The State Department said that Israel's military campaign in Gaza may have violated international law.

The Biden administration has concluded it is “reasonable to assess” that Israel’s military campaign in Gaza has violated international law, but has not found specific instances that would justify the withholding of military aid, the State Department told Congress on Friday.

In the administration’s most detailed assessment of Israel’s conduct in Gaza, the State Department said in a written report to Congress that Israel “has the knowledge, experience and tools to implement best practices for mitigating civilian harm in its military operations.”

But it added that “the results on the ground, including high levels of civilian casualties, raise substantial questions” as to whether the Israel Defense Forces are using them sufficiently.

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Fedizen,

M A Y ???

SpaceCowboy,
@SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca avatar

State Department. So diplomatic signals.

Foreign affairs is a constant negotiation. So there’s signals. and more negotiations. Tomorrow there will be more signals and negotiations.

Because that’s how the whole thing works. As much as the TikTok crowd might want Israel to not exist (which is a little disturbing) the reality is that Israel is going to continue to exist and the negotiations will continue to happen in perpetuity. Screaming “YOU ARE TEH GENOCIDaL MONstARRRR” is not a good play when negotiating, and a failure at negotiating costs lives. And that’s Palestinian lives it anyone cares about them beyond making a performance about it.

So the State Department (the diplomats) will make these signals to effect actual change as opposed to the juvenile outbursts we see at college campuses… which accomplishes nothing.

Speak softly while carrying a big stick versus speak loudly with your dick in your hand.

suchwin,

I agree that the diplomats have a lot of things to consider and need to make careful nuanced discussions that lead to effective decisions. However, I think student protests help sway the public opinion and give more backing to such diplomatic decisions.

And US students obviously can’t make foreign policy decisions with Isreal, so what else are they supposed to do? Clearly, months of smaller actions haven’t seemed to change the situation.

SpaceCowboy,
@SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca avatar

Student protests accomplish nothing other than promote antisemitism. Sorry.

You aren’t going to convince Netanyahu to halt the assault on Rafah but looking the other way on antisemitic speech by your peers because you’re afraid of being ostracized from the fun get-together you call a protest. If anything it’s making things worse because Israel isn’t going to backing down if you make them feel like the whole world hates them after what happened on October 7.

Sure emotions are running high, but people need to think about the consequences of their actions. Making excuses about hate speech being acceptable because TikTok is telling you that what Israel is doing justifies hate speech isn’t going to bring the conflict to an end. If anything, it will prolong it.

I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, Joe Biden cares more about the Palestinian people than anyone protesting on college campuses. I get people are lonely and are looking for any reason to go out and hang out with other people, but demanding the faculty of a university to do something about foreign policy is just a cover for getting together to hate a group of people. As exhilarating as that might feel in the moment, it’s not actually a positive action. This kind of fervor centered around hate has happened many times before.

How many Palestinians will these protests save compared to Joe Biden negotiating a ceasefire? Do you think the things you hear at these protests work at a negotiation table? If Joe Biden screams “GENOCIDE!” at Netanyahu does that result in a ceasefire? Do you think backing Israel into a corner saves Palestinian lives? They can get munitions from other countries… do you think forcing Israel to use less accurate munitions saves Palestinian lives?

Joe Biden has to consider all of these things, while someone screaming “GENOCIDE” at protest doesn’t. There’s a reason why Joe Biden says that the college protests don’t influence him. Because lonely and emotional children aren’t all that good at foreign policy.

suchwin,

Disagree. I won’t say it’s impossible it encourages some antisemitism, but it feels like you’re lumping all these students into that camp. I think the protests provide awareness of where much of the public stands on the issue.

It feels disingenuous to say these protests are a fun party. I can think of plenty of activities I partook in college that were more fun and with less risk. I think these students (a fairly small percentage of all students, realistically), feel an alturistic need to do something. And there’s not a lot of domestic options available to them, especially ones where their voice is actually heard.

These protests must be effective if they’re turning the whole world on Israel. But I think that’s much more of Israel’s doing. Surely killing medical staff, journalists, aid workers, and children may factor in? Of course I’m against antisemitism, but I won’t say the same about antizionism.

There’s also the part where these protests aren’t directly about ending the conflict (of course that’s the ultimate overarching goal). These students are protesting their schools’ investments in Israel. And I think they have every right to have that discussion with the schools they’re attending. This is the impact they’re trying to make, one that /is/ related to them, and one that /is/ possible.

Like it or not, Joe is the best shot at ending the conflict right now, I agree. But it’s been many months of him appearing to do close to nothing. Is Israel backed into a corner? Looks more like Palestinian civilians are in a corner. A corner that keeps getting moved and then bombed.

The US has a lot of sway in the world. There’s a lot of options our government could take. Continued financial, military, and political support doesn’t feel like the best option. I’m not saying we should wipe Israel off the map, but surely there’s some sort of middle ground where civilians of the region aren’t just endless collateral damage?

lurch,

yes, 11th of May. y u ask?

ShittyBeatlesFCPres,

I know some specific instances if they need appendices. There’s a bunch of mass graves with bullet holes in people’s heads where the dead were wearing hospital clothes and had a different injury. They bombed basically all the civilian infrastructure. We all watched starvation as a tactic happen. They killed more journalists and aid workers than any war I can recall.

livus,
livus avatar

They're also allowing mask-off genocidal statements in their public sphere. It doesn't sound like much but it's a pretty damning one and well documented.

TropicalDingdong,

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/c6aaf95f-053d-463c-9b42-8c9b8b9f2553.png

GlassHalfHopeful,
@GlassHalfHopeful@lemmy.ca avatar

I don’t understand how they think citizens can be so stupid as to take these statements at face value.

The government gets away with things because it simply can.

🤬

gregorum,

It’s not the statement itself. It’s the fact that the US State department has made its first change and its policy with Israel in ever.

That’s a big deal

Melkath,

I read that in the clownish tone of Biden's infamous "big fucking deal".

It's not a big deal. It's not even a baby step. If anything, it's a double down to say "we found crimes, but we don't care".

GlassHalfHopeful,
@GlassHalfHopeful@lemmy.ca avatar

I didn’t pick up what you’re saying in this particular article.

If so, it seems painfully too little and far too late. More needs to be done and it needs to be done now.

I understand why the relationship between Israel and the US is important. What I don’t understand is why the US can’t hold them to account at the same time.

It boggles my mind how the government of the United States so easily facilitates atrocities. They can do better. They can be better.

When I hear “Make America Great Again”, it seems everyone has lost their minds in terms of what “greatness” truly is.

gregorum, (edited )

I get where you’re coming from and your sense of urgency— obviously. I want Biden to tell Bibi to fuck off with the Palestinian civilian genocide bullshit and to cut off all offensive weapons deliveries 20 years ago.

My point is that US policy on Israel has, really, never changed-- until just now. And that’s a really big deal. I get that it’s not as much or as fast as everyone wanted, but that it happened at all it a tremendous victory. Changing state dept. policy isn’t just some party trick, and changing state dept. policy on Israel is a goddamned miracle. So enough with the “not enough”. Celebrate this victory, pat some backs, and then keep protesting!

Now that policy can be changed, keep fighting for bigger change!

Edit: fixating on that you didn’t get a big enough victory in round 1 (even though it’s the biggest victory by anyone, ever wrt US-Israel policy shift) comes off as ignorant and ungrateful. Take the win and move on to round 2.

juicy,

What policy change?

gregorum, (edited )

Troll food

https://lemm.ee/pictrs/image/ff9eed51-7f3c-4e46-a4b5-9e7dba41c9a1.webp

goferking0,

There hasn’t been one so they don’t know how to respond

Linkerbaan,
@Linkerbaan@lemmy.world avatar

but has not found specific instances that would justify the withholding of military aid

So after 6 months of “wait for the report” they have come to the conclusion that all the bombs that were used to commit war crimes with exploded so they can’t be investigated or something.

Genocide Joe still on that Ethnic Cleansing Grind.

slurpyslop,

Pop it on the list

Veraxus,

May have?

Our State Dept seems to be a few months behind.

Gormadt,
@Gormadt@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

I feel the same way

But in terms of international politics such accusations must be made carefully and with substantial evidence

I feel they could have had that evidence awhile ago but I’m hoping they took this long to make sure to get as many as possible correctly in the net of “Violating International Law”. For example substantial evidence that goes very high up the chain of command of the Israeli military.

jonne,

If they didn’t find any evidence it means they weren’t looking for it. Or even were actively avoiding widely reported incidents.

tiefling,

Any Steven Universe fans?

goferking0,

Or we’re going to find out this was dated in October and buried until now

CTDummy,

You know, I had this really odd thought a couple months ago. That Israel kept fucking up in continuation with how they have been. To the point that US had to play world police again and invade Israel to enforce a dmz around Palestine. Much to the “excuse me, fucking what?” of the entire Arabic world. This headline is in no way aligning with said odd thought but here we are.

Thrashy,
@Thrashy@lemmy.world avatar

I mean, at this point an “ideal” solution (such as it is) would be for the US to stop stonewalling UN Security Council resolutions so that the other members can greenlight a peacekeeping operation a la Kosovo, that would stop the fighting, open up aid flows, and create an avenue for effective enforcement of the 1948 treaty boundaries on the way towards implementing a functional two-state solution. But that seems pretty unlikely right now.

twistypencil,

This is big

juicy,

No it’s not.

Nevertheless, the report, mandated by President Biden, deems that assurances Israel provided in March that it would use U.S. arms consistent with international law are “credible and reliable” and thus allow the continued flow of U.S. military aid.

What a joke.

rockSlayer,

Yes, it is. Because if our weapons continue to be shipped to Israel and used Gaza, then it would be a violation of federal law to continue those weapons shipments. And yes, any senior government officials still trying to give arms to Israel after that point should be brought to trial.

juicy,

Nowhere does it say that. This changes nothing.

rockSlayer,

That’s because the State department typically doesn’t refer to specific statutes when signalling policy changes. To read the laws that I’m referring to, look for the International Traffic in Arms Regulations and the Arms Export Control Act.

gregorum, (edited )

For the US state department to say this publicly? Oh yeah, it’s a big deal.

US’s Israel policy doesn’t shift adroitly— considering it has never shifted, not ever.

So, yeah, this means things have changed. That was the point of all those protests, right?

Edit: think it hasn’t shifted enough? Keep protesting!!! it works!

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