Can we please remember to talk about things on the fediverse besides the fediverse itself?

Having spent a lot of time on Mastodon... There are tons of people there talking about federated and self-hosted services, software freedom, censorship, encryption, tech regulation... A very narrow range of topics directly surrounding the fediverse get a lot of attention.

But nobody talks about anything else. Nobody goes to Instagram to talk about Instagram, nobody goes to Tiktok to talk about Tiktok, nobody goes to Facebook (at all). People use social media to either talk to their friends or talk about their hobbies and interests.

And if your hobby is tech, that's fine, enjoy. I like tech too. But please, if you have anything else to say, say it. The fediverse will never appeal to the masses if we don't embrace a wide variety of hobbies and interests.

We need people here talking about cooking. We need people here talking about fashion. We need people here talking about immigration policy. We need people here talking about everything people enjoy!

Yes, if you go to /m/fashion right now, it's... barely there. You're not going to get a ton of conversation when you post there. But that's not the point. The point is to build out the community, so that, a year from now, as more and more people attempt to post and engage, there is a conversation. There's a reason to be on the fediverse besides the meta circlejerk over how great the fediverse could be in theory.

This is the "content" people are craving. Find or start a magazine for your city, or your town, or your country. Write a post. Share posts from your favorite blogs. Comment on something, if you have anything to say at all. Share a youtube video—yes, a youtube video, I know, youtube sucks, but at least it gives us a path to a community here.

OpenStars,
OpenStars avatar

You are missing the point that while you are free to do as you please, others also enjoy that same freedom. I don't WANT to make posts about fashion, cooking, politics, or non-techie things, but if you do, then by all means, please do that? Be the change that you would like to see in the world, and all that? I hope you find your bliss.

While I am at it though, "nobody talks about anything else" is objectively false - it is a "feels like" statement that falls prey to the hyperbolic fallacy that your POV is the only one that matters. In point of fact though, there are TONS of such discussions happening, right now, all across the Fediverse! Granted, probably not at the frequency that you want, or perhaps not as easily discoverable as you wanted. Have you considered that Reddit or Twitter or Facebook etc. may legit serve your needs better at the moment, and that's okay too?

For fantastic artwork here though, check out magazines such as m/digitalart@lemmy.world, or here's a post sharing a youtube video with nice music. For cooking, I see THOUSANDS of members making THOUSANDS of comments across MANY different places: here's a comprehensive list of those across all of kbin.social - e.g. m/food has 2243 members and 2209 posts, and m/food@behaw.org has >1k comments (looks like concentrated mostly in a few posts such as https://kbin.social/m/food@beehaw.org/t/71429/What-do-you-eat-that-other-people-think-is-odd). Surely people might even talk about politics here, a tiny bit?:-P

And now we both are breaking your rule: discussing things about the fediverse. This place is for those with an early-adopter mindset: we don't have daddy spez over here "taking care of us", so we must build our own things. Thus, we often resort to talking about actions that involve that process - which I for one don't think is a bad thing? It makes us better, to have these civil conversations about how to make things better moving forward! Although I think your post is poorly written, using inflationary emotional language that misses several points. Even so, I am absolutely LOVING how the comment section here isn't full of harassers saying things like "U SUK", but instead people offering constructive feedback, both positive and negative. To me, THAT is the difference between this place vs. Reddit that makes me enjoy being here more than there. Even though, admittedly yes, it does have FAR less content, and it is all of a biased nature (towards the topics that we here enjoy posting about).

danhakimi,
danhakimi avatar

I don't WANT to make posts about fashion, cooking, politics, or non-techie things, but if you do, then by all means, please do that?

I didn't ask you to do those things, specifically. What kinds of hobbies do you have? Talk about those. If your topics are all tech-focused, that's fine, keep talking about those, but I'm really hoping I see people here talk more about pomeranians and nail polish, even though I'm not into either, because those topics will engage people who are into those things.

And now we both are breaking your rule: discussing things about the fediverse.

I think you misread my post. I did not say people should not talk about the fediverse, I just think we should post about other things, too. Especially if we want to see the fediverse succeed, we need more than just the meta-conversation.

OpenStars,
OpenStars avatar

I do actually:-)

Although the statement that:

nobody talks about anything else

is a direct quote from your post. We ARE talking about other things, just again, perhaps not at the frequency that you would like, or it being as discoverable as you would like.

I did not like how you worded your post, as if we were not, when we ARE - and I gave examples of that happening, thousands and thousands and thousands of times all across the fediverse.

If you want to take responsibility for the exact words that you said that may have mislead people into thinking that you are a Karen who is telling people what they "need" to do, then I offered my feedback in case that would be helpful. Fwiw, I do think you had a point, buried in there somewhere, I just think it is hard to find b/c your post had so many objectively false statements - "feels like" wording that if I stretch out really hard I could maybe guess at what you might have meant? (but which if you are honest with yourself, I hope you can see are factually incorrect)

And mixed in along with the false statements are the extremely obvious ones like:

People use social media to either talk to their friends or talk about their hobbies and interests.

I mean... yeah?

Admittedly, yes fashion does seem to be a neglected topic, but you cannot force people to create content for your amusement? Maybe make a post on Reddit about this place, targeted to fashion enthusiasts and gently advise them that this place exists too if they would want to come here? Or start posting there yourself, every single day and maybe multiple times a day, to help attract other like-minded individuals?

Also, why pick on fashion, but then add on cooking, as if it is the same - isn't that cherry-picking your details? Also:

We need people here talking about immigration policy.

But again, WE ARE - here's an article that is not even 20 minutes old yet.

TLDR: your post came across as telling others what to do, while not wanting to lead by example and actually do any of it yourself. Why not DO IT, rather than ask for all that work to be simply done for you? Again, I have no idea what thoughts were in your head as you wrote that, I'm simply saying that this is how your words strike me. Especially the statements that are outright falsehoods.

But if you are not interested in knowing the effects of your words on others, then I am sorry to have bothered you. Fwiw, I do think you meant well.

Deathsauce,
Deathsauce avatar

Some folks really don't understand they can absolutely get what they want out of the fediverse, they're that accustomed to the limits of the more mainstream options. It's whatever they want it to be. If you're tired of not seeing enough of something, there's nothing stopping you from creating your own instance or a community within a pre-existing instance and rallying others to engage. You're always bound to find someone with a few similar interests around.

It will never grow or change if nobody is willing to directly participate in what they wish to see grow or change.

nicetriangle,
nicetriangle avatar

deleted_by_author

    •
    danhakimi,
    danhakimi avatar

    A ton of the artists I follow on IG

    You missed my point. They're not on IG to bitch about IG, they're on IG to talk about art and they're bitching about IG on the side. They're ostensibly there to share their art, and that's why you follow them, right?

    And yeah, some people go there to teach you how to be an influencer, but we're all aware that they irredeemably suck.

    moopet,
    moopet avatar

    In my experience which is worth one (1) datapoint, people talk about all sorts of stuff.

    Yes, people do talk about the fediverse as part of it, but usually it's about how we can make it better rather than how our corporate overlords have made it worse.

    And I'd say that fediverse metacontent is less than 1% of my feed, so it's not universal, it's very much down to how you set things up.

    Places like kbin will get more because they're newer. I'm not on Threads or Blue sky or whatever but I imagine a lot of the chat there is about their own shiny new thing as well.

    nicetriangle,
    nicetriangle avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    danhakimi,
    danhakimi avatar

    I don't think most people who are new to the fediverse really want to see three dozen threads about the fediverse as they scroll. I couldn't possibly convince somebody to join the fediverse to talk about fashion, because there's nobody here talking about fashion, it's like going to a baseball stadium to talk about library science.

    People are going to Threads instead. When I point out how shitty Threads is and how people should use Mastodon instead, they say, "you're right! Threads is shitty! I'm gonna go use threads." Because threads is a social network and mastodon is a theory.

    Angry_Maple,

    Hi, I have been both people. When I was new, I actually really enjoyed learning about it. I sometimes learn a hell of a lot more from forums than I do from just searching it up. Now that I am more experienced, I enjoy sharing that information to help other new people understand. I was a beginner once too, you know?

    If you want to go to another platform, I won’t judge you for it. This might not be the right fit at the moment, and that’s OK. I would follow that other person’s advice and check out other communities too, if you like it here otherwise. Maybe you’ll run into more people who share the same interests, and people who may also want to create and grow those communities.

    Please remember that this is still a relatively new platform, and that it will take a lot of time to get it where you (and many of us) want it to be. It’s the kind of thing that you can not rush without destroying.

    It’s also not fun seeing people complain about the lack of posts or effort to increase the community, only for those same people to flip and then essentially say that it’s pointless for them to even try. If everyone who loves a community thinks that way, that community will never grow. That’s what they meant by “be the change you want to see”.

    The best, and most guaranteed way to fail is to give up before you start.

    spaduf,
    @spaduf@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

    For folks who agree with this sentiment, on Mastodon at least you can set up a temporary filter for fediverse stuff to have it all hidden. Not sure what your options are on Lemmy except maybe leave the fediverse subs like this. It would be nice to have a temporary mute feature for communities so you wouldn’t have to remember to resub after the drama-of-the-week has died down

    HR_Pufnstuf,

    Well, we’ve all be dying to talk about your mom… but were worried you’d have a problem with that. Thank you for your blessing. :)

    ;)

    dingus,
    @dingus@lemmy.ml avatar

    Well, no. But I do believe corporations rob us of our dignity

    While this is a silly joke from a cartoon bear making fun of the Unabomber…

    He’s not wrong about independence. Most people have become wholly dependent on corporations doing things for them, and they are completely lost without it.

    That includes me and you and many others. I don’t grow my own food. I don’t slaughter my own animals. I don’t roast my own coffee beans. It would actually be very difficult to achieve that kind of independence in the modern world without a lot of startup capital to take care of yourself “off grid” or whatever. Time, money, effort, and lots of it, to be truly “independent.”

    When it comes to modern tech, a lot of people have grown up knowing nothing but mobile apps. They don’t know what the World Wide Web is or how apps generally track more data and have stricter control over what a user can or can’t do. The second it stops working, people are dependent on it working, so they seek out another app that does the same thing, they don’t look for ways to fix the thing that stopped working.

    The modern world has us in many ways trapped by own lack of knowledge. Many people default to just giving up instead of seeking out more knowledge and understanding.

    Due to the ever-so-slightly complicated nature of the Fediverse, which requires an individual to be able to “visualize” a world where various servers are connected in aggregate, and even that visualization requires a basic understanding of how the internet and “clients” and “servers” work.

    Just like growing your own food, learning to be independent online via technology takes time, effort, and money. Things a lot of people don’t have tons of in spare supply.

    Ergo, by and large, the people who will populate the Fediverse will primarily be the tech-oriented, because most other regular ass people just don’t have it in them to even try. That’s fine, I am not writing this in judgment of the people who struggle with technology and lack independence from corporations. However, it explains the vast difference in sign-ups for Threads and Bluesky, both corporate solutions, and the Fediverse, a community-driven solution. Most people just don’t give a shit and will go for the easy, slick, corporate route because they already have enough stress and stuff to think about in their life, they’re not looking for one more thing they have to grapple with, and that is totally fine.

    This is not to say I disagree with anything you said, I wholeheartedly agree! I think the hyper-focus on technology will (for a while anyway) hold the Fediverse back in terms of being interesting to other people with other interests outside of technology. I have been trying to post politics and news articles and get involved in discussion, but what an individual can do only goes so far, we need more people with interests beyond just tech who are willing to become “content creators” or at least “content aggregators.”

    garrett,
    @garrett@infosec.pub avatar

    If someone’s got a good community for cooking, lemme know. I’m interested.

    danhakimi,
    danhakimi avatar

    @foodporn isn't bad. Not really a cooking community, but active.

    cacheson,
    cacheson avatar

    People on the threadiverse only talk about 196.

    gonzo0815,

    Well, judging from the top posts on /all we are techies, nerds and anarchists. What would we know about fashion?

    adonis,
    adonis avatar

    I think, this might be due to the currently ongoing federation issues.

    I too see mostly fediverse, nostupidquestions stuff in my feed, but once the dust settles, and a better suggestion algorithm comes into pleace, I'm sure the feed will be much more diverse than now.

    kippidashira,
    kippidashira avatar

    I don't think you can really stop these types of topics from getting popular, because it's the crowd that the Fediverse attracts unfortunately. I tried to refer friends but the Fediverse system is too unnecessary for their needs and I respect that. Unless there's some way to simplify the entire concept, or ways for newcomers to be easily onboarded, I fear all of this is going to fall into the same niche hole as the Linux community.

    Deathsauce,
    Deathsauce avatar

    I've noticed a few other Max Headroom AVIs on my Kbin browsing journeys, so I want to create a community that actively encourages and promotes using Max as your avatar in some form or another. The broadcast hijacker counts too.

    billothekid2,
    billothekid2 avatar

    I was just thinking the same!

    Deathsauce,
    Deathsauce avatar

    MORE OF US

    HeartyBeast,
    HeartyBeast avatar

    The irony of this post is palpable.

    osarusan,
    osarusan avatar

    Complaining in m/fediverse that people are talking about the fediverse...

    danhakimi,
    danhakimi avatar

    This post is not a complaint. It's a reminder.

    TwilightVulpine,

    I would like to talk about indie games. Is there a good place for that?

    Nepenthe,
    Nepenthe avatar

    If not the more general subs, there's an indie community both on kbin.social and also lemmy.world. Both pretty small atm, but that's the point in building them up

    general_kitten,

    Be the change you want to see, start posting about things you want to see here.

    danhakimi,
    danhakimi avatar

    I did and I have, here and on mastodon, but I can't affect this change alone.

    HeinousTugboat,

    Of the top 10 posts currently on my front page, 2 are about the Fediverse, 1 is about Kbin specifically, and the other 7 are completely different topics including politics, space, video games and art.

    Maybe you should look for magazines/communities other than /m/fediverse if you want to talk about things other than the fediverse.

    danhakimi,
    danhakimi avatar

    Of the top 10 posts currently on my front page, 2 are about the Fediverse, 1 is about Kbin specifically, and the other 7 are completely different topics including politics, space, video games and art.

    Is this on /all? I did see some non-fediverse posts there, but like... a few of them were specifically from @196, which... the name of that magazine is an obscure reference to an inside joke from reddit, and the content is basically just, what if there was a second @memes. It's not pulling people in.

    I did see one cool post about Persian Rugs, though, I liked that.

    Maybe you should look for magazines/communities other than /m/fediverse if you want to talk about things other than the fediverse.

    I've spent a lot of time there, scrolling through them and searching for the ones I want. And it's not that the ones I want don't exist, but nobody posts or comments there. I posted to some of them, but there's no conversation to be had. I commented where I could, but I'm afraid half of those people signed in for a day and then left when nothing was happening.

    HeinousTugboat,

    Is this on /all?

    No, this was on /sub, and I've been aggressively curating my subscriptions and blocking things I don't have any interest in.

    Even looking now on /all with incognito, though, there's only 2 even about Lemmy. I do see a few from 196. There's posts about atheism, random tips from @youshouldknow, a Cosplayer, quite a few memes and shitposts, some political content about Florida, a nice flower, movie news, a couple antiwork posts, an article about a new Alzheimer's drug.

    It's just not all about the Fediverse. Is it a popular topic? Hell yeah it is, especially considering Threads literally released yesterday, and the API blocks from Reddit are just now rolling out. It's not just popular, it's timely and current too. As those things age, it'll come up less.

    I'm afraid half of those people signed in for a day and then left when nothing was happening.

    I mean, sure. There's been days where I haunted Kbin/Lemmy then left. But currently, there's very little else that fills the gap of Reddit beyond this. So I keep coming back, and I keep talking. That's how it grows.

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