At another #Oxford event "How can we build the sustainable economy?' with Dieter Helm & Dimitri Zenghelis" let's see if this steps out of the pointless #mainstreaming path of the last 3 events #oxfordmartinschool
My question led to a very reactionary answer on social actavisam, a complete dismissal of #mainstreaming politics and a clear democratic rejection of #dotcons billionaires.
The is no agency for the needed change challenge he argues for, a bureaucratic plan with no path to implement it. Very #Oxford
Interesting to hear the #MOD view of the Russian Ukrainian war... As you would expect it's very #mainstreaming and pushing a strong rightwing view. Good to see this side as balance. No thinking on #climatechaos over the next 10-20 years in any long term thinking expressed.
Under capitalism (and neoliberalism is extreme capitalism) everything has a price, and thus must be paid for. In general, waterways are "commons" thus do not have prices for meany things, or are cross subsidized by meany stakeholders. Over the last 40 years we have tried (and often failed) to bring this "price logic" to enclose the water "commons" this is going through a new wave in the UK lead by #CRT and #mainstreaming thinking.
The current media coverage of tribal struggles in the Middle East is fraught with complexities and contradictions. The situation in the West Bank and Gaza, with Israel's establishment of settlements and the resulting occupation, is a source of intense debate and contention.
As highlighted by Ms. Pillay in her statement, successive Israeli governments have ignored international law by creating settlements and transferring Israeli civilians into the West Bank and Gaza. This has, in essence, established facts on the ground, which are aimed at securing permanent Israeli control. Occupations resulting from unlawful armed attacks are distinct disputes, allowing the occupied state to legally exercise its right to self-defence under Article 51 of the UN Charter to recover its territory.
The 1947 UN declaration, which is foundational to understanding the conflict. It underscores the legal aspects of the situation and the potential rights and claims of both parties involved. In this context, Hamas, as the governing authority in Gaza, has a legal right to use military force to liberate their illegally occupied land, based on UN resolutions. The heart of the matter lies in the interpretation and application of international law and resolutions.
The media's role in disseminating information and providing a comprehensive view of these complexities is crucial. However, #mainstreaming media falls short of its mission to tell the "truth." Instead, they often mix facts with biased narratives, creating confusion and misinterpretation among their audiences. To address this issue and build a path toward peace, it is imperative that the media focuses on presenting the facts clearly and objectively, as laid out in UN statements and actions. This means refraining from propagating falsehoods or favouring one side over the other. The historical context, and the UN's involvement, can serve as a useful resource for those seeking to understand the intricacies of the Middle East conflict.
In summary, untangling the web of Middle East conflicts, particularly the Israeli-Palestinian struggle, necessitates a commitment to truth and accuracy in media coverage. By adhering to the principles and resolutions of international bodies like the UN, we can hope to achieve a clearer understanding and, ultimately, work towards a just and lasting peace in the region.
A simple view of the current mess making in our media coverage of the tribal struggles in the Middle East.
“By ignoring international law in establishing or facilitating the establishment of settlements, and directly or indirectly transferring Israeli civilians into these settlements, successive Israel governments have set facts on the ground to ensure permanent Israeli control in the West Bank,” said Ms. Pillay. https://news.un.org/en/story/2022/10/1129722
Our #mainstreaming media coverage is mixing this simple story with lies and propaganda. In this they are obviously failing in its self-declared mission of telling the “truth”.
Yes we have way too much mess, and yes nobody in this is black and white good or bad, let’s try and stop our media adding mess to this, and please try to keep the simple clear truth of the above UN statements and actions and build a peace FROM THIS.
So I think we have to actually experience an approach or a tool before we can say if it is “fluffy” or “spiky”, or works in a mess.
Yep, best to build tools/process from “lived expirence”. We are swimming in a river of social shit with the #mainstreaming of neo-liberalism and postmodernism that is the bases of “thinking”. Thou these ideology died years ago, the zombies of both are still eating our social brains.
Also that whatever process people use, it needs to work in the mess.
In tech outreach work using the hashtag #geekproblem to highlight the “need for control” that is a clear block and not a solution to the very human mess we are in. We need to build structers/code where we “lose” control of our current #mainstreaming agenders and take “control” by building bridges and holding these human bridges in place, so we can choose different paths.
You’re also saying that the “spiky” approach to governance has more value for our society.
The #mainstreaming agender always supports the #fluffy aproch and pushes down the #spiky aproch so its less a question of right/wrong more a question of holding the balance agenst this #mainstreaming pushing. The balance is where maximum power lies. So yes in this forum, and in general, the “spiky” aproch has more “power” than the fluffy aproch simple because its is repressed by the mainstream and meany of the “common sense” fluffy crew.
@rooftopaxx the problem is the is nothing kollectiva as well, its a problem with the coding of this #openweb reboot, its fading as it goes #mainstreaming this is not a surprise thus the thinking about shutting down, only have so much focus.
#mainstreaming people bring alternative people down to their level, which is vile with the current 40 years of mess making. You can't talk to them about this, so likely it's best to just ignore them? What do you think we should do?
The problem we face on the #fediverse is the "shouting into the void" that the #mainstreaming brings with it. This is affecting all new social networks, the signal to noise is degrading everyone's #openweb experience. I think in part this is a failure of copying #dotcons that we need to move past soon #OMN#OGB#makeinghistory#indymediaback
The first part is about democracy, the second part is hard politics, and is more nasty.
The #fedivers was booted up on grassroot #openweb passion and crowed funding, it was sustained in the early growth by crowed funding and expanded (in an often not helpful way) by #geekproblem passion. Over the last 2 years we have seen this shift sharply to “institutional” funding, some of this has been behind the seanes “think-tanks/academia” but over the last years the #EU though #NGI and more specifically #NGIzero have taken a central role in funding just about all fedivers #mainstreaming projects and much background technology.
In this, we have moved from meany 1000’s of people shaping the direction in a radically #4opens transparent way to handfuls of people controlling the levers of influence in a more opaque process. This is a clear and very obvues failing of #openweb governance, kinda normal and very obvuesly fail.
Now the wider #NGI project pour funding directly down the drain, which is a normal outcome so not an issue for us as the money is wasted anyway. #NGIzero are doing good, they are funding grassroots #openweb technology, so they are people we should work with.
How do we start to mediate this issue “In this we have moved from meany 1000’s of people shaping the direction in a transparent way to handfuls of people controlling the levers of influence in a more opaque process” And more importantly rebalance the #mainstreaming agenda that flows with this funding https://unite.openworlds.info/Open-Media-Network/4opens/wiki/Funding-of-openweb-projects this second part is a BIG problem, this first part is about democracy, the second part is hard politics, and is more nasty.
Take a moment to think about basics: activism/campaigning is about building resistance to the mainstream to change its flow in progressive directions. Were #mainstreaming is about shifting activism to reduce these resistances to the mainstream flow. Thus, it’s good to understand that #mainstreming is a #NGO agender to build the jobs of the people involved and is in turn funded to this end. Good not to get the shit mixed up.
Lifestyle is a way of forming a tribe inside this mainstream flow. The problem for activism is that this old school tribalism is obviously a BLOCK on social change, as looking and talking right are MORE important than being right. Being right would be “resistance” and lifestyle is about going with the counter flow.
On the other hand, the are advantages to “modern” tribal and lifestyle activism – it functions as social glue to hold campaigns together and provides a “uniform” flag to rally round. You notice I do not use words like anarchist, socialist, liberalism here as these have a different role in social change thinking – they are the ideas – the clothing is what I am taking about #fashernista is the hashtag.
#Revolution is about blowing up the flow of the mainstream so it floods into a different path, with much “calcollateral” damage in the process as we live inside a highly urban complex society. Both paths can be useful, both have costs.
There will be lots of VERY bad behaver from the every side in this #openweb reboot, let’s try and keep diversity of voices in place with #4opens process. Please don’t become a prat, as it’s easy to start, and it’s hard to stop, mess and more mess.
Prat ish behaver comes in waves, that matches the waves of #mainstreaming and the Alt reaction to them, this flotsam can make things messy so good to shovel and compost.
Our main #blocking in alts is from our blinded #postmodernists and the culture they have spread for the last ten years… this is very messy and will do damage. As this is a form of “common sense” it’s hard to compost.
@evan it's what it is, I like grassroots and DIY and am not a fan of #mainstreaming mess making, think we tip into this from now on, this is both good and bad, my view do better at holding #DIY culture and #openweb neticate in place while outreaching to #mainstreaming
#mainstreaming and #geekproblem are not positive terms in my personal estimation.
But I guess it depends on personal stance ;)
The #geekproblem to me (also a programmer) is where tech-obsessives build almost for the sake of building, do not consider the repercussions of their work and end up making shit worse.
E.g. the 'like' button
#mainstreaming is more obvious. While it is sometimes nice to feel part of something big, it's where diversity goes to die.