In the post shared by Musk, the account lamented the presence of humanitarian groups in the Mediterranean Sea that rescue migrants from distressed vessels.
“These NGOs are subsidized by the German government,” the account posted. “Let’s hope AfD wins the elections to stop this European suicide.”
He endorses a party with Nazis in the highest positions. Bernd/Björn Höcke is the leader of the Thuringian AfD and courts decided that he’s a nazi. Not a right wing extremist, a fucking nazi.
AfD members have called for a second Holocaust (Marcel Grauf and an unknown talker at a party conference), the execution of refugees (Dieter Görnert), the imprisonment of homosexuals (Andreas Gehlmann), the creation of a new SA (Andreas Geithe), the imprisonment of left wingers in Buchenwald, a former concentration camp (Mirko Welsch) and most probably Musks favourite: Germany practicing apartheid (Holger Arrpe).
Thins joke about not using his proper first name is so old and worn out by now it should definitely be retired. Just call the man Bernd and be done with it.
His name is Bernd Höcke, some guy instead called him Björn in a letter to the editor, a comedy show picked it up, people ran with it, others got confused, he was even announced at some point by AfD people as Björn and he clearly doesn’t like it but, as said, it’s getting old.
10-15 years ago I remember being told that Nazism couldn't take hold again in Germany because of all the laws, and the education in schools about Nazis, and stigma, and people who would fist-fight Nazis in the street if they saw right-wing symbols.
Was I sold an optimistic outlook or has the situation just changed that drastically since then?
As a non-German who is particularly not keen about Nazism but who doesn't speak enough German to keep a closer eye on it over there, I'm grateful for your name and shame overview.
I think the global mood (and Overton window) have generally shifted very rapidly to the right in the past 20 years or so, and bigots everywhere aren't as fearful of taking the mask off as they used to be (but the point being - they never went anywhere, they just got good at hiding, but now no longer need to).
I've also been watching a BBC series that's been dealing with the hunt for Nazis after the war, but which touches often on the fact that only a tiny percentage were ever caught or prosecuted, and that many establishments (including the judicial system) was still staffed and run by ex members of the Nazi party.
Never mind all the Nazis that established themselves outside of Germany after the war, and then those who simply support similar ideas (like those who inspired them in the first place - the American white supremacist)
So yeah, the theory is nice, but the reality is quite different.
It's also worth noting that denazification happened in theory, but in practice Nazis remained in high powered positions pretty much continually after the war
An eternal problem that likely contributes far more than we could ever guess. Tragic.
I remember that we discussed this specific question at school. How dangerous it is to believe that “this can’t happen here again because we all remember it and everybody is so well educated about it”. That’s when you start letting your guard down. That’s also when people who may not identify as nazis (yet) start thinking :“Well, national socialism obviously can’t happen again, therefore MY far right views can’t possibly count as national socialism, therefore they’re ok.”
It’s all bullshit. You can educate people all you want, there will always be a certain percentage of assholes and idiots and we’ve been far too tolerant of those for far too long.
The same happens here as in every other western country. The right-wing shares their winning strategies of disinformation, populism and avoiding talking about actual policies, which seems to work more or less the same in all countries. Germany is just lagging behind a bit.
A lot of people just stared accepting far right wing views like about abortion, LGBT hate and etc. Instead of fighting them. They also made a lot people really belive that all problems we face are not from big companies wo only pay minimum wage (which isn’t enough to support people in bigger cities) or who own over 70% of the real estate in Germany but because of left wing politics and immigrants.
For one, calling every person who is against migrants or refugees “a Nazi” is really bad. I don’t know where this originally started, but people seem to use this word for all kinds of assholes.
Nazis were a political party and in Germany you learn about history of the Nazis and second world war. That’s not the same as learning how to not be against migrants or something.
Nazi symbols etc. are still forbidden and even many extremely right wing people would be appalled if you call them a Nazi. These are two different things. And the inflationary use of the word is really stupid (not directed at you, I see it everywhere online for all kinds of things). You give them an easy way out because they will start a discussion about the word or try to push the narrative that only “real Nazis” are the problem.
The movement to the right you see currently in Germany has the same reasons as the movement to the right you see in other countries currently as well.
Not particularly well-off people and/or not particularly bright people and/or just greedy people are scared they will get left behind or become less wealthy if other people take or even participate in what they see as theirs. Refugees and migrants are by far the easiest target for these frustrations.
Sorry, but no. They arent just a party that happens to be against migrants and is called nazis because of that. That is a part of their reportoire, but the connections go far deeper than that.
The AfD is anti-migrant, anti-gay, anti-trans, anti-women, anti-handicapped, anti-minority and anti-“”“bankers”“” (i.e jews).
Their members routinely (both in public and even more severely in private) make reference to programs and actions by the nazis. Every now and then a photo of one of them doing a hitler salute or standing in front of the hakenkreuz-flag goes public. They have connections to right-wing terrorists.
At the latest when höcke called for a “180 degree turn in history politics" (i.e towards the third reich, not away from it), I have lost any semblence of understanding for anyone who isnt willing to realize that the AfD isnt just a conservative party to the right of CDU/CSU.
They are Nazis.
And not calling them that for some attempt at political maneuvering just means that they and their voters arent confronted with the history and opposition to their ideas, and can instead continue to mask as “just conservatives”.
I am not saying they are just a conservative party. I also didn’t thought the person I reacted to was only talking about AFD, but the general rise in right wing rhetoric in different parties and the populace. It’s also not just the AFD that is problematic.
Just calling them Nazis plays right into their hands and won’t help at all. They will simply turn it around and complain you insult them as Nazis and lament you are just trying to kill their arguments with it.
The term “Nazi” sees so much overuse, you gain absolutely nothing by using it. In my opinion it is better to directly address and call out what they say precisely.
The majority of people voting for the AFD don’t do the Hitler salute and similar. And calling them Nazis won’t change their mind but instead it will do the exact opposite! It will encourage them to vote for the AFD or similar parties because now they can claim you are just trying to insult them and won’t address what they say. “The evil left just wants to silence us!”
Their arguments are easily refuted and that’s what needs to happen again and again. While it might feel satisfying labeling them, it won’t help the cause.
Did you ever argue with one of the AfD voters? They don’t take facts well, they don’t care about facts anymore. It’s a bit like arguing with conspiracy theorists.
There definitely is overlap between them and those who believe in conspiracy theories. But there are a lot of average people who vote for them as well. Like, middle aged, not particularly poor or wealthy. Your typical boomer…
Many AFD voters I’ve heard talking or saw what they write believe that specifically Muslim immigrants are bad for Europe. And/or they think that the green party is responsible for them having less money.
For those AFD voters who are immigrants, they vote for them because they believe refugees specifically cost too much money and they are also against the green party. At least, that’s what I hear from the people in my neighborhood, which is mostly people whose families migrated from Turkey, sometimes two generations ago.
A third group think they somehow get back at the “elite” when they vote for AFD. Like a poor example of an act of defiance.
I believe that at least those who are not primarily xenophobic are still people we could bring to the other side. We waited to long to ban the AFD. I fear if they ban them now, the next right wing party will get a headstart in voters…
While I'm not convinced the distinction between extreme right wing supporters and Nazis is as significant as you suggest, I do understand that it is possible to object to unchecked mass migration without being a Nazi or even being right-wing.
Refugees and corresponding xenophobia are a pretty standard global topic for obvious reasons, and as much as I wish infrastructure could be instantaneously built, I know it can't be.
But:
AfD members have called for a second Holocaust ... the execution of refugees ... the imprisonment of homosexuals ... the creation of a new SA ... the imprisonment of left wingers in Buchenwald ... and practicing apartheid.
We're well past discussing the nuances of "what separates Nazis from other far-right ideology" and plausible deniability when someone starts invoking the name of fucking Buchenwald. Even if the rest of that list were somehow acceptable or could be explained away, there's no mistaking what Buchenwald means.
I'm not surprised by the global rise of the right-wing rhetoric as the situation gets harder for 99% of people. I have been watching that closely for years. Xenophobia is always presented everywhere as the false easy solution. What I am surprised by is that Germany is allowing politicians to advocate specific Nazi atrocities when there are purportedly laws against glorifying Nazis.
Calling for a second holocaust, demanding refugees should be executed, all of this is forbidden in Germany. I don’t know where you got your information from but none of this has happened:
AfD members have called for a second Holocaust … the execution of refugees … the imprisonment of homosexuals … the creation of a new SA … the imprisonment of left wingers in Buchenwald … and practicing apartheid.
There are Nazis in the AFD, though. They want to stop teaching so much about the Holocaust at schools and they use rhetoric tricks to get people riled up or circumvent the laws around denying the Holocaust.
For example Björn Höcke (who almost certainly is a Nazi) said: “Alles für Deutschland” (All for Germany) and has to go to court for this.
I think we still misunderstand each other on why calling right wing people in general Nazis is a problem. And Björn Höcke is a good example.
The word is used as if you are right wing, then extremely right wing and then you are a Nazi. As if this is somehow worse than being extremely right wing. But “Nazi” is not the superlative of being right wing. And people like Höcke will use this to get people to vote for the AFD.
A Nazi is someone who is, for example, denying the Holocaust. Or believes in Herrenrasse or something like that. Right wing people simply have to deny that they are Nazis (which is easily done, look above) and suddenly your “argument” is gone.
That’s exactly what Björn Höcke did before and will do in court again. It will again be about whether or not he can be called a Nazi which is completely irrelevant if you want to tackle the problem that is people voting for AFD and other politicians being increasingly right wing.
When the court says: “Yes, Björn Höcke used Nazi rhetoric!” The AFD will say: “Oh no what an evil man! With Nazis we don’t want to have anything in common! He is not AFD anymore.” And all the people can continue to vote for AFD, they aren’t Nazis afterall. Great!
Literally every single one of these quotes where either proven as false or the people are not part of the AFD and/or they were brought to court and judged for it. That’s all on the site of Faktencheck.
"Größtenteils richtig. Von den 19 Zitaten sind die meisten richtig oder größtenteils richtig. Bei fünf fehlen Belege, vier weitere wurden leicht verändert oder es fehlt Kontext. "
Are you referring to a different Factchecker than the link i posted? Or are you saying they just left up the page with incorrect information? "Proven as false" doesn't seem to match this quote from the link I posted.
The Link you posted does not match the quotes you claimed have been said. And also you wrote Germany allowed the AFD to say those things, but it is not true.
For the other incidents, I'll leave you to check the post I initially replied to for names and accuracy checking.
For the Buchenwald quote, under heading list item 3: Mirko Welsch from the link I provided that you said proved false most of the claims despite it saying they were "mostly accurate":
auf einen Beitrag der Zeitung Neues Deutschland offenbar folgendermaßen antwortete: „Abschiebung der Antifa nach Buchenwald. Arbeit statt Linksterror.“ Das Zitat „Antifa? Ab ins KZ!“ entspricht also nicht dem Original, der Sinn ist jedoch nicht verändert worden.
Which directly contradicts what you said:
none of this has happened
What I also said:
What I am surprised by is that Germany is allowing politicians to advocate specific Nazi atrocities when there are purportedly laws against glorifying Nazis.
Were there legal consequences for Welsch saying this that I missed? Was there a trial and investigation?
Mirko Welsch is not in the AFD and of course there was a trial.
He is actually trialed regularly and he always changes his targets. Sometimes he insults groups on Facebook who are against (!) the right as antisemites. Then he insults the major of Hamburg as a “Fascist bitch”. And other cases like this.
In your original post you claimed these are all things the AFD does that are allowed in Germany, but it is not true (that’s why I said none of this has happened).
If the AFD would say this they could have easily be banned! That’s even on the website and the links you posted yourself.
Mirko Welsch left the AFD quite some time ago, ironically, claiming that Björn Höcke is a neo fascist. This is a quote from Mirko Welsch why he left:
“So sehr ich für einen konservativ-patriotischen Aufbruch in Deutschland stehe, so sehr lehne ich die Anbiederungen an rechtsextreme und nationalistische Milieus ab.”
(“As much as I stand for a conservative-patriotric awakening in Germany, just as much I oppose the ingradiation towards a right-wing extremist and nationalist milieu.”)
This was around 2017, a few years before the tweet. Which says pretty much everything about these clowns.
The publicity about unimportant people like Welsch, the trials and the way they are thrown out of or leave the AFD with a lot of media attention is a tool to them. This is used by people like Björn Höcke or Alice Weidel to pretend they are centrist. They thrive from the discord in the other parties.
For example they will put “gender” on the agenda on purpose, because they know it will get the others fighting and then they can later pretend in front of their voters that the other parties talk about “unimportant stuff like gender” all the time. They don’t advertise or use Nazi stuff openly, because that’s very complicated in Germany and will easily get you banned or prosecuted.
So they use sneaky tactics to bind actual neo Nazis but also the much bigger group of “centrist” conservatives and right wing people who do not want to associate with Nazis.
Link to trial information, please? I don't speak German well enough to know my way around your court document systems.
Also, as per the same factchecker article, a few sentences up:
Er war Sprecher der Homosexuellen in der AfD.
He was the spokesperson for homosexuals in the AfD. Which is just a wild concept in itself, but whatever, self-haters gonna self-hate.
In your original post you claimed these are all things the AFD does that are allowed in Germany, but it is not true (that’s why I said none of this has happened). If the AFD would say this they could easily be banned. That’s even on the website and the links you posted yourself.
I quoted exactly what I said. I'll do so again so nobody has to scroll:
What I am surprised by is that Germany is allowing politicians to advocate specific Nazi atrocities when there are purportedly laws against glorifying Nazis.
You said "none of this happened". In a language I don't even speak I found third party evidence of someone advocating for Buchenwald, one of the things in the 'never happened because ot is forbidden' list. You told me the factchecker link I posted said the opposite. Then when I showed you it didn't say the opposite, you said it didn't address the quote at all. Then when I showed you it did, you now say he isn't in the AfD. As though quitting cancels all your historical membership too.
All of this, after telling me that even though the AfD has Nazis in it, we shouldn't call them out as Nazis... because:
You give them an easy way out because they will start a discussion about the word or try to push the narrative that only “real Nazis” are the problem.
Much like you have started a discussion about whether Welsch really is AfD, or if Germany really "allowed" him to say it, or if he ever really said it at all, or if the factchecker really addresses it...
No. To your point about not calling people Nazis because they're assholes, I will continue to call assholes Nazis when they are Nazi assholes who explicitly call for repeating Nazi history, policy and/or beliefs. If they are assholes who do not call for Nazi repeat history, policy, and the same values, I will not call them a Nazi. Because they are just assholes, not Nazis.
If we stop calling Nazis out as Nazi, we choose to run the euphemism treadmill and give legitimacy to those who claim their grotesque conservative ethno-nationalist populism is somehow "different" from Nazis.
It's not different. I'm not going to wait until the gun is pointing at me and others before I call out the same dangers and patterns that led to the last time Nazis were allowed to enjoy mainstream popularity, and the last time people like me were tortured, raped, enslaved and ultimately killed.
Feel free to believe things aren't happening because there are rules against those things happening, I won't be joining you. I assume pre-WW2 had laws against murder too, which didn't seem to help much.
You are moving the goal post around because you got hung up on some stupid false information you don’t want to admit was wrong.
Sorry, I won’t request access to records at court for you, since you don’t want to believe or don’t understand the links I already posted. If you want to get access to the court documents about Mirko Welsch (lol) you can do so here, for example: www.saarland.de/lgsb/DE/home/home_node.html
I hate if people try to put things out as facts that simply are not facts. Because it will always bring more problems. I tried to explain why this will lead to problems, an explanation you ignored.
This is what you said:
But: AfD members have called for a second Holocaust … the execution of refugees … the imprisonment of homosexuals … the creation of a new SA … the imprisonment of left wingers in Buchenwald … and practicing apartheid.
What I am surprised by is that Germany is allowing politicians to advocate specific Nazi atrocities when there are purportedly laws against glorifying Nazis.
And that is not true. You saw yourself and I explained and showed to you that some of these were false and the others were trialed. But it’s like you really want it to be true.
Now you are trying to twist it around, it doesn’t matter that it’s not really AFD members. You aktschually didn’t really mean to say it’s the political party who said it, just in general.
And we’ll, yeah, perhaps there were trials against those people who said it, even though they weren’t politicians, but that also doesn’t count because you just don’t want to admit that your original post was false.
Instead you now switch on full virtue signaling mode and when I try to correct what you wrote you can go all “you are just trying to defend Nazis” on me. Sure. What a very constructive discussion.
This is what you said: (note: omitted for brevity)
That was something I quoted after you asked where I got my information. It's from the person I replied to. Which is why it is formatted as a quote in my post. I thought the connection that it was the same text might be obvious given it repeats the text I replied to, just without the names for brevity.
Then, I checked the Buchenwald quote and it was real, and then i provided you with that info. And then I noticed the factchecker had a bunch of other horrible quotes alongside it that were also awful and consistent with Nazis, which suggests AfD might not have a lone-nazi issue. But you told me they were all not valid for various reasons that were not in the factcheck or any other source.
Thanks to the link for a court homepage which didn't show anything. It's good to know that you have been able to post links to any independent information that would clarify any of the incidents the entire time, but for some unknown reason, you chose not to.
I'm still not certain which part of Welsch's tweet advocating for Buchenwald I misunderstood.I would have loved to have been wrong about that happening, but you never provided anything to suggest it didn't - beyond your own opinion.
full virtue signaling mode
Uh huh. "Virtue signalling" is one of those stale internet catchphrases popularised by the conservative media to trivialise real problems and deride empathy. And yet, I would still rather be accused of virtue signalling than look like I'm attempting appeasement of far right extremists by advocating for not using the accurate words which hurt their feelings.
If you think you can win over far right extremists by appealing to their sensibilities, fine, have at it. Many of us are not human enough in their eyes to be listened to in the first place, so I'm just going to keep calling ducks 'ducks'.
I have learnt a lot from all this, thankyou for the education.
I thought the same 20 years ago. The positive outlook was common sense at the time, not an exaggeration. The overall vibe was inclusive, we had open borders in Europe since the 90ies, and German public opinion pro-European and progressive-leaning.
Neonazis were a thing, but a niche phenomenon. Angry young man. Not a part of mainstream society and everyone from conservative teachers to rock bands were ‘against nazis’, whatever this means.
The situation has changed indeed and it is somewhat scary. Right-wing (including fascist) talking points get significant air-time in the media. Politicians use language that appeals to far-right voters much more openly, dog whistles maybe.
The society is more divided these days. Bavaria votes next weak and you will see a strong divide between urban and rural. Trivial things like how to address groups of people including all genders are heated debates. Rational policies towards solving the climate crisises are stalling because change is seen as an attack on a livestyle. Better: Propaganda frames everything as a cultural war. Your vegan sandwhich, that’s war against cattle farmers.
I think the only difference between Australia and Germany might be the vegan sandwich part of your post. Although, I probably wouldn't try to order the vegan option one in one of our cattle-farming towns... but they would just laugh and call me a city-person, which would be true.
This thread has made it very clear to me that yet again, despite languages and regions, we're experiencing the exact same issues and rhetoric. I suspect that's true globally.
I hope we can all find a way out of this mess soon.
Nazism is still a shunned no-go, and the AfD knows that (and regularly accuses others of being Nazis). The way I see it, its officials are still Nazis though, but they get around acknowledging that by just positioning themselves as counter-culture opposition to progressive movements, which is great at mobilizing a united front of anyone who feels attacked by any part of progressivism. Meanwhile, they also covertly appease other Nazis and the extreme right through dogwhistles and the like. The anti-progressive voters just ignore or tolerate this. This combination sadly proves successful. When they start building the camps, of course everyone should’ve known they’re Nazis, but no one thinks that far even though it’s their policies’ logical conclusion.
Yeah, exact same thing is happening in Australia. Even the camps, they're just not explicitly extermination camps as much as "destroy your soul with indefinite and lengthy confinement" camps. They prefer the name "detention centres" though. I hope refugees in Europe are treated better than that.
No, sadly refugees are already treated quite badly here. Germany took in a respectable amount but then left it to the EU border countries to either deal with them with little to no help or just shut themselves off completely. :( What would really be needed is a program to redistribute resources from the wealthy profiting from neocolonialism/climate change to those affected by it, but it’s generally framed as if the general population would need to pay for that which turns them against the refugees.
Agreed about active prevention, I think that's why I'm so surprised and saddened Germany hasn't done much better at it. There were active legal and education strategies put in place and I wanted to believe it could support sufficient systemic change.
At 12.6% of the vote for AfD from last election though, it seems to be nowhere near sufficient. And that terrifies me.
A lot of the education and events were about remembering the past, I think it should have been more about causes and prevention but that would have hurt more current political interests.
I mean we did do, and still do, better than many other states in europe. We have had (sometimes extremly) right wing governments in the eastern parts of europe for a long-ish time, see hungary, austria, poland, france struggling with keeping LePene’s party from power, italy having a premier that follows the teachings of the original fascist Mussolini. The AfD has been a bad sign but they were far from getting any real power besides making us look stupid for the last ten years. Now for the last year they are actually starting to take burocratic positions with political significance.
These next few months and years might be very influencial on how we develop as a country. We will have a few elections for the state governments and the federal government will be elected in two years.
Agreed about active prevention, I think that’s why I’m so surprised and saddened Germany hasn’t done much better at it. There were active legal and education strategies put in place and I wanted to believe it could support sufficient systemic change.
It pretty much looked like that systemic change had been made in west germany, then the reunification came and changed everything since it turned out that in the GDR, fascism had been very well preserved, especially in the “liberated” working class. Soon after the german reunification the first migrants asylum home for was burned by neonazis and since then there has been neonazi terror.
At 12.6% of the vote for AfD from last election though, it seems to be nowhere near sufficient. And that terrifies me.
If that scares you don´t check up on the newer polls T_T
Yeah… Reddit really made me feel like a sociopath about this. Why are we obsessed with the high road? Like… I’m teaching my son pacifism all day everyday. He’s the biggest kid, still, our checklist before hitting back has like 30 things you do first, and only to save your life. But… Nazis? Am I a fuckin dinosaur? I’ve even talked to a nazi for hours and told him I was an undermensch class in the middle of it, and seemed to get through to him with a really positive experience (per his own comments)… I’m not some murder porn violent weirdo looking for a reason… but srsly… They’re Nazis. Fuck around find out, no? Be a Nazi??? Yeah man… you’re gonna get knocked out if there’s justice and nobody is giving af about you. Aita?
“Getting hold of” can be interpreted broadly. While it’s not unrealistic that the next coalition might be conservative CxU + libertarian FDP + nazi AfD, it’s also very likely that the AfD gets banned until the next election, the responsible organization already has an eye on them. And a government with the AfD would be catastrophic (obviously), but it wouldn’t equal the creation the fourth reich. They would need a 2/3 majority to change/abolish constitutional laws and to change art. 1-20, which ensure human rights and such stuff, they would first need to change/abolish art. 79, which not even CxU and FDP would support. And here’s the fun part: if the AfD actually planned to do that, even without outright stating it, it would be enough to get them banned. The protecting mechanisms are there, the AfD can’t do anything about it and the other parties with coalition potential, even CxU and FDP, wouldn’t pave the way that far for another dictatorship.
So while it’s grim that a Nazi party is that popular, the damage they can possibly do is definitely below 1933.
On the other hand, should they gain 33% of seats, they can block all changes to the constitution. Should they occupy enough seats in the Bundesrat, they can block statewide policies. They do not need to be in power, to have a lasting impact on the German democracy. Given the current trend and that a not functional government leads to even more votes for the far right, it still looks bleak.
It's something, I'll take it. I suppose I shouldn't underestimate Germany's fondness for legal systems and bureaucracy, even if I'm sad cultural change efforts haven't been as successful as I had hoped.
There always has been a solid 15% of the German population that is lost to democracy and favours fascist and extremely right-wing politics. This “nazi” foundation has always been well established in many governmental bodies and economic branches as they were necessary to keep the country running after the end of WW2.
Now they are employing the same tactics as before 1945: stimulating fear among disadvantaged population groups (if factual or imaginative) and scapegoating minorities (migrants) for everything bad.
The perceived hesitation and disagreement of the current government doing their part, many of the „Bio-Germans“ who feel disadvantaged turn to the idea of „the new strong man“ that finally „cleans up the cesspool“ they imagine the current political system to be.
If nothing drastically changes, I see whole federal states go lost to the AfD that especially in eastern states are nothing more than a thinly veiled new NSDAP.
15% seems higher than I had assumed. Not hugely higher, admittedly.
That number is short of constant across a number of societies I know well, but, and here’s the trick, it’s elastic.
If you really push back on it as a society, you can shame most of them into pretending they are just conservatives and the support for your local flavor of authoritarian extreme right wing parties dwindles to 5-ish percent.
However, if you let up, they are free to influence and recruit and their support can easily swell to 20-25%, which is a level where in proportional systems you can start winning elections and leading coalition governments.
So, keep pushing the fuckers back into the sewers.
This is unfortunately the reality, as especially the majority of the German media outlets still seem to try to rationalise and understand those “prodigial sons” (as they seem to perceive them).
However, exactly the opposite to winning them back to democracy is happening: Feeling their voice being heard and valued, they catch emotional tailwinds and become even more radical.
I completely agree, and I thought the push back was more effective than it seems it has been. If a country with some of the most strict anti-Nazi measures in place is still netting 12.6% to its extreme-right political party though, I am horrified to think how large that number can stretch - now that we have nearly lost all the generation who saw it first-hand.
Admittedly the situation in Australia is very different and votes are counted differently, but our furthest right-wing parties seem to only take maximum 10%. And that's already high enough for me to be nervous about the consequences.
Wait, Bernd is a real name‽‽ I thought it was just a joke. “Bernd das brot” und das Kika Lounge, was the first time I ran into the name, and it sounds to an English speaker, like myself, like “Burned the Bread”
As if they’d need to fake fascist accounts. There’s plenty of people to go around for posting that, just look at he numbers fascist parties poll in most countries.
The platform will likely get blocked within the EU quite soon if it stays this way. After a devastating report about misinformation, they loosened oversight even more, meaning it actively does not conform to EU regulations (regarding hate speech for example) anymore. Facebook has already received hefty fines for less so I honestly don’t expect Xitter to be around much longer.
Shame the people the reply is aimed at don't see refugees as humans worth saving, instead they probably claim it is the German lives that the refugees "threaten" that need to be "saved".
There is no logic-ing someone out of a position they didn't logic themsleves in to..
Gee I wonder where they all got these brain worms that their comfort is so fragile and that everyone else envies their comfort and wants their treats and is only on a mission to steal their precious from them
I’m sure the capital owners don’t want to keep these refugees “illegal” and looked down upon so they can be exploited for cheap labor and no one will care
“Oh you had to escape the terrible material conditions created when the west either directly or indirectly installed a horrible dictator in charge of your country and people started starving/dying? Pathetic!”
And that, for one, makes a section of my moral mind and heart go "And now this again? How have people have largely forgotten our ancestor's egregious transgressions just to go root for those people who vow to pleasurely subjugate their fellows according to their flawed, sadist worldview, be it overt or covert?"
And looking at our planet as it stands right now, culturally, politically, and morally, it seems that we are bound to repeat this vicious cycle of homicide, destruction, tyranny, cultural heritages being lost and razed out of existence, as per Derivakat & Netrum's recent collab tune, unless we band together, whatever the cost, and at the slimmest least, uphold the positive ideals of humanity we so seek, regardless of nationality, gender, economic standing, and so on.
His grandfather J. N. Haldeman was a staunch anti-Communist from Canada who in the nineteen-thirties and forties had been a leader of the anti-democratic and quasi-fascist Technocracy movement. (Technocrats believed that scientists and engineers should rule.) “In 1950, he decided to move to South Africa,” Isaacson writes, “which was still ruled by a white apartheid regime.” In fact, apartheid had been declared only in 1948, and the regime was soon recruiting white settlers from North America, promising restless men such as Haldeman that they could live like princes. Isaacson calls Haldeman’s politics “quirky.” In 1960, Haldeman self-published a tract, “The International Conspiracy to Establish a World Dictatorship & the Menace to South Africa,” that blamed the two World Wars on the machinations of Jewish financiers.
simple thing to keep in mind: money is a tool that can, among other things, allow to anonymously exploit socially weaker groups of people. for example to build cheap phones or clothes. keep this in mind when an extremely rich person says anything. they’re winners at a rotten game
Just a quick thought, a well know science man (Harald Lesch) recently said, that, if you want to have a artifical environment for humans in the Mars, this would cause the Mars’ moons to smash in the Mars itself. So, there’s that and Peter Fox (nice musician guy) said in a song fuck Elon Musk and his mars project, cause it’s to cold there and arschweit weg. 👍
Likely always has been. It’s just that he seemed like a cool, progressive, science-loving entrepreneur before he showed the world what a total piece of shit he really is.
I for one like that he’s being this blunt rather than conveying what’s on his mind in a tip-toey way. It’s easier to identify the cunt’s true colours and disillusion-ise poor souls who still believe in him.
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