GOP Governors Invoke the Confederate Theory of Secession to Justify Border Violations

This week, Republican governors across the country escalated their conflict with the Biden administration over the southern border by invoking the same legal theory that slave states wielded to justify secession before the Civil War.

Texas Gov. Greg Abbott, joined by 25 other GOP governors, now argues that the Biden administration has violated the federal government’s “compact” with the states—an abdication that justifies state usurpation of federal authority at the border.

This language embraces the Confederacy’s conception of the Constitution as a mere compact that states may exit when they feel it has been broken. It’s dangerous rhetoric that transcends partisan grandstanding. And as before, it’s being used to legitimize both nullification and dehumanization.

Ghostalmedia,
@Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world avatar

If these GOP governors actually gave a shit about fixing the border, they would be pushing the GOP congress to unblock the border bill. But they want the crisis to fester so they can campaign on it.

Opportunist scum.

GroundedGator,

At this point Biden should stretch executive privilege and figure out how to check off as many boxes on the bill that he can. He’s already subverted Congress getting aid to Israel.

What’s the worst that can happen? They impeach him? They already are determined to at least give that show. I would love to see ComerPyle try to explain how they are impeaching him over increased border security.

Maybe Texas sues him. Okay Abbot, let’s see how you justify suing the administration for providing more border agents, more tech, more personnel and resources.

One could argue that the MAGAts in Congress have breached the covenant of 3 coequal branches of government. I would never say that any one branch should act unilaterally, or do so without potential consequence, but this is mad. They are not doing their job, they aren’t debating, and are actively throwing a tantrum like a child.

njm1314,

If President Biden doesn’t come down hard on this he’s going to be remembered as a second Buchanan.

NoIWontPickaName,

Why not? He is already the second jackson

Ghostalmedia,
@Ghostalmedia@lemmy.world avatar

The GOP wants him to take the bait. Their goal is to block humane border legislation, implement inhumane alternative solutions, and taunt Biden into removing the inhumane shit. That way they can campaign on “Biden wants to aggressively keep the status quo at the border.”

If Biden is going to crack down on Texas, he also needs to have some sort of big bold alternative thing in place.

AutistoMephisto,
@AutistoMephisto@lemmy.world avatar

I say to fucking take the bait. Come down hard, be a “tyrant” for once. Do what Lincoln did, suspend habeas corpus, declare martial law, slap every GOP Governor siding with this shit in handcuffs. They want to act like criminals, treat them as criminals.

KevonLooney,

The funny thing is, Republicans would probably respect that. They value hierarchy and don’t have many actual policies. Biden acting like a king might actually pull voters from Trump, at the expense of actual Democrats (who probably wouldn’t vote).

Machinist3359,

I don't know, it's really a lose lose either way. Biden is either too soft and the GOP calls it a win and does something worse, or he is too tough and he's called a dictator. I'd rather he take decisive action and put the fear of God in them than let it escalate and get even more immigrants killed. Honestly after the shipping migrants to liberal states stunt he should have thrown the book and/or CIA at 'em.

EtherWhack,
@EtherWhack@lemmy.world avatar

I wouldn’t throw out that it also may be an attempt to sway the swing states off the teeter and vote in their favor by giving him that no-win. May also be a way to distract the left side while trying to radicalize the right into another insurrection.

Maggoty,

Just one thing. They’re going to claim he’s lawless no matter what. He could give them everything they want and they will still claim it. He’s already the most conservative Democrat president on the border in modern times.

Rivalarrival,

He could ask Congress whether we should send troops and aid to El Salvador, Guatamala, Honduras, to address the humanitarian crisis that is driving refugees to US borders.

Badeendje,
@Badeendje@lemmy.world avatar

Legal eagle just did a piece on this: youtu.be/1dhvry6E0jA?si=K9C7aTtOsaY1uPK_

IHeartBadCode,
IHeartBadCode avatar

Remember kids.

EchoCT,

Say they’re in rebellion, pull funding, personnel, and representation, watch them collapse.

CharlesDarwin,
@CharlesDarwin@lemmy.world avatar

Weird, the right wing keeps trying to lie and imply that KKK/Confederates somehow have something to do with today’s Democratic Party and not the conservative movement…

Huh.

phoneymouse, (edited )

When I hear shit like this, it makes me think Sherman didn’t go far enough. He should’ve eradicated the South and given the land to the union. Slaveowners should’ve been arrested and stripped of their property rights. Southern states should’ve been dissolved and their governments reconstituted by the union.

The union should’ve crushed the south and occupied it like the US occupied Nazi Germany post-WWII.

LocoOhNo,

I live in Tennessee and I’ve had 2 coworkers tell me, independently of one another, that Nazis got a “raw deal” and that, and I quote, “their opinions are just as relevant” as Democrat opinions.

These are guys who go to church and like to brag about how über Christian they are while simultaneously saying that Texans should be allowed to legally open fire on immigrants. Lincoln was too light on the South and Andrew Johnson was so shitty that he openly tried to benefit the postbellum Southerners.

The South continues to prove that it didn’t deserve the reconstruction. Imagine if Germans allowed pieces of shit to openly fly swastika flags and proclaim that “The Reich will rise again.”

That’s what we’re up against here. Every single day I see the “rebel” flag being flown and celebrated and about once a month I hear someone in public talking about how there should be a rebellion. They legitimately believe that they can fight off the United States military and their rationale is that “The government won’t open fire on its own citizens” so they can just attack unabated.

It’s fucking banana sandwiches in this shit hole.

AngryCommieKender,

“Each Dixie boy must understand that he must mind his Uncle Sam!”

OldWoodFrame,

Imagine Abraham Lincoln hearing this about his own Republican party.

Wolf_359,

He would just call them Democrats.

The parties did a flip flop. Democrats used to be the conservative party.

Seasoned_Greetings,

Lincoln would not recognize the current republican party as his own. He’d call them pretenders and go back to chopping trees in the woods.

doubletwist,

At this point I think Biden needs to just call their bluff. He should come back with, “Okay, here’s all the plans we’ve drawn up to go into effect as soon as you ratify your secession.”

Then present the plans that include cessation of all federal subsidies to all public and private Texas entities, removal of all US military personnel and equipment, removal of all other federal agencies and personal (eg. Federal Border Patrol, Park rangers, IRS), removal of the Federal reserve in Dallas, the construction of border walls around the state in NM, OK, AR, and LA asking with placement of the removed border patrol there, and so on.

Let them stew for a bit and chew on just how utterly fucked this state (yeah I live in TX, and early awaiting the day we can leave) would be if they really did successfully secede.

postmateDumbass,

Oklahoma should start building the wall for fun.

mrcleanup,

If they really did secede, I think it’s a bit presumptuous to assume you would still have travel rights in the US. Better get out before it happens.

sturmblast,

It’s literally never going to happen.

mrcleanup,

Doesn’t mean they won’t try. Last time someone tried, the civil war happened. Lack of success doesn’t mean lack of associated problems or consequences. The real questions would be how far would they get and how bad would it get. Sure, there’s a good chance they would never actually try, but the chances they will aren’t zero.

sturmblast,

Pretty damn close to zero.

Mnemnosyne,

I’m vaguely curious, though not enough to go look it up, how issues of citizenship have been handled in other peaceful separations, like that of Czechoslovakia.

The answer I would find most reasonable, though not necessarily most likely, is to give everyone a certain amount of time to declare which citizenship they choose to retain.

doubletwist,

Per Wikipedia.

  • Czechoslovakia

On January 1, 1993, all Czechoslovak citizens automatically became citizens either of the Czech Republic or the Slovak Republic, based on their previous citizenship, permanent residence address, birthplace, family ties, job and other criteria. Additionally, people had one year’s time to claim the other citizenship under certain conditions.

I think things were a LOT uglier in the breakup of Yugoslavia, as well as the partition of India and Pakistan.

So it could go either way.

Maggoty,

Well that’s because Yugoslavia was an administrative hodgepodge of actual countries. Oh wait that’s not good Texas is home to several district cultural and regional identities. Okay but at least it’s not a religious thing right?

Fuck.

baseless_discourse,

Then we can just have the U.S.A. Union, which gives a unified visa, currency, and unified government.

doubletwist,

Like everything else, it’s a risk trade-off calculation. On the one hand, I’d love to leave now, but If we leave before 2029, it could cost us potentially $1-3million in teacher retirement pension. (spread across 20-30+ years as my wife can retire quite early because she started so young)

So one must balance the risk of Texas really seceding vs the financial cost of leaving early.

At this stage, while it’s a ‘fun’ (I use that term very loosely) thought experiment, I think the likelihood of Texas actually seceding is pretty low. If at some point it starts to look like it’s actually likely, then we’ll reevaluate if it makes sense to let go of that much money.

skulblaka,
@skulblaka@startrek.website avatar

If Texas actually leaves the union, they are no longer a part of the United States and will not be bound by American rule of law. Closed borders may be the least of your problems by that point. Keep your head on a swivel so that the point of no return doesn’t suddenly sail past you.

mrcleanup,

That’s a tough spot to be in, good luck to you.

CharlesDarwin,
@CharlesDarwin@lemmy.world avatar

It really sucks to think how many people may be held hostage in Gilead states just like you seem to be.

xantoxis,

You forgot one: We’re gonna invade the nation of Texas, because they have oil.

ThirdWorldOrder,

You mean bring them Freedom ™

baseless_discourse,

“Operation 1 Star Freedom”

CharlesDarwin,
@CharlesDarwin@lemmy.world avatar

Tell them we - the real America - will be keeping all the mineral rights, thanks. They can enjoy the going Galt without any of OUR resources, thankyouveryfuckingmuch.

FfaerieOxide,
FfaerieOxide avatar

At this point I think Biden needs to just call their bluff. He should come back with, “Okay, here’s all the plans we’ve drawn up to go into effect as soon as you ratify your secession.”

Then present the plans that include cessation of all federal subsidies to all public and private Texas entities, removal of all US military personnel and equipment, removal of all other federal agencies and personal (eg. Federal Border Patrol, Park rangers, IRS), removall...

Why the hell would Biden threaten to do any of that stuff 'after they leave' when leaving in the first place isn't legal?

He should tell them to shut their fucking saber-rattling mouths and if they don't stand down immediately have his buddies in the air force he still controls make the 888 mile trip from Cheyenne Mountain to the crater that formerly contained insurrectionists.

nucleative,

Something like this is why Brexit

LopensLeftArm,
@LopensLeftArm@sh.itjust.works avatar

General Sherman should’ve finished the job.

MonsiuerPatEBrown,

/queue Inevitable Betrayal smashcut

/starwipe to roll credits

lolcatnip,

*cue

Bartsbigbugbag,

Hmm some sort of crisis with the south nullifying federal laws. I wonder where we’ve seen that before?

Im only kidding, this isn’t really the same situation, but there’s definitely shades of gray shared.

Kbin_space_program,

Maybe more relation than you might think.
The southern border states rely on illegal immigration for cheap labour to suppress wages of citizens.

JimmyBigSausage,

Losers wanna lose again.

runswithjedi,

This is some insane logic. Wouldn’t this work both ways? Couldn’t the US say “sorry Texas, you seceded so your electoral college votes don’t count.”

CosmicTurtle,

"Not like that! I want all of the privilege but none of the responsibility. Why are you being so unreasonable?!"

  • Republicans
postmateDumbass,

ME? Take responsibility for MY actions?

Lol no. That’s a YOUR thing.

  • Also republicans
WashedOver,
@WashedOver@lemmy.ca avatar

Reminds me of Quebec. They wanted to separate from Canada but wanted to still use Canadian money and still have access to national Canadian programs.

It’s not a pick and choose situation as much as you like it. You’re either in the country and a part of it, or you’re not.

GiddyGap,

Britain is going through that regret right now after leaving the EU.

TheBat,
@TheBat@lemmy.world avatar

Brexit, Bregret, Brenter?

SpaceCowboy,
@SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca avatar

What got me was wanting to be able to continue to have Canadian Passports.

A lot of these movements are dominated be people that have a lot of pride in their region (which is fine) but don’t have a good grasp on international affairs to the point that they don’t actually understand what it means to be a country.

Anon819450514,

Stuff like that can be negotiated between parties.

hglman,

Plenty of autonomous regions around the world with these same kinds of arrangements.

VindictiveJudge,
@VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world avatar

They’d still be able to use Canadian money. There are eleven countries right now that use US currency as their official currency. The Canadian federal programs are right out, though.

CosmicTurtle,

Honestly, it’s the story of conservatives literally everywhere.

Conservatives in UK: We want all of the benefits of being in the EU but not pay as much into it as those other countries, use our own money.

EU: SIGH Fine!

(Later)

Conservatives in UK: We want out! We can’t stand the fact that non-white people can enter our country whenever they like. And we don’t want refuges.

EU: Fine!

(Later, after brexit)

Conservatives: why can’t we just travel to Europe like we used to?

CharlesDarwin,
@CharlesDarwin@lemmy.world avatar

They do this on the micro level all the time with that “sovereign citizen” horse manure - going on and on about their “rights”? What fucking rights? You declared yourself someone who is not a citizen of the United States?!

So if Texas were to secede, then cry that their electoral votes don’t count, that would just be the sovereign citizen BS writ large.

Powerpoint,

Conservatives don’t accept responsibility for anything but only want the privileges

FlyingSquid,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

You know what happens when theories are tested and found out to be false?

They’re no longer used.

Passerby6497,

Republicans: “Since when??”

corsicanguppy,

Ivermectin, creationism, abstinence policy on anything, trickle-down; were you thinking of any of those theories?

Tristaniopsis,

He’s got the US flag behind him, and he’s threatening to secede?!!

phoneymouse,

That flag doesn’t symbolize America. It symbolizes Merika.

Tristaniopsis,

Oh yes of course. Please forgive my ignorance of their blessed wisdom.

JimmyBigSausage,

🤣🤣

FlyingSquid,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

I mean his hero is a presidential candidate who is selling shirts that say ‘No Surrender’ under a photo of his mugshot, taken after he surrendered to the police.

Tristaniopsis,

Yeah but was volunteering to help out the police. Or something.

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