How do poor people in the states give birth without money?

I’m Canadian. And I’m already sorry for asking an ignorant question.

I know you have to pay for hospital visits in the states. I know lower economic status can come with lower access to birth control and sex education. But then, how do they afford to give birth? Do people ever avoid hospital visits because they don’t feel like they can’t afford it?

Do hospitals put people on a payment plan? Is it possible to give birth and not pay if you don’t have the means? How does it work in the states?

How does it all work?

Again. Canadian. And sorry.

BarrelAgedBoredom,

As a poor Florida resident who grew up and has known several people giving birth in poverty; if you’re lucky you qualify for WIC (women, infants, and children) which is essentially food stamps/ welfare for pregnant women and mothers. That covers food. If you qualify for WIC then you’re also eligible for Medicaid which is the US’ version of free* healthcare for people in poverty. That will cover pre and post natal care for the mother and baby. The baby is usually covered until they’re ~6. Unless you’re still poor by then, in which case it usually covers the child to adulthood or until their parents no longer qualify for Medicaid. Note that none of this covers diapers, clothes, or other necessities for the infant. Just food and drs visits. If you’re poor, but on the [benefits cliff](ncsl.org/…/introduction-to-benefits-cliffs-and-pu… you can get fucked lol. Murica

aidan,

To clarify, currently around ~40% of Americans have government funded insurance.

HerbalGamer,

5% increase since your other comment?

aidan,

My other comment was just Medicare/Medicaid. There’s also VA, and insurance for federal employees.

silicon_reverie,

… which is not to say that it’s free or even affordable (despite the name), or that residents in every state have equal access, or that the government is providing the plan. The ACA is a subsidy that slightly reduces the cost of private insurance, provided that you’re poor enough to qualify and that your state chooses to accept the federal government’s help beyond a certain threshold.

kleenbhole,

The number one reason for bankruptcy in the USA is due to medical debt.

We just go into debt, is your answer.

Volume,
@Volume@lemmy.world avatar

My first kid was born at 27 weeks, and would have ended up costing us 3mill if they weren’t on Medicaid due to being born so early. My second kid we were living in Canada (due to my job) and basically only cost us to park at the hospital.

Growing up in the US and living in Canada for a while, I genuinely don’t understand why Universal Healthcare isn’t fought for more. I know it’s talked about but holy fuck, it’s so much better in Canada.

To comment on OP’s actual question, I have no idea how people do it.

Ignisnex,

And some fucks in Alberta want the US system because “I never get sick! My taxes are paying for someone else to be sick!”

SCB,

Was poor, had a baby at 20. $6,000 hospital bill we paid in monthly installments of like $100

Paid off my kid being born when she was like 6 or 7 lol. Kind of like a car

art,
@art@lemmy.world avatar

Debt. Massive amounts of debt.

Vox,

me and my two brothers were at home births

_TheThunderWolf_,

why is no one else mentioning home birth??

Anticorp,

Once there’s a kid in the equation then it’s pretty easy to get on state paid insurance. It’s even easier now with so called Obamacare in the equation (Affordable Care Act). If you qualify, then you’ll have free neonatal care, free gyno visits, and free delivery and hospital services. It’s not great insurance, like you’ll be at the community hospital and not some swanky private birthing center, but it’s not bad either. Medi-Cal, the California state insurance is actually pretty good for child care and birthing services. They pay for hearing aids too, which only 3% of private insurances pay for. So medical care when you’re poor and have a kid is decent in the States. Now that there’s Obamacare it’s decent even without a kid. Where it falls short is if you’re under-insured as a middle class citizen, and it’s pretty easy to be uninsured, even with expensive plans.

Flabbergassed,

Vaginally

RBWells,

Mine were born at home with a midwife who did sliding scale pricing (charged based on your income). Only available to low risk women who lived close to the hospital though.

If you are quite poor, Medicaid will cover pregnancy and hospital birth expenses, even if you don’t otherwise qualify. I know someone who did that and said the nurse yelled at her because she wasn’t married.

punkwalrus,
@punkwalrus@lemmy.world avatar

I can answer this: my son was born in 1990. We were extremely poor.

We had midwives help us out as best they could, to the tune of about $3200 at the time. The birth got complicated due to a variety of health factors, and both my son and wife almost died (not because of the midwives). Luckily the midwives had a direct line to Georgetown Hospital, and the cesarean was done there. The total hospital bill was $58,000, or $138k in today’s money, although hospital costs have rose much higher vs inflation, so maybe it would be in the $200k range now. She was in the ICU for a week, hospital for another week, our son for about 3 weeks.

My wife job didn’t have health insurance, because it wasn’t required back then. Because she was gone a week, her job fired her for an unexcused absence. Oddly enough, this made her unemployed and Washington DC had some law (or rule or something) that immediately dropped the hospital bills because of her unemployment. In the end, we had to pay $15k to about two dozen practices who individually sued us, which took 7 years to pay off and a lot of court visits and wage garnishments. It financially ruined us, pretty much. Both suffered a lot afterwards because we just couldn’t afford minimal care. It was hellish. I can’t imagine how much worse it would be today. We got evicted from our apartment, and lived in government housing for six years.

So, yeah. Don’t have a baby in America unless you can guarantee it will be healthy and you have a lot of money. Most of my friends don’t have kids, they simply can’t afford it and look at it like the previous generation looked at concepts like summer homes and yachts. Nice luxuries, but way out of affordabilty.

Yerbouti,

Man… That is crazy. I’m so sorry for you guys.

dessimbelackis,

What the actual fuck, and this was in 1990

randon31415,

1990 was around the time of Hillary-care and Romney-care, so the politicians knew that they were going to have to fix it sooner or later by that point.

stewie3128,

Hillary’s plan was being developed and debated in '93-94, Romneycare in Massachusetts happened in 2006.

HunterBidensLapDog,
@HunterBidensLapDog@infosec.pub avatar

I’m sorry you and your family had to go through that.

I’m Canadian and I gladly pay more taxes than you so that I and my friends get free healthcare when we need it.

When we watched the fights over “Obamacare” we just shook our heads.

FlyingSquid,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

That’s the ridiculous thing. Americans would rather pay a few dollars less in taxes than let people have free healthcare. And it ends up costing them far more than they would have paid in taxes.

corsicanguppy,

I’m Canadian and I gladly pay more taxes than you so that I and my friends get free healthcare when we need it.

Here’s the thing. I worked in America for the better part of a decade and I had to submit two tax forms, one to each country. You end up paying the greater of the two and using it to offset the other.

What I know is this: every year, every year, I paid an extra 1% to America. No matter how my (binational) tax guys worked it, my obligation to America was always higher.

The year after I came home I still had to submit taxes (January layoff scares so I moved back) and it was still higher for America despite sitting in a different country (it’s a factor) and using different services. It didn’t matter.

In Canada I pay 1% lower income tax and enjoy healthcare access. While they’ve done away with the regional premiums, I was even okay paying that; as my yearly outlay, proudly at the top bracket, was still less than copays while in America. I would gladly pay the same premium to ensure equal access to dental and optical care for me and especially people who can’t drop (now) c$1000 on some specs or way more on a dental crown.

It’s not that I’m a good guy, but I pay taxes for schools because I don’t want to live around dumb people. I do and will pay taxes so we can take people who aren’t healthy and skilled and contributing income tax and make them so they are. Poverty should be no excuse for not being employable.

zik,

Wow. That’s horrible. The US health system sounds like a dystopian nightmare.

TheDoctorDonna,

And yet so many Canadians seem to want to dive head first in to a fully private healthcare system as if anyone could take that financial hit.

orrk,

meh Cannucks tend to adopt the worst of everything they see

TheDoctorDonna,

You spelled Canucks wrong and your broad generalization is insulting to millions of people, especially since the majority of us are smarter than that.

Poem_for_your_sprog,

Canned ducks?

TheDoctorDonna,

Yes.

namingthingsiseasy,

It doesn’t help that many of the governing bodies are deliberately sabotaging it as much as possible in order to push voters into that direction. Doug Ford is one of the most notorious in this respect, but there are plenty of others too

Anticorp,

Why didn’t you have taxpayer paid (State) insurance if you were extremely poor and expecting? Is it because of the lost job and timing? If you are poor and have a family then you can spend a day at the welfare office and get public insurance.

punkwalrus,
@punkwalrus@lemmy.world avatar

Because we made too much (over minimum wage, dual income household). I was making $13k as a sales manager, my wife was making $8k as an assistant manager, and minimum wage was $3.35/hr or just under $7k/year back then. After taxes, we made about $1200/mo, and our rent was $650 for a single bedroom apartment. No car, we took the bus, barely had enough for food and utilities.

But we were considered way too over the “poverty line,” which was I think less than $6k/year then. We had been using birth control but when they say some form of birth control is 99% effective, the DO mean 1% failed. I have no regrets our son was born, because it turned out we couldn’t have kids later when we tried. And then later my wife died when he was 22, so if we had kids later, I would have been a widow with younger kids.

I feel awful he grew up poor with us until he was about 10, though.

Anticorp,

Oof, yeah that’s rough. The poverty line is really low. I can relate about wishing you weren’t poor when your kid was a kid, we had the same experience. We would have been able to give him a lot more had he been born a decade later, but he still had a loving home, which is more than a lot of kids get.

I’m really sorry to hear about your wife. I can’t even imagine.

pg_sax_i_frage, (edited )

… “So, yeah. Don’t have a baby in America…”

for more on this subject, and in the spirit of looking on the bright side of s bad situation, see /c/childfree and childfree.cc. Includes talk, and memes, about some of the benefits, of not having children, including but not limited to finances. (also advice and directories about related options for medical things, where thise are wanted or needed).

Ookami38,

Bathtub. Car. Alleyway. Crippling debt that, while shouldn’t be impactful on credit score, will still follow you for your lifetime.

Ultraviolet,

Bankruptcy.

Rhoeri,
@Rhoeri@lemmy.world avatar

Simply.

They don’t pay the hospital bills.

Nurse_Robot,

“they don’t pay”

Yikes, real “us vs them” without any experience understanding or compassion, eh?

Nurse_Robot,

Downvotes without any replies? Yeah, that checks out.

jas0n,

Hi, I down voted you.

E: Twice, actually

Dkarma,

Wow u just made up all that in ur head…just …wow.

iheartneopets,

This is unfortunately true, though. A lot of people just don’t pay them, especially homeless people. How are they gonna get billed? They have no address and many don’t even have a phone. I’m not making a moral judgement, but it does happen very often.

Source: husband is an ER doc at a city hospital that serves most of the city’s homeless and below-poverty-line population where we live.

tocopherol,
@tocopherol@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

I understand the point you are trying to make, but I’m not sure what you are reading into? The question was “how do poor people in the states…” I am a poor person in the states, if I was to answer I would probably say they, maybe ‘we’ if I was feeling like sharing. And it’s true, many medical bills throughout my childhood that we couldn’t afford just went unpaid, with debt on my parents credit.

Treczoks,

Wait for them to repo the baby…

HootinNHollerin, (edited )
@HootinNHollerin@sh.itjust.works avatar

I told gf I don’t see how we can afford one kid yet alone the 3 she wants. And a house in SoCal. Then the family trips she imagines. I have a masters and 20 yrs experience in engineering. Seems like if I don’t get aggressive it’ll never happen. She doesn’t make much and when drunk said she just wants to be a stay at home mom.

Edit: I was just talking about general cost of how to afford, not insurance of birth costs. Also I guess it’s really 15 yrs since masters, I included prior jobs and internships. I’m almost 40. Under 150k.

stewie3128,

I live in SoCal and love it, and do not intend to have kids, but it really seems like you’d be struggling to raise 3 kids around here on less than $150k (2 cars, rent/mortgage, etc).

Obviously many people manage it somehow, but it must be incredibly stressful. I have no idea how most of them do it.

HootinNHollerin,
@HootinNHollerin@sh.itjust.works avatar

I’m convinced many have family money

Stumblinbear,
@Stumblinbear@pawb.social avatar

If you have a masters and 20 years of experience, you’re pretty much guaranteed to have a job that has the health insurance to pay for all of that. If you don’t, then you need a new job

xts,

Sure, maybe the hospital bills but raising 3 kids and going on vacations every year? You’re talking multi million dollar salary to be able to afford all of that on one income in SoCal of all places

Stumblinbear,
@Stumblinbear@pawb.social avatar

Then… Don’t live in SoCal?

Hoomod,

If they’ve got a masters and 20 years of experience they’re either a genius or almost 50 years old. Children are already a huge commitment, being older makes it that much harder

Stumblinbear,
@Stumblinbear@pawb.social avatar

I have 15 years of experience in software engineering, but that’s only because I started when I was 12. Experience is experience. Now, if they meant professional experience that’s a bit different

LUHG_HANI,
@LUHG_HANI@lemmy.world avatar

Generally it’d be professional experience.

HootinNHollerin,
@HootinNHollerin@sh.itjust.works avatar

Yea my bad on my comment, I was just talking about general cost of how to afford not insurance of birth costs. Also I guess it’s really 15 yrs since masters, I included prior jobs and internships.

Kage520,

Health insurance still leaves you with a large bill. Expect like $10k for the hospital part for a lot of insurances. Don’t forget the obgyn visits throughout the pregnancy (probably only $25-$75 per visit, depending on if you need a specialist). Labs are extra. In fact, the one that really tells a lot of info (lots of recessive gene issues can be found with it) is like a $750 lab that insurance doesn’t usually pay for (“it’s too new, and not required”).

Stumblinbear,
@Stumblinbear@pawb.social avatar

I had an 8k bill for a TIA I had last year. It’s a lot of money, but if you have a job that will cover most of your hospital bills, you can probably pay for it without drowning

To be clear, I’m not saying it’s a good system

lunarul,

I have 2 children. Insurance covered almost everything. The out of pocket expenses for the hospital were something like $700, not thousands. For doctor’s visits it was just the $20 co-pay for each visit, and all the labs were fully covered.

Kage520,

Good insurance! Our child born this year the hospital bill looks like around $8k after insurance, but we keep getting other bills from the provider’s offices so it’s hard to say exactly. Fortunately my wife has a secondary insurance of some sort we can submit the $8k to get that knocked down to hopefully $4k. If it works. It’s been months trying to get it sorted.

Feyr,

This year? Check out the no surprise bill (federal). Those extra bills might not be legal

ilovesatan,
@ilovesatan@lemmy.world avatar

Leave California and this all becomes possible with your salary.

betz24,

When he leaves California, he will leave his salary too (and possibly his industry too)

nucawysi,

not if its a remote job…

xts,

Remote doesn’t pay the same if you’re not in a HCOL area. Most jobs scale based on location

nucawysi,

Yea well where I live out of staters have been scamming their states and companies for years. I know a guy who works for the California educational system but lives here.

FlyingSquid,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

It will still be more affordable. We couldn’t afford to live in SoCal after my daughter was born. We moved back to Indiana where we grew up and, as awful as Indiana is in many ways, at least we could afford to buy a house.

electrogamerman,

Question to Americans, is it a secret way to make poor people not have children?

madcaesar,

No. The rich want poor people to crack out kids to fill up the military and create downward salary pressure on the working class.

Not to mention, being poor usually means poorly educated which means easily manipulated by the corporate media.

Everythingispenguins,

Shhh you aren’t supposed to let people in on the plan. Just think what would happen if they learned to read and saw this.

ByteJunk,
@ByteJunk@lemmy.world avatar

I assume you’re downvoted by someone who’s oblivious to the concept of sarcasm.

But I’ll add that even if they read this, we can always ban abortions so their whole life is fucked and they become good and obedient -slaves- workers

fne8w2ah,

That’s a steady supply of cannon fodder for a couple decades.

Kage520,

No I think it’s the opposite. They expect people to get pregnant and have kids (though with abortion and birth control that is happening less- hence targeting those recently). This is designed to make sure they stay poor so that the wage slave class stays well populated.

Ookami38,

If it is, it’s a bad one lol. Poor people tend to have more kids, just in general, and that doesn’t change in the states.

Stumblinbear,
@Stumblinbear@pawb.social avatar

Actually it’s easier to pay hospital bills when you’re poor. You either go to a non-profit hospital and ask for charity, where they’ll wipe your bill clean if you make too little, or you just don’t pay the bill. What’s bankruptcy if you’re too poor to have credit anyways?

electrogamerman,

what about a midde class person? someone that makes enough to be able to pay 20k, but meaning that would be their savings

Stumblinbear,
@Stumblinbear@pawb.social avatar

The actual middle class generally has a job that gives health insurance which will pay for it almost entirely. If you don’t, you’re probably not middle class unfortunately

orcrist,

You’re describing what people used to think “middle class” meant. These days, we all know that health insurance doesn’t cover nearly as much as you want it to. Costs have skyrocketed in the last few years, let alone decades.

Not_Alec_Baldwin,

While it’s a fact that the middle class is shrinking, I think you’re miscalibrated.

www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=463…

abcnews.go.com/Health/…/story?id=67131097

forbes.com/…/with-inflation-rising-medical-costs-…

Everythingispenguins,

You have never been poor have you? I can guarantee you that it is not that easy.

Having assets and credit are too very different things. And forcing some one in to poor credit can affect them for decades. Making it difficult or impossible to do simple things like have a bank or finding a place to rent. That is why it is called a cycle of poverty. Once you get the label of poor. It can be very hard to remove that label even if you are hardworking and have a stable job. Live become more expensive making it even harder to get out of poverty.

Plus if you think bankruptcy is an easy or quick process. I hope you never have to go through it.

Stumblinbear,
@Stumblinbear@pawb.social avatar

I have been poor if you consider making 15k a year for five years and having to live with three other people to make ends meet poor. Also, I was being somewhat facetious.

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