One thing the #Fediverse is missing is a #Groups functionality. Public groups, private groups.
So many people have told me: "I can't leave Facebook because my [knitting/school/yoga/…] group only uses #Facebook to communicate. Sub-#Reddits are groups. #Discord are groups. Group chat on #WhatsApp or #FacebookMessenger. We need groups on the Fediverse!
Well, good news: people are working on them! And it's apparently fucking difficult. But they are making progress!
@leighms Those are good first steps, but a lot is missing:
A group should be able to include people from any server, so it should federate
Last time I checked, Firefish's private groups were only for chatting.
Any member of a group can post a message in a group by tagging the group or clicking Post on the group's page. And then other members can reply to that post, just like when posting outside of a group
Public group should still be able to restrict posting to members only
We really need to work on that if we want the Fediverse to take over! Most people around me aren't interested in posting to a public timeline. It feels like screaming into the void. They want groups! Which is why they still use Facebook or #Reddit or #Discord.
@narF@leighms oh, and we also need more Fedi projects using EVENTS! They are in the ActivityPub protocol but used by only a few Fedi projects at this stage.
Oh, one Fedi project that is doing BOTH of these but it's looking like it's still just in testing, is #Smithereen which is being developed by a former VKontacte & Telegram employee, definitely one to watch.
I think this will be one of the features that will make a big difference to whichever system implements it.
Although to be really effective it would need some geo-info. No point in me posting an event that will only be of interest to folk in Broxtowe, Stapleford and Long Eaton.
I understand that many folk would be horrified at the notion of including geo-info. It should be absolutely optional.
Smithereen events are a subtype of group. You probably aren't familiar with VKontakte which I'm copying, but Facebook events are close enough to this too.
@grishka@narF@leighms I know VKontacte and I'm an old user of LiveJournal. Have been watching developments in this space for a very long time. Can't work out how to search on Smithereen but assumed that isn't possible yet?
@kudra@narF@leighms
The search field is in the header. You can search for users and groups, and also load objects from other servers by pasting URLs in there. Hashtags aren't implemented nor planned — they don't fit into my vision of a place where you stay up to date on your friends' lives.
@grishka@narF@leighms cool! I lived for many years without hashtags, if you have free text search they aren't strictly necessary anyway, especially if it's not microblogging where space is limited.
@kudra@narF@leighms nope, I don't intend to have text search either. I'm against any kind of global post search because, again, my vision is that you aren't supposed to be exposed to content from people you don't know. For the same reason there will never be the ability to post as a group, like there is in VK and Facebook.
@grishka@narF@leighms ah, OK, maybe a bit more like LiveJournal then? They never implemented search (at least not while I was still paying attention) , though they did allow searching by interests early on, which I think at the time was fairly innovative. I do like being able to follow hashtags here in Fedi though, and appreciate seeing things I wouldn't otherwise, which is a lot like being able to search interests.
@grishka@narF@leighms never mind, I just logged in again, I was sure it wasn't visible when I first explored but I can see it now (I am using mobile) =)
@leighms Oh and of course, groups should work even for people who are using different software. I should be able to join a group on Lemmy from Firefish or Mastodon. And I should have the same access that members on the host server have. Currently it's not always possible, and in most cases, the UI is severely limited.
I will never stop beating this drum. I barely used it before it went to the Google Graveyard, but Plus was the only one that handled this in a way that worked for my 🧠.
@narF
Like if "Lists" were public. Or, like if you were making a "Groups" feature by starting from the "Lists" feature and using "circle of friends" as the UX metaphor overall.
I liked it because circle of friends was already a natural way to talk about it. I also liked thinking of my social graph as working a bit like a Venn Diagram.
Also, I'm an Old and online groups makes me think newsgroups and IRC channels.
"Circles" and "Hangouts" were both pretty good UX metaphors for their platforms.
@narF
Also, IIRC, you could have your own Circles that weren't shared or public or whatever it was called, that only you saw, as a way of organizing your contacts.
Arguably two distinct features, but it felt natural to think of both as circles. Again, if I'm remembering correctly how it worked. It was a while back.
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