jonny, to bluesky
@jonny@social.coop avatar

OK even funnier than #bluesky / #ATProtocol 's plc DID method relying on a single domain is that the hardcoded DID for bsky.app isn't registered, they don't even use it for the default algorithms and just hardcode a workaround.

WHICH MEANS that whoever finds a (truncated) hash collision for the bsky.app DID will cause an absolute fucking mess hahhahaahhaah

trying to resolve the DID for bsky.app against plc.directory fails, "DID not registered"
Check if the feed url is one of the local algos, and if it is, just call the localAlgo function rather than resolving the DID

atomicpoet, to random
@atomicpoet@atomicpoet.org avatar

More Bluesky users understand that the success of Bluesky is not a sure thing, and now that Meta is joining the Fediverse, this is going to be a real fight between ActivityPub and AT protocol.

darnell,
@darnell@one.darnell.one avatar

@atomicpoet I suspect that // took a hard look at / & saw how complicated it was, & decided to go with instead. The latter technology is at least more mature & developed.

But with embracing the , it’s going to make ActivityPub the gold standard for decentralization.

jonny, to random
@jonny@neuromatch.social avatar

If I am ever feeling imposter syndrome and start doubting my ability to write a protocol, I can always take a look at , whose protocol is just this, a vague example of some JSON message object, and then a zillion nonbinding "enhancement possibilities" with no pretense at consistency.

idk why people are excited about this (ok, i do, everything in cryptobro universe is like this), it's literally just a traditional client-server architecture with the phrase "censorship resilient" stapled on top of it.

jonny,
@jonny@neuromatch.social avatar

i think it's very funny when ppl are like 'this thing is very decentralized' but the governance of that thing is literally a git repository with completely undefined processes for how and who gets to make a change to the thing.

like i know decentralization is basically meaningless but one would hope that it could still mean "not centralized to a single point" but i guess as I learned yesterday with 's placeholder DID method that resolves by quering a single domain, i guess not.

jonny, to bluesky
@jonny@social.coop avatar

lmao taking a look at / 's implementation of , and I think they missed the "decentralized" part in their "placeholder" DID method.

Your domain's DNS entries just contain a (truncated) hash that then has to be resolved at plc.directory

recall that the DID method (plc) is part of the DID, so a different method (eg. web) is a different DID. to switch, you'd need to set an alsoKnownAs entry. plc only supports AT handles for alsoKnownAs.

https://github.com/bluesky-social/did-method-plc#did-resolution

jonny,
@jonny@social.coop avatar

/ is an extremely funny protocol that is explicitly designed to ensure that there are still powerful entities that own your attention. Sure! you can host your own personal data store, but everyone else will be getting your posts through a Big Graph Service that necessarily crawl all posts on the network, so it's actually mostly irrelevant.

https://blueskyweb.xyz/blog/5-5-2023-federation-architecture

theintercept, to random
@theintercept@journa.host avatar

Who owns Bluesky? What’s the role of former Twitter CEO Jack Dorsey? What’s Bluesky’s business model? And what prevents another Elon Musk from buying and destroying it 10 years down the line?

@micahflee answers some of your Bluesky questions. https://theintercept.com/2023/06/01/bluesky-owner-twitter-elon-musk/

FinchHaven,

@micahflee

"I think one big difference with atproto decentralization vs. Mastodon is that atproto is one huge flat network graph"

Host names and IP addresses for the top ten instances currently online and active, please

Oh

There aren't any

There is no decentralization

It's a marketing / PR play

Period

Compare and contrast:

https://fedidb.org/network

cc @vegetarianzombie @DemocracySpot @Mastodon

mastodonmigration, to climate
@mastodonmigration@mastodon.online avatar

Not sure how to say this delicately, but...

...since starting @ClimateMigration yesterday, the vast majority of Followers are from outside the US. Understand this is not a fun subject, but the disparity in attention to this topic is pretty striking.

FinchHaven,

@mastodonmigration

From what I've read of it, "controlling your algorithms" is you getting to choose radio buttons from a list of canned topics or you get a couple fields to enter keywords into, give it a name, save it, and it's "yours"

It's a / PR play

It is not going to make anyone into a coder bro, or give anyone the control of a coder bro, no matter how much the Bluesky fanbois suggest it will

@koteisaev @ClimateMigration

sharearea, to bluesky

90% of all threads will include :

  • Someone aggressively chastising you from a weird, obscure instance for even trying it

  • Some thirsty person you don't know asking for an code

  • A tech boi (with a account usually under 1 year old) mansplaining the differences between and

  • Someone dropping their BlueSky pagelink with no explanation on why they want you to follow them

  • Someone reminding the thread that anywhere is better than

Imoptimal, to internet
@Imoptimal@mastodon.social avatar

And you call this newsworthy?!

There's virtually no difference between 's and 's approach to feeding you with crap.

https://www.theverge.com/2023/5/26/23739174/bluesky-custom-feeds-algorithms-twitter-alternative

FinchHaven,

@Imoptimal

The only difference is that and and the seem to be farming out algo content and legal liabilities to unknown/unnamed third parties

While and are still trapped with it in-house

tommi, to fediverse
@tommi@pan.rent avatar

I am on Bluesky now!

Intrigued by the AT Protocol and glad to be there.

Not that I am changing my mind about the superiority of the , but as long as technology is , I am happy to be testing it.

Thanks so much for the invite, @rabble!

JimSwift, to random

I know Elon sucks. Anyone have any good suggestions for a Twitter porting service so Tweets (or BlueSky) posts can be cross posted?

ASP, (edited )
@ASP@masto.ai avatar

@Djromero @JimSwift

I will add some corresponding hashtags

and knowledgeable folks @atomicpoet @tchambers @activitypubblueskybridge

as well as some other media personalities who seem to be posting on multiple platform quite successfully

@juddlegum @atrupar @ChrisO_wiki
@w7voa @timkmak

Maybe this way someone with more knowledge can jump in and help

Jeremiah, to fediverse
@Jeremiah@alpaca.gold avatar

The only thing I love about Bluesky / AT Protocol is the use of subdomains for user names.

The double-@ is confusing as heck to people, but a link that also works as a mention name is obvious / intuitable (eg "Find me at jeremiahlee.bsky.social which makes me mentionable @jeremiahlee.bsky.social").

It's probably too late to fix this in the , but I wish we might try.

strypey, to fediverse

The real sticking point in implementing portable accounts/ nomadic identity in the ActivityPub branch of the - like what Zot and AT Protocol offer - is its implications for how moderation works.

"The hard part however, is the social one: we collectively need to agree that the identity resolution layer is infrastructure and not somewhere moderation actions should take place."

https://shadowfacts.net/2023/activitypub-portable-identity/

codesmith, to bluesky

Whether it's or , I just do not understand how anyone can possibly give them the benefit of the doubt when it comes to their intentions with federated networking. Like, it's not like the internet is new. We have countless examples of what billionaires do with their power. They never try to make things better for us. They always try to accumulate profit for them at the expense of anyone else. How many times do people need to be fucked over before they learn?

FinchHaven,

@codesmith

This is fast becoming boilerplate:

Embrace.

Extend.

Extinguish.

Do those words mean anything to people?

Why does anyone think anything about / and are going to suddenly become good Samaritans in the world?

mattjbones, to fediverse
@mattjbones@mastodon.social avatar

Will we get adapters / relays for and maybe in the future? Anyone working on it? Sure Bluesky is VC backed etc but once they start down the journey of federation it feels like it could help reduce the “oh you’re oh BlueSky, sorry I can’t see your chat on Masto”

andypiper,
@andypiper@macaw.social avatar

@mattjbones there’s already SkyBridge that is doing the Mastodon API translation to enable cross-posting, I think. I’m unsure about the appetite it at the federation level. Potentially worth checking in on the efforts to see if is part of their thinking.

stefan, to internet
@stefan@stefanbohacek.online avatar

I wonder if people threatening to block Facebook's/Meta's new ActivityPub-compatible social media network also automatically block emails coming from gmail.com.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Criticism_of_Google

FinchHaven,

@stefan

"But again, what are the alternatives? I'd personally rather have them embrace ActivityPub than AT/Nostr."

One alternative would be for people to stop fluffing / and at every opportunity

Which has been pretty epidemic lately

Zuckerberg can have the

Let Zuck and Dorsey fight it out over who's doing what to whom and for what reason

tchambers, to activitypubblueskybridge

This week's is some of the folks I'm watching closely on the discussion and development work on bridging and

@snarfed.org
@ramsey
@profcarroll
@anildash
@erlend
@Hamishcampbell

And many others in this Mastodon-compatible Frendica group focused on developing that interoperable bridge:

@activitypubblueskybridge

raccoon, to bluesky

🧵 [1 / 12]

's latest blogpost [1] reveals that the is a classic bait and switch game, facilitated by the small-world/big-world distinction. [2]

The bait is telling creators that their content is safe (from petty moderators/server shutdown) and that they are not locked into a platform because the AT protocol is federated, so they can self host with a handle under their control. The switch is that the (federated aspect of the) AT Protocol is irrelevant in the big-world.

WXFanatic, to opensource

Apparently there's some hostility coming from the ActivityPub side of things about BlueSky? If true (I haven't seen it yet), that would be very disheartening to hear. This should be a collaboration and an acceptance to federation, not a competition.

A really good read from the Matrix dev about how AT and Matrix have similarities.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35886140

unattributed, to internet

Sam's take on fundamental problems with the design and implementation of the & . @fediversenews

RE: https://urbanists.social/users/sam/statuses/110342847589273918

austinha, to fediverse
@austinha@mastodon.social avatar

i’ve been thinking about and am going to use this as the start of an ad hoc thread about identity and account portability.

here’s where i think i’ll land:
1️⃣ the Conventional Wisdom conflates features with AP.
2️⃣ the Conventional Wisdom is that AP guarantees a , which it does not.
3️⃣🔥 and a hot take, as a treat: is currently doing better work building the system that most AP advocates think is being built here.

atomicpoet, to internet
@atomicpoet@mastodon.social avatar

What will be the tangible difference between the BGS that is making for AT protocol and a really well-connected relay operated with ?

The more I think about it, the more I don’t know.

darnell,
@darnell@one.darnell.one avatar

@atomicpoet Is it me, or does appear unnecessarily complex‽ At least for the foundational aspect of what is trying to do‽ might not be advanced, but it’s simple enough for the average non-tech person to understand (even if they do not understand the “how” of the ).

Reminds me of a scene from :

https://youtu.be/MCbXhsXYkPM

Dustin4, to internet

I know the /AT devs & Dorsey (mostly Dorsey) keep saying that “Bluesky” is essentially a proof of concept and will (if all works according to plan) cease to exist once blossoms.

But…

I don’t believe that. I feel the OG server & native clients will be cemented and always be somewhat of a default.

Dustin4,

The protocol creator shares their thoughts on

https://fiatjaf.com/ab1127fb.html

uniquitous, to internet

I've been doing some research on , nothing too deep. It piques my interest that they're trying to stand up an entire new federated protocol rather than just use (or even extend) ActivityPub. Not only does this make them incompatible with the Fediverse, it stands them in opposition to it with their own Fediverse-of-one. Remains to be seen if they'll be the VHS or the Betamax of this war.

rolle,
@rolle@mementomori.social avatar

@uniquitous @RogueLodge @hakirsch Here's the direct answer: https://github.com/bluesky-social/atproto/issues/255#issuecomment-1287953987

Yes, they want more control. I personally think portability is just an excuse. I'm not holding my breath about them allowing people to 100% install BlueSky on their server, it's against their business model.

About the meta discussion, he's right about being "suspicious of Bluesky". They haven't given much reason not to be.

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