adamjcook, to TeslaMotors

This is a lie. is lying here.

At no time, are vehicles capable of “driving themselves” - only capable of the illusion that they are, which Musk exploits.

This is a common Musk Lie, made in the interest of selling Tesla vehicles and pricey add-ons.

People have died under this lie and will continue to do so, completely avoidably.

Let’s explore the underlying foundations of this lie and why it is so dangerous.

🧵

adamjcook,

Now, let’s look at the underlying part.

and -equipped vehicles are Level 2-capable vehicles - with the exact same limitations as many other vehicles on the market today.

Namely, the key limitation is that the human driver must remain the fallback for any dynamic driving task or vehicle failures at all times and under all conditions.

Effectively, that means that the human has the exact same control responsibilities between the two vehicles shown below.

adamjcook, to random

A missed opportunity, in my view, to discuss how ’s somewhat recent entry into the systems space is really the far more pressing issue here.

Hand-waving systems safety yields enormous cost savings (far more than is typically expected) and is corrosive to a modern society in ways that courts could never rectify once sufficiently lost.

https://www.businessinsider.com/venture-capital-big-tech-antitrust-predatory-pricing-uber-wework-bird-2023-7

adamjcook,

has an odd power.

People today cannot really remember a time when everyday products would readily kill or maim. So, having lost those experiences over the decades, Silicon Valley increasingly saw a business opportunity.

But modern society is grounded on the public’s trust and, given enough critical mass, trust can be virtually lost overnight.

Quite literally.

That is Great Depression stuff right there, folks.

CrackedWindscreen, to random
@CrackedWindscreen@mastodon.online avatar

My word there are suddenly a lot of Automatic Emergency Brake experts, I suppose they needed something to do after being the submarine experts and the AI experts.

All that I have seen are amply demonstrating they know tap all about AEB.

adamjcook,

@CrackedWindscreen Tragic.

Really.

Indeed. These incidents require an exhaustive root cause analysis... which is, as you know, very rarely performed.

But the knee-jerk "just sprinkle a little automation on it" is a absolute Cancer of Simplicity that has zero foundation.

There are immense downsides to automation that are very vague.

adamjcook, to cars

Let's talk about vehicles equipped with a bit - a Level 3-capable vehicle that has been recently "approved" in a handful of US states.

This article almost entirely focuses on the legal dynamics of consumer liability should this vehicle create a direct (or, presumably, an indirect) incident.

But, as always, I want to talk about what I feel are the realities at work here and the many foot-guns that are associated with that.

https://www.autonews.com/mobility-report/mercedes-drive-pilot-automated-system-poses-legal-questions

🧵👇

lolgop, to random
@lolgop@journa.host avatar

He broke the site, came up with a lie to explain why it's broke and the press was like, "Makes total sense!" https://www.reuters.com/business/media-telecom/musks-twitter-rate-limits-could-undermine-new-ceo-ad-experts-say-2023-07-03/

adamjcook,

@lolgop Constantly. Constantly this is done.

It is beyond exhausting.

And it has actually proved to be extraordinarily dangerous when lies about the capabilities and availability of 's product, in particular.

The press often allows Wall Street analysts, that are not competent in systems, to advance Musk's dangerous lies.

The community has been battling this for years.

adamjcook, (edited ) to chicago

I was at Pride all weekend while visiting with my wife (videos and photos soon!), so I missed this Drama concerning that erupted.

Ok.

Let us, again, all put on our hats and take a look at the situation here as I understand it.

Below is the video that kicked the beehive between Tesla defenders and detractors on "what really happened?".

This clearly chaotic video was taken from a larger drive sequence in which FSD Beta was active.

🧵👇

adamjcook,

I suppose that I should also note that no system can ever be "perfectly safe".

That is not possible

And the concept of "perfection" is not relevant to systems safety.

Ross submits that "at no time was anybody at any risk of crashing".

No.

There is always risk!

is about maintaining processes such that always-present, finite risk is continuously and exhaustively identified and managed.

It is about appreciating that risk exists - the opposite of what Ross submits.

CrackedWindscreen, to random
@CrackedWindscreen@mastodon.online avatar

Well this led me down a rabbit hole.
Headline is older Aussie drivers don't trust ADAS and how to get them too.
By checking just the first few cited research papers where 'the clear safety benefits' have been shown, you find they DO NOT do that. Surprise, surprise.
They use a lot of "could", "can" and "should". Because they don't know. Because there is no proof.

And legislation is being written on the back of these. FFS.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2214140523000828

adamjcook,

@CrackedWindscreen Bingo. You nailed it!

Anytime someone or something uses the term "I think", "could be" or similar and then makes some sort of assessment... you can toss it right in the trash.

Systems safety is about constantly and exhaustively asking pointed questions and seeking quantifiable answers.

Academic and industry research can be used to be develop a safety case, but it is not at all complete by itself.

BruceMirken, to random
@BruceMirken@mas.to avatar
adamjcook,

@BruceMirken This is the same Bad Faith shit that us in the community have been dealing with on the and wrongdoings for years.

I am not going to lecture Dr. Hotez on how to deal with this... but I can say this... the strategy on the -side and of his sycophants is to passionately pretend like they want to have a Good Faith debate... but they are just looking for "gotcha soundbites".

adamjcook, to random

@kentindell and @CrackedWindscreen,

Let me just say this for the record and for what it is worth, 's Jim Farley is worrying the hell out of me lately in terms of .

And I think something really objectionable could be brewing there.

The way he is talking... I recognize this. This talk is familiar to me. I remember it at when I was there many moons ago.

I am watching the layoff reporting at Ford very carefully, to the extent that I can.

adamjcook, (edited ) to tesla

This is a good piece, but the one small nit that I have again is bringing in a "data argument".

I know that it is tempting for an audience that is generally not at all experienced in systems, but I would highly recommend resisting it.

In fact, there is no could be higher.

It is our obligation to assume that the "crash rate" of 's product is unquantifiably higher.

The sky is the limit.

https://prospect.org/justice/06-13-2023-elon-musk-tesla-self-driving-bloodbath/

🧵👇

adamjcook,

Efficiently and reliably extracting "safety data" from the roadway is a non-starter.

It simply cannot be done.

Why?

Because the only "safety data" that actually matters for this conversation is "data" that is forensically extracted from all interactions with a -active vehicle - both direct and indirect interactions.

No one has that.

Not even close.

Not even .

Zero chance.

Numbers on a page are not important to .

The root causes are!

adamjcook, to reddit

Really thinking of just dropping , for what it is worth.

Dropped my profile off my Mastodon bio.

Reddit management is giving me serious vibes lately and I have been getting follow spammed 4-5 times daily for the last two weeks.

Met a lot of great technical and experts on there though - mostly through pushing back against 's and wrongdoings.

I suppose that work continues here now...

adamjcook, to random

Oh memories.

Taking a break from 's Hate Train on the Hellsite to recall this series of Tweets from a few years ago.

While under-appreciated then and now, the Tweet thread by Musk posted below contains an extremely damning admission and it displays the considerable blind spot associated with remotely updating systems without oversight.

Musk has no clue what he admitted to here, but systems safety experts do.

adamjcook,

First off, are not smartphones.

I cannot say that enough.

And if you hear anyone describing them as such, it almost certainly means that they are (knowingly or not) hand-waving away the incomparable differences between a consumer electronic device and a system.

That makes reports like this on 's hiring preferences very concerning: https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2021/05/14/tesla-apple-tech/

jbenjamint, to random
@jbenjamint@mastodon.scot avatar

Hasn't taken long for some actual facts to be published in response to Rowan Atkinson's Guardian opinion piece from the weekend.

gift link: https://wapo.st/3oTQCU0

Fyi @ottocrat

adamjcook,

@jbenjamint @ottocrat The other thing routinely left out of these conversations is lifecycle “emissions” (negative externalities) through the potential complication of via .

This “fact check” opinion article may be more on point than the opinion article it is responding to (and so believe that it is), but such pieces are, as usual forgetting of the larger, complex system at work here.

Systems atop systems. These pieces at least need to make a nod to it, in my view.

CrackedWindscreen, to random
@CrackedWindscreen@mastodon.online avatar

Just seen a clip of Jim Farley talking on the Fully Charged show (would not normally watch it) and he explains how OEMs have no clue about software and built a business on no having a clue, which has made things "tricky" for them. Also, that they STILL have no clue about software. Quite enlightening.

adamjcook,

@CrackedWindscreen The problem is... and I am not at all convinced Farley recognizes it (or wishes to admit it based on, potentially, feedback from its internal teams)... that today's consumer software demands cannot have a safety foundation under it.

That is the "tricky" part.

That is the part that many automakers likely cannot square internally.

I would have to toss all of my experience in the garbage to satisfy today's auto consumer.

adamjcook,

@serichards @CrackedWindscreen @kentindell It is the "unseen" issues after an OTA update is applied (in a system as massively-complex as a car) that concern me.

And one of the chief avenues where unseen issues creep in is when Configuration Management (CM) becomes impractical.

We already know that completely hand-waves away CM, because admitted it not too long ago.

When I saw this Tweet, as a engineer, my jaw hit the floor.

Musk has no idea what he admitted to.

adamjcook, (edited ) to random

Hmm. Interesting article.

@samabuelsamid, who I generally agree with, offers some thoughts.

@mimsical, who I also generally agree with, is mentioned in passing.

And, well, I have typically agreed less with Timothy Lee's thoughts over the years (particularly on -related topics), but this article is reasonable enough.

But let's crack it open and take a look at a few things that I think are iffy.

🧵👇

https://www.understandingai.org/p/the-death-of-self-driving-cars-is

adamjcook, (edited )

Hmm. Going to throw up some flags here. This needs a perspective.

Firstly, there is no value (ultimately, the only thing that matters) in "criticizing" and (or, at least without criticizing, say, the at the same time)...

They are operating under a complete and deliberate lack of regulatory scrutiny that should be in place, but is not in place.

adamjcook,

Have they "improved"?

How do we know?

How is "improved" defined?

See where I am going here?

is not about appearances or YouTube videos or press releases or expanded service areas or the lack of "bad news reports" or numbers on a page.

It is about constantly asking questions and receiving quantifiable answers of system reliability.

adamjcook, to random

No, because "flying cars" have never remotely made financial sense - particularly with the concerns which are almost always hand-waved away by the startups.

https://www.crainsdetroit.com/manufacturing/does-detroit-city-airport-have-future-flying-cars

adamjcook,

Competent experts knew better that they would not, though.

Because, exactly like I mentioned in the first Toot, no one and no firm has ever offered a remotely convincing safety case to realize a viable Level 5-capable vehicle.

A Level 5-capable vehicle has an effectively unbounded Operational Design Domain (ODD).

Such an expansive ODD would undoubtedly require a validation strategy that would rely on an unquantifiable number of breakthroughs.

adamjcook, to ai

So, a couple of things here.

Firstly, we seem to be in some sort of arms race in " safety statements" nowadays.

Or more like a race to the bottom.

The continued perpetuation of the actually harmful Train aside... what is even the point of this?

They did not even bother to write a letter.

Secondly, very hard to take this statement seriously given that personalities like , Sam Harris, Chris Anderson and Grimes have signed it.

https://www.safe.ai/statement-on-ai-risk

adamjcook,

@PeceK All of this said, while the few names I highlighted do not seem to have the "technical chops" at understanding these technologies... almost every single signatory to these various letters stayed silent (or applauded) while:

  1. and Andrej were engaged in these wrongdoings; and/or
  2. While Musk sent his cult to attack Professor Missy Cummings, a top researcher, who first raised these issues years ago.

There is some real hypocrisy here.

adamjcook, (edited ) to random

For the millionth time… editors, the and … a vehicle is, at no time, capable of “self-driving”.

There is no “self-driving mode”.

Publishing these terms and descriptions only serve to advance Tesla’s and ’s lies and are an immense public safety hazard.

https://www.mlive.com/news/muskegon/2023/05/michigan-woman-hospitalized-after-self-driving-tesla-crashes-into-tree.html

adamjcook,

Presumably, the individual in the article activated .

Yes, I understand what the full name of that product is called, but there is no need to expand it.

Do not assist and in their lies.

Additionally, I would argue that it is an ethical responsibility to note that these vehicles are not capable of “driving themselves”, at the very least.

The community has spent years publishing open content on these matters.

Gotta pay attention.

CrackedWindscreen, to random
@CrackedWindscreen@mastodon.online avatar

Interesting how some automotive outlets are reporting the Tesla leak as either a "huge date leak" OR "data shows big problems with Autopilot and FSD", but not both.

adamjcook,

@CrackedWindscreen Honestly, I am not sure that I have ever seen any reporting (in a major publication) that really digs down deep into the core issue here - flimsy and non-existent safety processes at .

Some competent experts tapped by some publications are given space to make nods to it, but really not enough space.

I mean… the lack of a process at Tesla is clear… that definitively means that Tesla is doing nothing to understand their own system.

adamjcook, (edited ) to random

First, the ... perhaps now the Files?

, a prominent business publication, has obtained a considerable amount of internal Tesla files that may point to and vehicle concerns that were possibly hidden by Tesla.

Apparently, Handelsblatt is releasing reports on these files in stages.

I will be watching this space... probably to add comments after more is publicly released.

https://jalopnik.com/whistleblower-drops-100-gigabytes-of-tesla-secrets-to-g-1850476542

adamjcook,

A "culture of secrecy" with the traits cited are a ubiquitous sign, in the systems space, that a firm is engaged in willful wrongdoings.

A canary in the coal mine, if you will.

experts and myself have spent years on Twitter, Reddit and, now, the Fediverse attempting to detail 's observable wrongdoings.

Those are ultimately opinions though.

If Tesla was hiding actual defects and/or lying to safety regulators - various criminal charges are in play.

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