I know this is just a meme, but mini rant time here.
“Free speech” literally just means the government can’t arrest, censor, or penalize you for just for the things you express. Of course, there are exceptions for public safety, fraud, etc…
If Musk loses advertising revenue, that is the advertisers exercising their free speech in a free market, and deciding who they associate with.
These crybabies like Musk are upset at having consequences, and throwing a tantrum about their freedom of speech is an intentional red herring and attempt to recontextualize reality so they end up being the victim of some ephemeral bully.
The richest and most powerful people on the planet are not being persecuted.
They are just not used to being called out on their bullshit and are too weak and immature to accept being told they are wrong sometimes.
They don’t want free speech they want to force your eyes and ears open, strap you to the chair and shout all the things they wanna say to you 24/7 also you’re not allowed to do anything but agree.
Do you have a screenshot of the tweet he agreed with? People keep talking about it and saying that it was bigoted against jewish folks, but no one has actually said what was said or shown it.
I just follow cat and dog accounts on twitter and almost never post anything.
«Me plugging my ears as I walk by crazy right wing protestors»
“Ahhh! You’re not listening to me! You’re not respecting my freedom of speech! And if you tell your friends that I’m an asshole and to avoid my ramblings, then you hate free speech!”
Allowing someone to post mean tweets isn’t like that.
You don’t have to click on their profile. So the metaphor of you having to physically walk past them doesn’t apply. You can choose to not see them if they have a platform online.
What every social media platform is doing is censorship. Anything they don’t agree with, even if it turns out to be right a few years down the line gets removed with no due-process and no oversight, by people that are accountable to no one, that no one knows the names of.
This isn’t about that though. This is advertiser’s going “we don’t want to advertise on X because Elon promotes content we don’t agree with” and then Elon freaking out because much free speech. Even though no one is blocking or removing what he says, they just no longer want to be associated with it.
What’s currently happening is that advertisers are pulling their ads from X/Twitter because Elon replied “This is the full truth” to a neonazi posting the Jewish question. I think if this is censorship, it’s a form I agree with. What advertiser wants to be associated with nazis?
That’s not censorship. That is literally just capitalism. You usually don’t want your brand associated with Nazis, as that can be bad for business. Companies don’t have morals, but they care about money.
I honestly dont understand why anyone cares about or how twitter would lose funding. It feels so masturbatory to say you just want elons stuff to fail just because dont like him as a person which is also weird to me 🤷
On one hand I agree schadenfreude is a dangerous thing that one should be careful about how they engage in
On the other hand he wields a LOT of power over our discussions as a society because he owns a successful platform. If twitter fails it takes away some of his power to be a shithead and to shape our discussions in a way that sucks (ie, inviting everyone to be bigots and to be cruel to their fellow humans on a scale that’s frankly kinda horrifying)
This is a really lame perspective you have. If Musk was a country he’d be the 50th wealthiest country in the world.
Wanting to see someone with that much power lose as much as of that power as possible is socially responsible imo. Trying to minimize the opinion of people who are pissed at him using his power to signal boost hate speech as “just because they don’t like him” is a really fucking empty headed dumb fuck analysis.
My point is about the consolidation of wealth and the ultra rich hoarding that much wealth/power is bad for society.
I think Musk should have to had to pay so much in taxes he should worth, only, 50 billion dollars. If you call that “hate” you should learn about what hate actually is. Clown.
I have a feeling you dont know how musk or most of these billionaires have so much money. When he purchased twitter, he sold Tesla stock to get the required funds. He paid $11 billion in taxes on the sold shares. He is just playing the game with the rules he is given. But yeah, you are coming off as a hater.
Oh my fucking god, I cannot stand it anymore… I think I must’ve become a simp at some point recently because every time I look at elon I just get a massive fucking erection. His face looks like it was hand designed by a thousand angels… And he has an uttermost beautiful style of clothing as well, if he happens to have a twitch account, I hope he would add me at xXPussy_Destroyrr69420wholesomekeanuchungussub2pewdiepieXx. I promise I’ll donate every cent that I make every month, I usually just mow lawns for my elderly neighbor, Mrs. Anderson, but I swear I can do so much more! I’ll probably get a job at Burger King since you get very delicious lunch breaks there!! And I’ll make he is the happiest girl in this green earth, you are so extremely beautiful it pains me to know I can’t be on that bed with you… And people say you can’t be a respectful man these days, well, as a brony, anime lover and gamer 4 life who definitely enjoys his time, I can assure you I’ll be able to show Elon what a REAL man can do. Please baby I love u Elon. I also do Fedora tricks.
“I have a feeling you dont know how musk or most of these billionaires have so much money. When he purchased twitter, he sold Tesla stock to get the required funds.”
Musk used money his father made from apartheid era south Africa to go to Canada so he can dodge mandatory military service. Then he started a company that was half of a good idea. He merged companies with another conservative ghoul named Peter Theil to form paypal and sold it. Then he invested in a bunch of green energy start ups to take advantage of Obama era policies to jump start the industry AKA welfare for the rich.
“He paid $11 billion in taxes on the sold shares. He is just playing the game with the rules he is given. But yeah, you are coming off as a hater.”
Musk paid a 25% tax rate on on 44 billion dollars… boo fucking hoo. You billionaire apologist dipshits are the most pathetic fucking dumb fucks I can imagine. Wipe Elons cum off your fucking chin and think of something more substantive than “people being haters” goofy bitch ass mother fucker.
If I remember correctly, the Gizmodo story on this thing had a link directly to Musk’s tweet, and from there you can see the conversation he was responding to.
You’re right; he didn’t specifically say that. He called a Twitter post that said Jewish people hate white people was “so right.” And that’s a big Neonazi thing.
So… he didn’t say Hitler was right, just that a major Nazi tenet is.
Nah free speech means the government won’t stop you. It doesn’t mean we gotta listen to you or give you a platform for the hate whether it’s irl or online. Gotta read that first ammendment a bit more throughly my dude
Haha I’m guessing he was just in an argumentative mood and assumed all replies would be fighting with him. Sometimes that adrenaline kicks in when you see an Inbox notification.
I mean let’s be real, to 90% of these right wing nuts “freedom of speech” really just means “freedom to force other private parties to support, amplify, and endorse MY speech as I stifle the speech of those who disagree.”
Why does a foreign country have the absolute say on a principle/ ideology/ human right whatever you want to call it?
It doesn’t make sense. Are you telling me the ideology of freedom of speech only existed and only continues to exist because it is on a bit of paper written in a far away land?
In that “far away land”, yes, because the meaning of freedom of speech (as people, with great fatigue, have tried to tell you) is about consequences related to the government of that “far away land”
If we want to get to the heart of the matter, that people aren’t fond of your Musk fellating, inceldom riddled comment history that you possibly, unfortunately, decided to export from some sewer on Reddit, that’s not them hating free speech.
The meaning of those words is absolutely some law, whether natural or governmental, and depends entirely upon the context of the power structure involved.
If you got slapped in your goofy ass face every time you said, well let me just pull up a real, actual quote from you:
“Women do not want to help men but they expect help from them.
That doesn’t make me miserable that’s just accepting the world the way it is and it’s a life lesson men tend to learn the hard way.”
If they slapped your extremely goofy, unserious face and called you a generalizing, pathetic, and small person, that wouldn’t be them hating free speech.
Hell, they’d be exercising it! How wonderful!
Now, if the government came to your door and impounded your 4 wheel drive incompetence with relationships, then you might have a victorious day in court.
Uh yes actually if you physically strike a person when they say something you find “pathetic”, or any other adjective, you are in fact against free speech.
No that’s excercising freedom expression. You are free from persecution from the government, not ostracization socially. Nazis should be punched, not protected. There’s no such thing as free speech for Nazis. Same thing in this case, you say bullshit, people are “free” to react how they will to it.
Freedom to assault and freedom of speech are two different things.
I respect your right to say I got a goofy ass face and generalizing, pathetic, and small person. I’m truly happy you are able to do that. I just don’t think you disagreeing with me gives you the right to assault me.
Obviously that thread was full of generalisations and that wasn’t a all women situation it was more about the everyday occurances of everday men. It was written like that for simplicity rather than needed to and “not all but a lot of” every 5 seconds. Still stand by the spirit if that point, which was the important thing.
Replace fellating with whatever synonym floats your puritanical boat brother. Nothing wrong with fellating dong but I don’t see the win in pleasuring fascists or otherwise awful people be it literally or figuratively
See? You just totally abdicated any responsibility to allow others to speak. Why would you be so concerned with making sure it’s only government which has that responsibility, if you didn’t hate free speech?
I don’t hate free speech. There’s just nothing saying I HAVE to listen to someone spewing hate and misinformation. Especially all the hate and misinformation that’s put me in danger for years because of me being queer or neurodivergent.
There’s nothing saying I HAVE to listen to someone spewing hate and misinformation
Except for the concept of being open minded. The ethical imperative to face new information that’s not easy to process, so that you can respond to it instead of being blindsided by it.
Free speech is a responsibility held by all members of society, to maintain those channels of communication.
Just like a good general has a responsibility to hear emissaries of his enemy, no matter how bitterly hated that enemy is. There’s nothing that says he HAS to listen to that emissary … other than his responsibility to his troops.
Except when that is hate towards me for being queer or neurodivergent. I can and will block out hate speech towards me or other minorities that’s not based in reality. There’s a point where I will listen except when vitriol is spewed towards me for no reason. You’re attaching a tolerance to intolerance as if we have to listen to n@!is, racists or bigots just attacking everyone else for no good reason other than fox or Trump telling them so that these minorities are some threat that they’re not.
Responsibility can only be taken, not given. So yeah, if you say that’s not your responsibility, then it’s not your responsibility. But choosing not to adopt that responsibility does indeed make you a hater of free speech.
Take a step back and consider how stupid that sounds. The onus isn’t on others while you say stupid shit.
I mean consider even now… I’m not infringing on your free speech by telling you what you just said was misguided at best and as stupid as it sounds at worst.
You still got to say what you want. You can say it again too. Still sounds stupid the second time.
The reality is this isn’t about a person’s ability to say something so much as their bullshit argument.
When someone says “but I have the right!” what they’re really saying is they aren’t intelligent enough to have a good reason or justification. They’re instead screaming “well just cause I can!” It’s a privileged, ill reasoned, temper tantrum of an argument that amounts to “just cause I can.”
Yes, it is. It is natural to want to try and shut people up. Resisting the urge to manipulate and control others is work. We all have a responsibility toward a healthy society.
That’s why it’s prosocial when someone steps in for a person who’s being shouted down and puts his own skin on the line to say “let him talk”.
The fact you choose not to carry that burden doesn’t mean that it doesn’t exist.
It’s weird to have someone argue that when the context of all this is support of antisemitism.
Of course it’s a positive to help support the voice of someone who might have theirs oppressed. But why go to such extremes to support the oppressor?
Why do you argue that we must advocate for the oppressor? Are we not allowed the freedom to speak up against those that oppress others? Is that speech not allowed?
You see how it’s a stupid circle of inductive reasoning that does nothing to help anyone? Bottom line is a rigid absolute, a utopia is a more destructive and stupid approach than the free speech for which you claim to advocate. Freedom isn’t possible is you tolerate intolerance.
A lot of people are very much against humans being free to speak their mind. They would like People to be incapable of that or they would like to be protected from it.
Dude… They’re not disliking freedom of speech, they’re disliking the contents of your speech. You’re free to say whatever the hell you want. We’re also free to call you an idiot if we’re so inclined.
Freedom of speech isn’t freedom from consequences. If you say awful things people will use their free speech to tell you you’re an awful person. That isn’t hating free speech. It’s hating you. Hating you isn’t illegal.
You’ve conflated punishment and consequences. You have the freedom to hold some morally repugnant view like white nationalism, and your freedom of speech protects your right to express those views. But your family can hear those expressions, and cut you out of their lives, publicly condemn those views, or you for holding them, without affecting your freedom of speech. A company can refuse to allow you to use their platform to spread those views without affecting your freedom of speech.
What can’t happen is a politician or government official use their powers to suppress your speech, arrest you, unless your speech act harms people, like shouting fire in a crowded theater. People disagree about exactly what those exceptions should be, but except for a few small but loud conservative groups trying to censor things like LGBTQ content, this basic premise is pretty uncontroversial, at least in the US.
Only if you definite it to be limited to there. Free speech or the lack thereof is a condition of existence for a group of people.
Free speech is just that the government shouldn’t be able to punish you for what you say. Nothing else.
What you describe is governed by the social contract. Noone should be forced to listen to what other people say, and people can freely decide to distance themselves if someone says something they don’t agree with.
Also there can be social consequences from what you say, free speech does not protect you from that, despite some people thinking that it does or that it should.
Homie, I’m Canadian, it’s beyond the constitution of the US. We don’t have unlimited free speech because it fucking leads to genocide and violence. I will fight to the grave to ensure that tolerance only extends to the tolerant. This is what generations fought a nearly world ending world war over. It’s worth fighting over, you don’t have to agree with me.
The government punishing people. I am not the government. I can point out that you are a fool to think you are otherwise immune from the consequences of what you say.
What in the world ever made you think that was a reasonable thing to say? Do you really believe that its your right to not only say what you want, but also never have anyone have a negative opinion of it? That is completely insane. Like actually I’m worried about your mental health. Seek help.
Do you believe that Ben Shapiro is merely speaking his mind when tries to argue that allowing children to transition will increase the suicide rate when literally all available data about trans children shows the exact opposite? Do you believe that Steven Crowder is merely speaking his mind when he “proves” global warming is fake by showing that Antarctic ice levels are higher in October than they were the preceding August while ignoring the steady downward year-over-year trend modulated by the seasons? Do you believe that Donald Trump was merely speaking his mind when he called for his followers to march on the white house, or, more recently, called immigrants vermin?
But speaking your mind isn’t proof of anything. The ability to speak freely is freedom of speech. I’ll support anyone that is for freedom of speech and i think everyone should have the right of freedom of speech as long as it doesnt impact someone elses freedoms.
Trump. I’m not even sure what point you are making about freedom of speech, you seem to be talking about intent not about freedom of speech. I’m not actually familiar with the point you mean.
i think everyone should have the right of freedom of speech as long as it doesnt impact someone elses freedoms.
If you are against people using their freedom of speech in an attempt to take away the rights and freedoms of other people, then I’d think you’d find that most people do support freedom of speech the way that you do.
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