tchambers

@tchambers@indieweb.social

Technologist, writer, admin of indieweb.social. Fascinated by how new politics impacts technology and vice versa. #fedi22 #indieweb #fediverse

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emc2, to Facebook

ITT: contingent theory on / and the

TL;DR, they're hoping to beat to the punch through M&A activity. I ruminated a bit on this in a previous thread.

If true, I do not think this is a serious threat to the FediVerse, certainly not an existential threat. It doesn't even imply any sort of carpetbagging/EEE/de-inventing strategy for .

I'll lay out my case in more detail now.

tchambers,

@athenian_empire @emc2 True - smaller or single user servers should really tie into mastodon relays for content discovery.

tchambers,

@athenian_empire @emc2 Yes, they do. There seem to be three relays open to new users that are well run and scale to almost all of the fediverse.

laurenshof, to random

this seems relevant

tchambers,

@laurenshof Great: If true one more reason not to pemptively Defederate…we will have 3 months to see what they are up to. No need to block as a first strike as they are not federating for 3 months.

mariyadelano, to Russia
@mariyadelano@hachyderm.io avatar

I AM AWAKE LET’S CATCH UP ON THE NEWS

tchambers,

@mariyadelano 👀

evan, to random
@evan@cosocial.ca avatar

@dmitri have you met @tchambers ?

tchambers, (edited )

@evan Not yet: but great to virtually meet you, ‪@dmitri‬ 👍 see some work I’ve been doing rallying development on a test suite….

@activitypubtestsuite

mastodonmigration, to Futurology
@mastodonmigration@mastodon.online avatar

Subject: What's going on with Meta?

To: @Gargron, @ruud, @jerry, @supernovae, @stux, @trumpet, @kev and other large instance admins

Rumors are tearing this place apart out here about secret deals with . The latest is that Meta has held meetings with some of you and they will federate with large instances under contracts providing financial support (1) (2).

This is a time for leadership, not silence. Please, what's going on?

(1) https://mastodon.ar.al/@aral/110598855375585873
(2) https://mastodon.social/@alexeheath/110596207691212890

tchambers,

@mjf_pro @Jessicascott09 @jerry @hachyderm

Thank you!

tchambers, to RedditMigration

The Fediverse, and the lead off tonight’s episode and it covers it well… https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-vergecast/id430333725?i=1000618074926

ErikJonker, to Ukraine Dutch
@ErikJonker@mastodon.social avatar

Big question for Ukraine, how should they take advantage of the developing situation in Russia? Doing nothing not to distract from the infighting or increase the offensive? 🤔

tchambers,

@ErikJonker If I were them I would take advantage of a window that might not last long. (Who knows?)

atomicpoet, to random

Here’s why I don’t put a whole lot of stock in the idea that Google is entirely to blame for XMPP’s fall in popularity.

What were XMPP’s competitors?

There was ICQ. It’s dead.

Also, AIM. It’s dead too.

As for MSN Messenger, YIM, iChat? Dead! Dead! Dead!

I have no doubt that if XMPP were a proprietary product, it would be dead too. Or “extinguished” as the EEE worryworts like to say.

But XMPP is actually alive. It’s not as popular as it once was, but it’s alive. You can start up an XMPP server right now.

There’s even a version of the Fediverse that works over XMPP, instead of ActivityPub, known as Mov.im. You can sign up and use it right now.

Proprietary competitors didn’t kill XMPP. Rather, XMPP outlasted them all.

As for why XMPP isn’t more popular? There’s many reasons. XMPP is largely based on XML, and that language isn’t so popular amongst coders anymore. And this, there’s not as much impetus for developers to improve XMPP.

But also, chat has evolved. Even in the open source world, people would rather use something else. Everyone I know in the open source world rather use Matrix instead of XMPP.

While open protocols tend to persist, that doesn’t mean something else doesn’t come around to overtake it in popularity.

IRC was once incredibly popular too. You could argue it still is since Twitch uses it for text chat. But most people don’t use clients like mIRC or Chatzilla anymore.

Why is that? Because once upon a time, XMPP overtook IRC in popularity, just as Matrix has overtook XMPP right now.

Don’t entirely blame Google. Such is the way of technology.

tchambers,

@atomicpoet Did you read the quote on XMPP from a Hacker News chat on why XMPP died and SMPTP didn't? It's half way down here:

https://www.timothychambers.net/2023/06/23/project-and-the.html

J12t, to Futurology
@J12t@social.coop avatar

Who needs embrace and extend if:

users will be able " ... to import existing account info and posts from other servers, meaning someone could, say, move all their content from into Meta's app."

https://mastodon.social/@alexeheath/110596226686316769

tchambers,

@J12t Not sure that was as supreise to me of a feature. They will do the same from IG into Threads.

Will be very curious if they allow the reverse to Mastodon.

I assume not...but they do offer IG account data export now. (granted not your your social graph)... So will be watching. https://help.instagram.com/181231772500920

tchambers,

@jdp23 @J12t -I'd say wait and see, then judge. I expected it would have seamless onboarding from IG as reported & figured the same from Mastodon (or other platforms too) and I doubt they will support full export of social graph. But if they only do partial --- akin to what IG does now in exporting data, we can work with that and make up for what's missing.

And he "build better than" ASSUMES they do the proprietary tricks, which we work around & compete on things they can't or won't do.

tchambers,

@jdp23 we can do

  • and will need to - that with or without mass federation with P92.
J12t, to Futurology
@J12t@social.coop avatar

And here you have it what I’ve been saying all along:

“ is hoping for at least 10s of millions of users within the first few months” for their Twitter competitor

The and will be a small minority show within months.

Assuming they can do it, but getting 1% of Instagram users if they promote it from within Instagram? Sounds very doable.

https://www.theverge.com/2023/6/23/23771599/command-line-musk-versus-zuckerberg

tchambers,

@J12t As I have been pointing out too …the “Embrace” of ActivityPub is coming regardless of if existing Fedi did preemptive blocking or not. We have to fortify against the “Extend” risks.

tchambers,

@J12t @Octarine Getting pretty strong developer support now (both ActivityPub and Bluesky is where all the action is) goal is to keep that going and rev it up further. At the mobile app level, at the different fediverse server open source levels, and at design and UX....

atomicpoet, (edited ) to random

Actually, Internet Explorer 6 was once 97% of the browser market. That’s right, 97%—they had the browser market locked down!

If ever there was a situation where “embrace, extend, extinguish” (EEE) should have worked, it was with the open web.

Yet Microsoft failed. Why is that?

First, while Microsoft initially was installed by default on every Mac, they had neglected the Mac version of Internet Explorer. So Apple took action and made their own browser—Safari. They shipped this in 2003.

But also, Microsoft refused to build a version of Internet Explorer for Linux. This forced Linux advocates to build their own web browser engines, most prominently KHTML. Apple forked KHTML into WebKit, which was then used as Safari’s browser engine.

Thereafter Netscape rose from the ashes as Mozilla, released Firefox. And Firefox not only caused tabs to go mainstream, but also extensions too.

And where was Microsoft while all this was happening? Resting on their laurels, content with the belief that EEE would work. They never improved IE6. As all the other browsers came out, IE6 looked more and more worse.

But still, they had the corporations using it, so there was no fire in Microsoft to improve IE6.

The final nail in the coffin was Chrome. Corporations were willing to make the leap to Chrome because Google built backwards compatibility for IE6 with Chrome.

Microsoft tried to recover with subsequent versions of Internet Explorer. But they eventually discontinued it and released a new browser called Edge.

Nevertheless, Microsoft never achieved browser dominance again even with installing edge as the default browser on Windows.

Microsoft failed to the open web. It wasn’t the open web that was extinguished. It was Internet Explorer.

RE: https://mstdn.social/users/kkarhan/statuses/110596178591569135

tchambers,

@atomicpoet These are all great examples.

rvaweather, to RVA

Generally looking drier tomorrow with only spotty showers/storms in the afternoon/evening; highs in the low 80s from to .

tchambers,

@rvaweather FYI, haven't said this before but super-glad you are on the fediverse. Makes up for what i used to have with Cap Weather Gang on Twitter.

tchambers, (edited ) to Russia

Whatever is going on right now in #Russia, I do note this: #Twitter is now useless at tracking this. Junk accounts everywhere, no verified accounts, swarms of sketchy bluechecks.

The ONE thing that place was good at was breaking global news. But not now.

See everyone here tonight.

tchambers,

@nanoelquant There is using an official website, Wikipedia Gravaratar, medium account or Flipboard account you own to verify you…. https://spreadmastodon.org/utilities/verify-account

tchambers, to kbin

Web visits to top 5 and servers over last 30 days...

tchambers,

@liaizon My team uses a number of tools but this one is from SimliarWeb.

https://www.similarweb.com/corp/research/

tchambers,

@jdp23 @liaizon It is purely web traffic writ large analyzed....

hariette, to ArtemisApp

First milestone in roadmap accomplished! We got a handful of alpha testers using 🥳

Next week is ironing it out before we start our incremental rollout to our testers.

image/png

tchambers,

@hariette Check this out @dansup 👆

shoq, to random
@shoq@mastodon.social avatar

Incoming!
https://github.com/bluesky-social/proposals

https://blueskyweb.xyz/blog/6-23-2023-moderation-proposals

cc @atomicpoet @tchambers @mekkaokereke @ben @davidslifka @davetroy @rogermcnamee
@Green_Footballs

tchambers,

@shoq @atomicpoet @mekkaokereke @ben @davidslifka @davetroy @rogermcnamee @Green_Footballs

BTW it does look like one Bluesky BSG server admin will be able to "fediblock" users or content from any, all BSG' servers if they violate local server rules..
Just got a "likely yes" to a question I had on that.

loshmi, to Futurology
@loshmi@social.coop avatar

All this conversation about on feels like the worst parts of geek culture. So technical, without understanding context or what strikes can actually do. My thoughts:

Meta will make a great app for Fedi because it has more money to throw at the task. People will start using that because it's better. It will have QTs and an algorithm. People they want to follow will be there.

🧵1/6

tchambers,

@loshmi I do not see it doing anything to make it harder for them to develop Activity
Pub, and zero to stop …. In one day they will have all the ActivityPub users to dwarf ours.

dpp, to random

I've been working on an ActivityPub/Mastodon server.

Not surprisingly, I'm doing it in Scala and Lift ;-) https://github.com/what-cheer/netop

As a starting point, I'm porting the Wildebeest https://github.com/cloudflare/wildebeest/ code from TypeScript to Scala.

But I found that TypeScript is far more concise than Scala, especially for JSON-related stuff.

tchambers,

@dpp Some of us working on an ActivtyPub test suite here. Very formative but could use thought on what would be helpful to developers such as yourself: follow this group: @activitypubtestsuite

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