest and ethical about the fact that I was poly and didn’t want to lock anyone into an exclusive arrangement with me.
I got jealous on occasion, but because I didn’t want anyone to “lock me down”, it was only fair that I didnt try to lock anyone else down. I worked on my jealousy. I read “the ethical slut” and started to understand and then feel compersion for my partners when they were off with other lovers.
There was a period in my life where I didn’t know better and would start being shitty when hearing the word no, following it up with “please?” Or “why?”, but i cut that shit off quickly when it became clear that this behavior wasn’t cute nor was it even remotely appreciated.
I worked at jobs and talked with women as people (e.g. I didn’t try to hit on them or be weird around them). Sometimes it was because it was a small company or sometimes a small team. This lead to some great friendships, and parties. A few times at these parties I met women who I later spoke with online and had a sexual relationship later.
One time I was going to go on a date with a woman later in the week, and later on met a married woman at a party. She wanted some attention, we danced, she talked about her shitty husband and said she wanted to fuck me, so we did after everyone went to bed, under a pop-up canopy during a thunderstorm. Great experience, she was happy and I shared that experience with the woman I had planned on going on a date later, thinking that she, who is also poly would find it exciting. She didn’t. She cancelled the date because I helped someone cheat, and that wasn’t very ethical. She was right. I didn’t mind at the time because her husband sounded like a chode and she wanted to cheat anyway, but it wasn’t something I will ever do again. I modified my ethics and behavior after that.
I went to burning man and was overwhelmed by how many extroverts where there, so I hung out near my tent. I happened to be caming near a woman from another state who was also an introvert. We chatted and hung out together, later hooking up and staying in touch before she became a trumper.
Another time at burning man, I hung out near a lot near camp (the burn is nice but there are a lot of extroverts!). I met a friend of a friend, asked her if she wanted to watch the spaceship liftoff (an art installation). Just something to do, not expecting or anticipating anything. I was attracted to her but mostly she was just around camp a lot like I was so we built up a small rapport. We watched the thing, went to a club and she asked if she could go down on me. We went back to my tent and hooked up.
I had driven a woman to burning man and was going to bring her back (rideshare). Long trip and we both wanted to stop at this hotsprings on the way back from the burn. We stopped there both got naked and got in the water. It was dusk, i felt like we had some rapport so I mentioned that I thought she was cute, or something along those lines. She said she didn’t feel the same, and I took no for an answer. We later kept in touch and I think I met someone else at one of her parties, but I can’t remember, it was a while ago.
In other words, I was myself… an akward, shy guy with basically zero game. I’m not the kind of guy who is showered with complients for being sexy, even in bed. I’m balding and have a belly. 5’ 10".
There really are people for everyone. Give up looking, and just be friendly / friends with women. Find clubs or activities that you enjoy and do those, especially if they are with others. You may just find people who are curious about you and want to get to know you more. Its so much eaiser talking with women when you see and treat them as equals.
Oh yeah I don’t even look for people to date, I can’t really be with someone that doesn’t know me well. It’s just the American suburbs are possibly one of the worst places for social interaction in general, there’s not very much of a way to meet people that’s not, like, harassing them while they’re trying to get groceries lmao (which is an obvious no).
Tangentially, why I want to live in a less car-centric area, I’m an introvert but damn it’s very isolating when everyone’s either at their house or in cars except when they’re busy. Too much asphalt and no sidewalks/bike roads/public transit and no city center or streets to be able to interact with anyone.
Also most typical people in my experience just don’t like it when those with mainly neurodevelopmental disorders are themselves… this is a shared experience with basically all of my ADHD friends, other people feel irritated or awkward when you don’t actively attempt to cover up ADHD (of course, in my experience).
I guess I should also mention that I am american. And yes the suburbs aren’t great for social interaction, the same goes for cities, though. If you like to drink, you can get some social interaction in a bar, and suburbs have bars, of course cities have more.
But since you mentioned NTs not wanting NDs to be themselves, who cares. Do you really want to be with someone you need to mask around 24/7? What if I told you that I met my wife, married her and then years later we both learn we are autistic. She having been diagnosed, me only speculating because of my ADHD, the comorbidity with Autism and some other clues about me that suggest I might be somewhere on the spectrum.
I never asked anyone who I dated if they were Autistic or not, but thinking back on it there were people who weren’t good fits. One person I can remember broke up with me because I would forget often and she had a nearly photographic memory. My wife and I went to counseling to better understand my ADHD as it seemed to her (reasonably) that I was lying to her.
Moral of the story is you can’t even begin to start finding someone for you until you are your whole, unmasked self. Keep in mind here you still have to be decent. If your stimming is actually inappropriate (e.g. public masturbation) then you will have to keep it legal at a minimum. I hate that I even feel the need to mention that, but I have seen some shit excuses online from people trying to excuse abusive behavior because that person is autistic. These people are usually just trying to be shitty under the guise of having a “a disorder” where they can’t help themselves.
If you have ADHD, my guess is you might have a few hobbies or interests. Do you, maybe in front of others, and just be your ND self. Some people will hate it and others will want to know more about you. People tend to gravite towards people who are “confident” which in this context I mean are confident doing their own thing, despite what anyone else mighr expect. You owe the world nothing.
Your very first step should be therapy/medication. We’re all just randos on the internet and won’t be able to give the same personalized treatment as someone who spent the better part of a decade studying this stuff.
Healthy habits will also help. Just 2 hours of walking total in a week makes a huge difference. You can carve out 20 minutes a day and take one day off a week, or do it all in one go on a nature hike. Cut out alcohol entirely if possible, it’s literally poison and exacerbates mental health issues. Sleep at least 6 hours, cut down on processed junk.
Beyond that I recommend finding local social spaces, like a board game shop, and going there when you feel ready. You could reach out to the owners and see if any special accommodations can be made. The hardest part will be walking in the door - the trick I use is to tell myself I’ll just stick around for 1 hour (30 minutes, 5 minutes, whatever you are able) and then leave if I’m having a bad time.
Aside from that, focus on making friends first and often a relationship will organically grow from there. I won’t pretend that it’s easy, but it’s absolutely possible. You are deserving of love and acceptance just as much as anybody else.
Therapy is extremely expensive, medication is also extremely expensive but worse it screws me up big time because of my GAD/Anxiety and causes me chest pain and cramps (I’d wager the chest pain is related to me having what sounds like angina since I was 7, but iunno, my doctor didn’t find out why)
Social spaces also don’t really exist here, I live in a sort of suburb/commute town so there’s mostly just grocery/department stores and fast food, and I don’t have a car (very expensive) so I can’t get around, there being no sidewalks or public transportation or anything.
Also have extremely bad insomnia, sleep is never guaranteed and I usually wake up in the middle of the night and can’t go back to sleep…
Idk feels like it’s near impossible to make new friends in the first place, not even considering romantic relationships. My only real friends are some of my best friend’s friends (all of who live in different states tho so can’t really do anything with but game) and very few people I’ve met online (they all live in Italy and Texas and stuff, not near me)
Some of these are less so problems with me though and moreso a result of me being broke (even online college is expensive, it’s hard to have excess money)
Speaking of health though, I’ve tried doing basic exercise a lot over the years but my Dyspraxic ass can’t do a push-up without someone placing my limbs in the exact spot they’re supposed to go and showing me how to do it every inch of the way. I do not know anyone to nor have the money for anyone to show me how… the internet also didn’t help me unfortunately.
Good lord the replies to this are sad. Believe it or not it’s a perfectly reasonable expectation to only want to date someone whose core beliefs align with yours (and, y’know, actually respects your rights as an independent human being.)
The comments under that vid are fucking hilarious. If I go any further left I’ll fall off the universe, but I also live a self-reliant life in the forest where I chop my own wood, fetch my water from a creek, run and maintain solar installations, and treat my wife like the wonderful human she is. All while being the traditional provider and ‘manly’ man. My truck is big, because it needs to be when you are building a house and homestead with your own hands.
And all these parking lot cowboys in their spotless lifted trucks think that these values are ‘theirs’. Get fucked losers.
This is what so many of them think. If they really don’t have a problem dating someone left leaning it either means they get off on tearing down strong women or don’t really know what they believe and are still just parroting mommy and daddy’s beliefs.
It’s fine to have dating preferences. The issue is when people who are just calling anyone who is conservative leaning terrible. If you don’t agree with someone’s political ideology, you should just respectfully disagree, not call them a terrible person.
Also, calling people evil for their options is a terribly way to convince them to change, it just makes them get really defensive. If you want to convince someone to change opinion, you need to have a respectful, insightful discussion.
who are just calling anyone who is conservative leaning terrible. If you don’t agree with someone’s political ideology, you should just respectfully disagree, not call them a terrible person.
but they are?? they advocate for oppression of any other group thats not them. why would you respect a person that wishes your disappearance???
I hate to tell you this but that is the definition from like 30 years ago. If you look at their behavior now, they do the exact opposite (see basically any policy they’ve passed in the last 2 years)
It’s not the numerous postal service designations that people are pissed at though. It’s the bills that are making my friends flee the state that people are rightly pissed at. Not every republican is an extremist, but the extremists have control over the party and the rest of the party seems completely fine with them at the wheel. Either it’s extreme apathy or tacit agreement.
But being racist isn’t an automatic loss of a vote for most conservatives. Sure - You can be conservative and not racist, but if you are voting for conservatives who are racist… What is the difference?
What exactly is the GOP doing that is racist? Isn’t racism explicitly unconstitutional? If a candidate was racist, I wouldn’t vote for them.
But I haven’t seen explanations for what they do that is racist. It’s just people who are calling them racist, and saying you’re dumb if you don’t think they’re racist.
I doubt you actually looked up what I’m talking about. Yes, both parties gerrymander, which I agree is an issue. But republican states keep getting sued due to unconstitutionally drawn maps that try to silence the black vote as much as possible
How do you have a respectful or insightful discussion with someone uninterested in being respectful or having insight?
How do you explain the suffering caused by separating children from parents at the border to someone who doesn’t see those people as human? To someone who thinks they deserve to suffer for existing in the wrong color of skin? At what point do you call a spade a spade?
If they’re uninterested in respectful discussion, then you should just leave them alone.
Would you like to know my opinion on those things?
We should definitely make the legal immigration process easier. But we shouldn’t just allow people to immigrate illegally. And you shouldn’t be separating families without a good reason, and it shouldn’t be for very long. A few hours is okay, but if you need go longer than 24 hours, you should give them chances to see their family.
Your skin color doesn’t matter, it should be irrelevant to basically everything. (Also, what was the last law passed that was racist? Because isn’t that completely unconstitutional?)
And no one should suffer. But that’s a really hard goal to reach, and so we do end up with a lot of compromises.
I’d be happy to have a civil discussion over these subjects. All I ask is we don’t call anyone evil, just for being in a particular group.
The meme here didn’t even call anyone evil. That said, if you guys don’t want to be called evil, stop supporting evil shit.
Conservative policies not only rob women of the rights to their own bodies, it gets them killed too. Either conservatives openly support this or they’re somehow too naive to see what the politicians they vote for are doing, and both are good reasons for women to stay the hell away from them.
I’m genuinely curious what reason someone has to support them. Like genuinely. I look at Republicans and am like how the fuck can anyone that isn’t rich and in power be on that side? And then I remember the very potent tactics of fearmongering
“in looking for a woman who will respect my core beliefs as an independent human being, which include not treating her like an independent human being”
As someone with a right-wing father and a left-wing mother: for fuck’s sake date people with your same beliefs. Deep disagreement on something like that is NOT something you can build a trustful relationship upon.
Holy shit, I can’t imagine being in such a relationship even just for a small amount of time. Having kids with someone I fundamentally disagree with is just on another level.
I guess if you’re not into politics/news at all, it can kind of happen. 🤷
Admittedly, we’re not in the US so the divide is much smaller, but Jesus Christ listening to them arguing over half the stuff that came up on TV has definitely not been a pleasant experience.
Conservatism by definition is thinking “Things are good right now, let’s not change anything” or even worse: “Things were better before, let’s go back to that”.
The issue is “better for who”? Women, queer people, POC, working class people were NOT ok. Implicitly you can see that conservatism is bigoted by (at a minimum) ignoring or misrepresenting the realities of people they don’t care about. It’s just that lately, more and more conservatives are explicit about it and showing their true colors, but the philosophical underpinnings are the same.
It’s bad to under-represnt issues. But it’s also bad to over-represent issues. The right answer is almost always in the middle.
The stuff you see in the news is carefully selected to show what makes people the most upset, that way it gets the most clicks.
In the past, women were subservient to men, black people were slaves, and being queer wasn’t even allowed. Nowadays, things have improved a huge amount. There are still problems, but nothing like the past.
You are clearly not a victim of these issues and the situation is so alien to you that apparently the only way for you to relate to them is via the news. Violence and prejudice are things that happen to “other people”.
Real people are suffering real oppression every day. Some in a small almost invisible way and others live in permanent fear of violence because of who they are.
That things were worse in the past is no reason to stop progress. And things did get better because people fought for them, often to death.
I hope you are arguing in good faith and have the moral strength to accept you may be blind to some realities and reconsider your beliefs.
Not really: the meme is mocking people who say they can’t find dates because they are conservative, like these ones (opinion piece but cites sources). So it’s just aimed at people who already “put themselves in boxes”. If they didn’t the whole meme falls apart, since it’s based on a “discrimination” and you have to be aware of what about you is being “discriminated” to complain about it.
Idk if you don’t think LGBTQ+ folks deserve equal rights or think that social programs are “too generous” I’m not really interested in how nuanced the rest of you is.
Not saying that’s your beliefs specifically. Just that enough of us are actively harmed by the results of conservative laws and governance that I’m not really interested in knowing the nuanced part of someone who supports those policies.
Of course everyone deserve equal rights, and yes, the social programs could be infinitely better if we put even more resources towards them.
However, with recent internet restrictions, censorship, and identity politics, we’re also actively being harmed by the left.
That doesn’t mean what the people on the right are doing is any good either, I’m just saying it’s not good to lump everyone into these black and white categories. It creates the weird tribalism we see here.
Ah yes, the radical left rolling out programs like 5 eyes. The radical left that makes it legal for corporations to throw cameras everywhere and deploy facial tracking software. The left who deregulated everything till credit card companies are allowed to determine who can access their money and what you’re allowed to spend it on. That radical left sure does love rolling out censorious police state stuff.
the Democrats are a primary party in a military cult empire that indoctrinates children with flag rites and coups every government that dares to call itself socialist. I’m guessing you’re part of that military cult and thus don’t understand how insane it seems from the outside.
There are left elements, that sandy man seems to flirt with Democratic socialism, although not very strongly. It doesn’t seem like he has much power though.
Labor in the UK has thoroughly remade itself after Thatcher with the new labour movement which distanced themselves from their unionist and socialist roots. They now don’t have any particularly leftist policies, although they are less right than the Tories obviously.
In Australia labor did a similar thing after the USA couped our only elected socialist government and replaced the labour leader with a CIA groomed dude.
The right is utterly ascendant in global politics and has been since the rise of neoliberal economics under Reagan and Thatcher. That power is beginning to wane, but don’t confuse being left of “we should hunt the homeless for sport” with being a leftist government. Leftism isn’t when shouting slurs gets you tutted at, it’s Democratic businesses and worker owned collectives, nationalised infrastructure, anti imperialism, open boarders, welfare above the poverty line, universal recognition of human dignity etc.
In Australia the most mainstream leftist party would be the greens who hold at most 1 to 3 seats out of 150 regularly. Similarly in the UK I am given to understand. There are more radical parties but they’re even more marginalised.
Hah “military cult empire” - that’s a great name for the people/parties you’re referring to.
The UK’s labour party did all of that reforming in the mid nineties though, but I see what you’re trying to get at with the coup’s and neoliberal economic movements.
I’d really like to see what you described (the definition you gave for actually being “left”) - in action. Unfortunately, democracies are inherently not very secure (tech may be able to solve some of this), because of other countries and bad actors. Open borders would make this even harder.
Would there even be a government in this situation? Or would this be more akin to a socialist technocracy?
Do you have any examples of any that have done it yet? Without centralizing any sort of power?
It’s not about nuance. It’s about deal breakers. For some people, a deal breaker might be something like poor hygiene. For other people, it might be voting for or otherwise supporting politicians who belong to a party that’s actively trying to curtail human rights for anybody who isn’t a white cishet man.
That you or anybody else would find the first example acceptable, but not the second, is ridiculous.
I think you missed the point where I said “it’s not about nuance.”
I’m not claiming my examples don’t have nuances, I’m claiming that many (most) people have things on which they won’t compromise. Standards, if you will. Those standards may have nuance, but they remain uncompromising.
To use your examples, if “not trimming their toenails enough” is a deal breaker for someone, then the nuance of “but they shower ever day” doesn’t matter.
Because it’s not about nuance. It’s about deal breakers.
One problem with nuance is that it can be weaponized to pedantry, not that I am accusing you of doing this, but a common tactic I see among conservative talkers is to focus so much on nuance that they intentionally/inadvertently (depending on the person) avoid the topic all-together. It is clear what the person you are replying to is saying, and it is clear that nuance exists. It doesn’t reinforce your point to point out that nuance exists in everything, of course it does.
That said, I warn you to look for occasions where nuance is meant to obscure the core ideas from being discussed.
Their point is that, in a time where a political party is actively banning books, pushing stochastic terrorism, and continues to put forth people who say and do despicable things openly, it is reasonable to reject all people who can’t or won’t stand up to these actions, under the assumption that the rejecter finds these actions despicable.
Or, put a simpler way, using a completely made up example. If I were to require a wheelchair to live, of course I won’t date anyone in the “eliminate wheel chair ramps” party, and it would be silly for you to pretend not to be able to see my perspective in that.
I agree that books shouldn’t be banned, but also probably not all books belong in schools, but should still be purchasable (which I believe is the case you’re referring to in Florida)
I don’t agree with the coercion and censorship that took place during covid, which is why I would lean away from being left. That being said, women (and everyone else) should have full autonomy of their bodies, which is why I would lean away from being on the right.
Nuance can also be something that brings us together, because I think most of us do have some common ground somewhere.
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