Related trivia: Back in the 50s "Unifon" was developed, which used phonetic characters for "spelling." Completely eliminates read/read issues.
And if you read (not read) what someone else wrote in their regional dialect (versus standard pronunciation), you experience what it's like to hear them - it comes out in THEIR accent/dialect.
Never really caught on, though Unicode does (mostly) support it.
It's interesting how style can come through as well. For example, on the page I linked there is the heading, "a phonetic alphabet for the 21st century", written in Unifon.
They have the initial "a" represented by "U" which is Unifon for "uh".
That's a common pronunciation, but as the article starting the phrase it feels awkward to me, and I would've written/spoken it with a long "a" (Unifon equilateral triangle).
@markusl
Given the inventor was American - and how US-centric we can be - that makes sense.
Randomness: I'm not much of a languages guy, but I've been nibbling around the edges of Japanese, and it's fascinating to delve into a language that uses non-English sounds AND a syllabary versus an alphabet.
Now you know my pain as someone from New Jersey, where that is three different words, living in the larger part of North America where that is the same word.
@markusl Someone in Ottawa, Canada, once did a big double take, because I pronounced her name ‘Karen’ like her mother from somewhere in Britain did.
It’s a very East Coast thing. I mean New York City, yes, but most of New York State, no.
My mother was from NYC and my father is from the West so both of them always sounded funny to me (once I developed the regional lingo). But my mother pronounced my name ‘Barry’ correctly and my dad not so much. More like ‘Berry’ but with a drawl. :)
@markusl (BTW, no, I did not grow up on the Shore, but mostly 30 miles inland of there. So I don’t mean you have to actually have your feet in the Atlantic!)
@dgar But while the past tense of "read" is "read", the past tense of "lead" is "led". There's also a "lead" which sounds exactly the same as "led", but that's not the past tense of "lead", it's a kind of metal.
@dgar And don't even get me started on
cough (a bovine animal that gives milk)
tough (also, or an indication of excess)
and
dough (what one does to one's cap to indicate subservience or respect)
@dgar
I before E except after C, except when your weird foreign neighbors Keith and Heidi seize the reins of their eight counterfeit heifer sleighs from feisty caffeinated weightlifters
One of the funniest things I ever saw was at a gig by an American band at Loughborough University, the singer constantly mangling the name of the place.
"Lufburra"
"Lowbro"
"Louwburr"
Welcome to Reading Station. Please ensure you have your books with you at all times. Any unattended books will be reported to the British Transport Police and may be destroyed with a controlled explosion.
@dgar for those of you aching to learn Finnish, "kuusi" means "a spruce", while "kuusi" means "six", while "kuusi" means "your moon". They are of course all pronounced the same: [ˈkuːs̠i]. Easy peasy!
@dgar I'm complaining about how hard it is to learn Japanese and two of my coworkers are openly mocking me based on how hard it is to learn English. They're all "japanese was EASY in comparison"
@dgar I don't envy transcription and term extraction software, which needs to understand that reading (a book) is really a very different concept to Reading, a town in Berkshire.
Reading a boring book about training is possible on the train to Reading to see the tunnel boring.
@james@dgar
And of course, if you were a bride on the way to her wedding, you might need help to lift your train onto the train. And worry about your carriage as you step into the carriage.
I pour some water in a trough
I sneeze and splutter, then I cough.
And with a rough hewn bough
My muddy paddy fields I plough.
Loaves of warm bread in a row
Crispy crusts and doughy dough.
Ow, my final duty to do
And then my chores will all be through.
My lament is finished, even though
Learning this word game is really slow.
It is so difficult, it's very rough
Learning English is really tough.
If a trough was a truff
And a plough was a pluff
If dough was duff
And though was thuff
If cough was cuff
And through was thruff
I would not pretend, or try to bluff,
But of OUGH I've had enough...
@dgar I love the ambiguity of that pronunciation guide! Fond memories of explaining style guides to journos (The producer would make a statement like your pronunciation guide and I'd have to go over as the sound guy and quietly explain the actual pronunciation to them without the producer hearing me.) English REALY IS HARD
@crunchysteve@dgar English /spelling/ is hard. English grammar is very easy and forgiving. Reasonably regular plurals, no case changes except personal pronouns, no gender except third person singular pronouns, no "formal" and "informal" differences in verbs...
@BunRab@crunchysteve@dgar of course I suppose it doesn't help all the things native speakers say "wrong" (due to regional dialects, etc). A coworker of mine in Hungary asked if she was hearing me correctly because it seemed to her i didn't ever say "Yes" ...she didn't hear the s...Then I realized I say "yep" (or yup) 99.9% of the time 🙂. Welp, gotta go
@crunchysteve@dgar my workmate saying words he has only read makes this clear heh. He luckily loves learning the correct way when we work out what he means :bloblaugh:
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